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re: So our past few offseasons have just been absolutely terrible
Posted on 7/28/15 at 3:31 pm to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 7/28/15 at 3:31 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
is isn't exactly a grand statement of positivity
I don't think anyone would call our defense a positive outside of a few years
0
Posted on 7/28/15 at 3:34 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
didn't know that signing new defensive coordinators, signing FA on defense to fill draft holes, and developing draft picks= rebuilding.
What would you consider rebuilding?
Posted on 7/28/15 at 4:05 pm to TigerBait1127
quote:
What would you consider rebuilding?
More of what we have done this offseason. Desperate moves to try and salvage the future.
Cutting ties with veterans like Pierre Thomas & Curtis Lofton
trading starters for draft picks, Graham, Stills, Grubbs
drafting potential future replacements at OT and QB
drafting SIX defensive players to try and rebuild the defense.
all pretty blatant rebuild moves.
Posted on 7/28/15 at 4:07 pm to TigerBait1127
quote:
We had 7 new starters on defense added in 2008-2009 to go along with the Gregg Williams hire. Only 4 defensive starters were on the 2006 team.
how many were draft picks or from 2006?
Posted on 7/28/15 at 4:32 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
Cutting ties with veterans like Pierre Thomas & Curtis Lofton
kind of washed up for PT, Lofton played pretty poorly in both run and passing downs.
quote:
trading starters for draft picks, Graham, Stills, Grubbs
Grubbs has underwhelmed since the contract he was given. Stills gave us a high pick and a potential starting LB. Graham gave us a high pick and a potential all-pro center. We lost two solid players in Graham and Stills, but since 2011 Graham has not been that caliber of player. Whether its a foot, wrist, shoulder, or simply the fact that he isn't willing to take pounding hits anymore...he isn't that dominant 2011 Graham. Stills was progressing very well, but he will never be more than a #2 WR. Hell, he isn't even the best one in Miami.
quote:
drafting potential future replacements at OT and QB
Because Armstead and Strief have never been healthy for a full season. Harris went in, the line went to ABSOLUTE shambles. Tackle play is not an issue, but tackle HEALTH is. A 6th lineman is also necessary for a solid running game since none of your TEs outside of Watson could do that in the last 3 years. None of your backup tackles were remotely good as well. Resulted in passing like no other era in football...ever.
I agree, the QB is about the future 100%. The OT is future, but you act like he won't be meaningful this year at all.
quote:
drafting SIX defensive players to try and rebuild the defense.
after what happened last year, wouldn't you be trying to do that too? The offense gave away a few games due to poor pass protection and late interceptions, but the defense gave up their fair share of TDs to seal the coffin. When we needed them to bend and not break, they snapped in half, then snapped in 3 pieces, then some games just straight shattered. Look at the SF game, that is the clear definition of how damn horrid they were last year.
You make it seem like its all or nothing, like none of the draft picks or players acquired are going to help us this year. You know just as well as anyone, NFL is parody...any team can come out on top with one good FA/Draft year if they have a decent franchise QB.
This post was edited on 7/28/15 at 4:35 pm
Posted on 7/28/15 at 4:37 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
how many were draft picks or from 2006?
Zero of the new starters were from 2006
Porter and Ellis were drafted. Not that it really matters since rebuilding through the draft is a thing. I didn't include Jenkins who was our first round pick this year
This post was edited on 7/28/15 at 4:39 pm
Posted on 7/28/15 at 4:42 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
all pretty blatant rebuild moves.
So bringing in 7-8 new starters over the course of 2 years and bringing in a new defensive coordinator isn't a blatant rebuild move?
And no one has denied that this is considered a rebuild off season...
Posted on 7/28/15 at 6:14 pm to TigerBait1127
Everyone talking about rebuilding retoolin whatever the defense when its the o-line that may have the biggest turnover.
5 positions and I believe 3 will be new by years end if not by week one(60% change) high math I know and if jari is beat out that would be...? 80% upgrade/turnover on the o-line.
Oh and using guys that are not even playing as signs of a rebuild is not reasonable.
5 positions and I believe 3 will be new by years end if not by week one(60% change) high math I know and if jari is beat out that would be...? 80% upgrade/turnover on the o-line.
Oh and using guys that are not even playing as signs of a rebuild is not reasonable.
Posted on 7/28/15 at 6:36 pm to TigerBait1127
quote:
Zero of the new starters were from 2006
Porter and Ellis were drafted. Not that it really matters since rebuilding through the draft is a thing. I didn't include Jenkins who was our first round pick this year
Im saying overall.
Drafted:
Charles Grant
Will Smith
Ellis
Porter
Roman
2006
Fujita
Shanle
Ayodele, Greer, Sharper, Vilma.
quote:
Not that it really matters since rebuilding through the draft is a thing.
yea but the draft happens every year. You can't really distinguish a rebuild via the draft.
We add FA's every year too. Just because we won and got better doesn't mean we rebuilt.
Thankfully we've been good enough to where we haven't had to make outrageous moves to get better, until this offseason, really. I don't think this front office has truly rebuilt anything since 06. Bad drafts, questionable FA signings and re-signings. Our offense thankfully has been able to carry us and mask most holes.
Posted on 7/28/15 at 7:01 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
ea but the draft happens every year. You can't really distinguish a rebuild via the draft.
Sure you can. You even had it as part of your criteria earlier. It is a big part of our rebuild right now.
We literally rebuilt the defense by having 7 new starters. It isn't hard to understand
Call it whatever you want. We "revamped" our entire defense.
This post was edited on 7/28/15 at 7:10 pm
Posted on 7/28/15 at 7:22 pm to TigerBait1127
quote:
Sure you can. You even had it as part of your criteria earlier. It is a big part of our rebuild right now.
because it falls in line with the other moves this offseason that have been obvious of a rebuild. The fact that it was so one-sided on defense says the same.
Think back to that time. Did you really tell yourself, "ok, we are rebuilding now".. No. I didn't at least. Those were just normal off seasons for the Saints. Plugging a few holes.
Feels a lot different this year. We're not just plugging holes, but we're washing our hands with guys that were good, young and productive players to better our future. That wasn't happening then. they were moreseo still building off 2006, then rebuilding.
Posted on 7/28/15 at 8:52 pm to SlowFlowPro
Our best move has been to trade Jimmy for Unger and Anthony. I would have been all for trading Jordan for a proven starter and a 1st rounder prior to his signing a new contract.
Posted on 7/28/15 at 9:04 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
they traded his 2 best targets
You apparently missed my point. We are getting better on defense and in the running game. Brees doesn't have to carry the team. He doesn't need 12 WRs. He just needs to keep the defenses honest and pass the ball around to more receivers.
Posted on 7/28/15 at 9:20 pm to SlowFlowPro
Have we had an offseason without huge drama under Payton? It doesn't seem like it.
Posted on 7/28/15 at 9:25 pm to Suntiger
I like our offense better this year than last.
I think Brees is at his best in playaction. In the last two years whenever Sproles or Graham were out there it was almost always a pass. With them gone and Unger in our blocking got better, our run game which was coming on last year will be better and playaction will be a big key for us this year. If Cooks can take that next step towards playing like Antonio Brown we could see a better offense then any year since 2011.
Our defense is another story. I really hope Spencer is healthy and Anthony and one other rookie light it up from game one.
I think Brees is at his best in playaction. In the last two years whenever Sproles or Graham were out there it was almost always a pass. With them gone and Unger in our blocking got better, our run game which was coming on last year will be better and playaction will be a big key for us this year. If Cooks can take that next step towards playing like Antonio Brown we could see a better offense then any year since 2011.
Our defense is another story. I really hope Spencer is healthy and Anthony and one other rookie light it up from game one.
Posted on 7/29/15 at 12:55 am to mindbreaker
quote:
I really really want to disagree with you, but for the most part I can't
Posted on 7/29/15 at 9:18 am to SlowFlowPro
This is most definitely a watershed year for the organization as a whole. If we regress this year, then you could be seeing a lot of changes coming.
Posted on 7/29/15 at 9:26 am to Lester Earl
Wouldn't surprise me at all if they tried to deal Brees after this year to get a few picks in return.
Posted on 7/29/15 at 11:55 am to Rickety Cricket
i think we give grayson 2 years to learn
1 year to see if he has potential then 1 year to be legit groomed
then we cut brees and he geos to the broncos
1 year to see if he has potential then 1 year to be legit groomed
then we cut brees and he geos to the broncos
Posted on 7/29/15 at 12:40 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
i think we give grayson 2 years to learn
quote:
then we cut brees and he geos to the broncos
Why would they need to cut Brees? He would not be a free agent by then?
It runs out after 2016, in the 2017 offseason.
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