re: Anybody still taking the ATFs side on Waco or Ruby Ridge

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Unless you're black.

If weaver were black, the country would have burned

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My man!

Saved me from having to go there

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Or if he looked like this and was "occupying" a property in protest.

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Thats why the Bundy Crew should have put on fake dreads, smoked weed and praised Che during their takeover of the building on a national wildlife refuge.

You're allowed to be "insurgent" if you say the right things.

I was just watching end of the Netflix documentary and it’s good but the other one is way better. The hostage negotiation team was really good and tried to get this resolved peacefully but the HRT (There were really no ducking hostages ) fricked them at each and every opportunity. They wanted back buy for the four dead agents. The best part of the series is the guy that was like shite four timed talking about how ducking stupid it was to go in on this when they had confirmed they were tipped off. He is still bitter about it and most of his blame is justifiable at FBI and ATF leadership. I think he said something like “ We were stunned we were still going. We had completely lost the element of surprise, we need this was going to go badly.”

They squeezed each others hands once going in as in “in case you die brother” I have zero blame with these guys or the Branch Davidions on firing back. They obviously knew this was fubor but chain of command. No one really knows who fired first but it really doesn’t matter.

What I found interesting is where Clinton says in his speech that they were illegally stockpiling weapons and ammunition. How can you do that? I didn’t think there was a limit on how many guns or rounds a group or even a person could own.

On an interesting side not about ten years ago they raid another religious compound in texas for underage sex, child wildfare etc like they used in this case. And it turned out they were completely wrong. The kids just looked so young and healthy because they only age food etc that they grew. (In case you didn’t think our food was killing us) Some of them looked 12-13 but were 18-19. The kids all got incredibly ill when forced to eat our food and I think several were hospitalized. There was a bunch of news on the raid. What you didn’t see about much in the news is the government had to return them all and pay damages. Thank God they didn’t murder anyone too.

They have laid off these groups since that botched raid

Seen it all… you got people in here defending Timothy McVeigh… this some sick shite …

So you the coward praising McVeigh huh???… that make you fell big and bad making a martyr of a guy who murdered kids and was a closeted homosexual… your mother should have stayed a virgin instead of slutting herself out to the cowards who would become your father and grandfather

One of my old high school buddies, who i used to occasionally smoke weed with is now like a regional director for the DEA, i used to call him and give him hell when I had to go through 20 minutes of bullshite to buy that stuff. This is because he candidly told me it was total bullshite, that the drug was was effectively lost and over with the US Mexico Canada trade agreement, can’t remember what it was called but it only allows us to stop like 2/10 trucks coming in, so basically, he tells me that the cartels are just going to load up 10 to 20 trucks at a time, knowing that at least eight of the 10 no are going to get through so the whole
Sudafed bullshite was stupid and useless, and all they could possibly come of. It was to catch a few Billy Bob rednecks making crystal meth in a trailer somewhere.

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am not defending Korush, who was obviously a religious nut, but everything I have ever read indicates that this could have been handled differently with no bloodshed. Hell, the local sheriff said he could get him to voluntarily come in but the ATF wanted a big show.

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I’m no expert but can I say the ATF royally messed up but acknowledge that there were plenty of off ramps on both sides to avoid the end?

I have a much much higher standard for the professional who is also the aggressor but he also could’ve done a lot to deescalate

Those 2 public executions make me shake my head when I see “come and take it” stickers.

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Nope, which is why the FBI and ATF are to blame.

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Oddly enough I think you and I agree on this. The FBI and ATF are to blame for their killings and TM is to blame for his. The poster I was replying to thinks TM was justified in his killing of 19 children, I do not and I think your previous post supports the same idea.