re: Army Picks Sig Sauer's P320 Handgun to Replace M9 Service Pistol

The Beretta was a turd. Outdated and to me a weird feeling pistol. Sig makes a outstanding pistol. Happy for the Army doggies.

Sigs are the shite.

I drunkenly picked up a p320 at a banquet auction, and it's a pretty sweet little gun.

quote:

---

1) what will be the standard "ball" 9mm?
115gr or 135 or something else?

2) the modular req is straight up money wasting BS
so they are going to carry swap out barrels and mags?
that will never be a feature that will come in to actual practice
can argue the external safety till the cows come home, it is what it is

3) are there/is there any other service currently under contract with sig for this firearm?

if the safety was the deal breaker they should have just stayed with the M9 and saved the taxpayers a large sum of money

---

I am going to reply to this in pieces and update as I go since I just wrote a detailed response and the wonky phone I am on updated the page and deleted the whole thing before I could summit.

1. Expect to see standard 115 gr ball issued but special ammo for SOCOM and other units. Just like they currently do with 5,56.

2. The Modularity actually makes perfect sense and is a huge money saver. There are currently multiple handgun weapons systems in place due to mission profile. A perfect example is the M9 carried by uniformed MP's and the Sig P229 M-11 carried by CID for concealed carry. In a large organization like Army this is a huge expense. Multiple parts caches, multiple magazine types, tracking all that disparate equipment, multiple armorers, different training courses, etc. All because you needed a more compact pistol. With the Modular Sig, the intent wasn't ever for a soldier to be swapping parts in the field. Rather, the idea is if a Command decides they need 50 compact pistols for a mission that their Armorer can go into the parts bin and put them together without any major purchasing / supply issues. And guess what? The soldiers issued the "new" pistol don't need additional training or quals. And it's not just slide and barrel length. They have different sized grip frames, lengths, threaded barrels for silencers, light mounts, etc. Modular is a good thing.

3. Not that I know of but I would imagine everyone else was waiting to see what happened with this solicitation. I am sure Sig Execs are counting their bonus checks.

Lastly, the M9 IMO has run its course. The long DA / SA trigger is hard to shoot well without lots of practice and the pistol is bulky and heavy. It was great when we needed Italy to let us put anti-ICBM missiles in their country but it is time for it to go.

quote:

---

Accidental Discharge

---

No such thing. Negligent discharge.

No for me. I don't buy glocks so I have 0 use for that

quote:

---

The Modularity actually makes perfect sense and is a huge money saver.

---

No it doesn't and it was no more than another bullet-point to justify wasting money on something like so many past small-arms projects by the DoD.

quote:

---

There are currently multiple handgun weapons systems in place due to mission profile. A perfect example is the M9 carried by uniformed MP's and the Sig P229 M-11 carried by CID for concealed carry. In a large organization like Army this is a huge expense. Multiple parts caches, multiple magazine types, tracking all that disparate equipment, multiple armorers, different training courses, etc. All because you needed a more compact pistol. With the Modular Sig, the intent wasn't ever for a soldier to be swapping parts in the field. Rather, the idea is if a Command decides they need 50 compact pistols for a mission that their Armorer can go into the parts bin and put them together without any major purchasing / supply issues. And guess what? The soldiers issued the "new" pistol don't need additional training or quals. And it's not just slide and barrel length. They have different sized grip frames, lengths, threaded barrels for silencers, light mounts, etc. Modular is a good thing.

---

Load of BS. If commonality of parts, training, armorers, etc was so important than the DoD should have scrapped the whole program the instant Beretta offered the M9A3. It offers 95% of what this Sig does and would cost the Army less than the current M9's while retaining significant commonality of parts already in inventory. No commander outside of SOCOM is going to ask his armorers to reprofile all the handguns they have in the vault for a mission. No commander with half a brain is going to put themselves in a position of having to inventory, secure, and have spare weapons parts hanging around like that on their property book. His S4 would tell him to pound sand too. There's no such thing as "parts bins" these days, everything goes on the books and everything is inventoried monthly.

quote:

---

The long DA / SA trigger is hard to shoot well without lots of practice and the pistol is bulky and heavy.

---

That's a BS excuse too and the fix with a D spring is peanuts compared to the more than half-billion this contract costs. Guess what, practice is the problem that this Sig isn't going to solve. The Army doesn't give commanders enough time and ammo to focus on live fire pistol training for those that can be assigned a pistol. I've gotten 5 emails this week from Division about LBGTQ, religious tolerance, EO, and other crap and not one in the last year concerning anything on better small-arms training. Well, I'm sure the S4 got a few about ordering less ammo this year due to our continued "fiscally constrained environment"...

quote:

---

Was standard issue in Iraq and Afghanistan.

---

Then why didn't I have one in Ramadi or the Helmand? Oh yeah, only Officers and SNCO's got them.

It's just a fricking pistol. Who really gives a shite?

I think all the glock fanboys are just pissy Sig won the bid.

quote:

---

Someone with more stars on his shoulder than you disagrees.

---

And that's the usual problem with bureaucracies, idiots in charge have no concept of 2nd and 3rd order effects.

quote:

---

As far as the Logistics issue, it might not make sense to you at your level but it does to me at the Program level. I have worked a Program from Solicitation and bid through down select and award. Have you? Because seemingly small issues like I mentioned become big issues at that level.

---

Case in point, this kind of myopic understanding of how units actually work at Brigade and Below. The issues you gloss over are the ones that hurt those that actually have to deal with them day in and day out the most. Try having less 10,000ft POV.