Started By
Message

re: Derek Carr is visiting the saints tomorrow.

Posted on 2/8/23 at 7:19 am to
Posted by Hot Carl
Prayers up for 3
Member since Dec 2005
59099 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 7:19 am to
quote:

Whoever wants a shot at starting and believes in themselves enough to take a 3 million dollar one year deal with incentives tied to team success with them starting can get the job.


And who is that exactly? Dalton is a free agent and signed last year to be the backup. He’s not signing a 1 year 3 million dollar deal to be the starter. I couldn’t believe it, but I read somewhere it would take a 2-year deal with an AAV between 10-15 million to re-sign Dalton. That sounds crazy, but not any more crazy than thinking Dalton signs a 1-year 3 million dollar deal to be the starter.

One thing nobody seems to mention is that Carr turns 32 in March. Dalton turns 36 in October. That’s a big difference in a vacuum, but Carr has always had a much better arm, is taller (leverage) and will age much better than Dalton whose noodle arm is only getting weaker. Barring injury, of course.

And I’m not sure the market is going to be as high for Carr as some—including himself—might think. The teams most desperate for a QB have high draft picks and are probably gonna go down that route. Save maybe for the Jets. However, Moscona had a Raiders guy on a couple weeks ago talking about Carr. He really liked him personally, but said he was kind of sensitive. Not necessarily in a bad way, but that he probably wouldn’t want to play in the bright lights of New York. He might prefer playing in a small market like New Orleans. Add to that his relationship with DA (guy said they still talk every week), and he might prefer New Orleans over any other suitor, assuming the price is right for him. Just because the Saints and Raiders agreed to a potential trade compensation doesn’t mean they are beholden to make it. I think they leverage his relationship with DA, bring him in and “wow” him with the Saints winning culture (relative to the disfunction of the Raiders organization he’s played under his entire career), lay out a plan on how they will use him, agree on a deal, convince him that not having to give up a draft pick for him help get him another weapon in an early round, and most importantly make him feel wanted and convince him we think he’s the missing piece to win the weak South and make a playoff run, and hope that’s enough for him to veto any trade and choose to sign with us after forcing the Raiders’ hand to cut him. If another team swoops in and makes a better pitch, move on to plan B.

Also, people thinking DA is the one making this call are crazy. He doesn’t have the political capital to make big personnel decisions on ANY side of the ball, especially an expensive QB on the side he has nothing to do with. At most he can vouch for him, but the money is going to have to make sense for Loomis, and the player is gonna have to make sense to Ireland. Ireland—whom I think we all really like as a talent evaluator and trust his scouting department—doesn’t just evaluate college guys coming in. Though I’m sure he did a thorough eval when Carr came out. He’s been watching tape on Carr for years and had a good idea of what kind of player we would be getting. So I think DA, Loomis, Ireland, and Gayle are all gonna have to sign off before offering him a big deal.

And 40 per is ridiculous, but I’m less concerned about an AAV in the 30s as I am the guaranteed money and ability to get out of his deal after a few years if it doesn’t work out. And it might not. But I think we owe it to Cam, Demario, Ram, and even DA to give it a shot. We can think long-term because we’re gonna be fans for the rest of our lives. These guys live year to year. And there’s a really small difference between 7-10 and 10-7 in the NFL today. Hit on some mid or even late round guys that can contribute immediately, get some good injury luck, force a few more turnovers, take advantage of a weak division and schedule, get hot at the right time, and anything can happen. I’m all for keeping the window open, slight as it may seem, until it’s absolutely closed shut. And I don’t think we’re quite there yet. May be this time next year, but not quite time to raise the white flag just yet imo.

And I’m not married to Carr. A guy like Brisette is interesting for the right price and ability to add a few more pieces. And I’m open to Hooker, too. I don’t understand how the age thing is seen as such a negative when in the same breath, people are clamoring for a cheaper guy on a rookie deal. If I want a starter on a rookie deal to be able to add pieces, give me the mature guy who’ll be 25-30 in his physical and mental prime on that deal, not a 21-26 year old kid. If the argument is he’s not gonna be a 15-year-starter, well no shite. 99.999999999999999% that 21-year-old won’t be either.

Last thing: that Penning injury really sucked cock. He needed the off-season reps more than anybody on the team. May force us to go OL earlier in the draft than we’d have liked to. I know Taysom came back ready to go, but he’s a freak athlete, system vet, and about 100 pounds lighter. shite.
Posted by cas4t
Member since Jan 2010
70911 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 7:19 am to
Saints have all the leverage no chance we give them a 1
Posted by Irish Knuckles
Nuwallins
Member since Jan 2015
687 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 7:40 am to
quote:

Saints have all the leverage no chance we give them a 1


i wouldn't be surprised if we're trying to get him through a trade deal instead of waiting til he's cut because we want to unload some cap space of our own. i don't think we'll give anything higher than a 3 and that's if we get everything we want out of the trade.
Posted by saints5021
Louisiana
Member since Jul 2010
17480 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 7:57 am to
There has been so much talk about what we have to pay Carr and people saying what he is worth and what he is not worth, so I wanted to set the market for a starting QB that is not on a rookie contract

Aaron Rodgers - 50 mil
Russel Wilson - 49 mil
Kyler Murray - 46 mil
Deshaun Watson - 46 mil
Patrick Mahomes - 45 mil
Josh Allen - 43 mil
Derek Carr - 40 mil
Matt Stafford - 40 mil
Dak Prescott - 40 mil
Kirk Cousins - 35 mil
Jared Goff - 33 mil
Carson Wentz - 32 mil
Matt Ryan - 30 mil
Ryan Tannehill - 25 mil

Everyone else is on a short term contract (Baker Mayfield, Jameis Winston, Mariota) or still on a rookie contract. This is not 10 years ago where 25 million was what an elite QB made. I would argue the only better value at starting QB for a veteran than Carr is Cousins or Goff. At 40 million a year, he is getting paid the same as comparable QBs in Stafford and Prescott.
Posted by Irish Knuckles
Nuwallins
Member since Jan 2015
687 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 8:02 am to
isn't his cap hit 32mil this year if we trade for him? that's not including what the raiders have to eat. i think a poster in another thread showed that we would pay around 14mil towards our cap for him this year. that's a sweet deal and worth a 3rd rounder. i'd prefer it to be a 4th, but w/e.

funny that it looks as if carr is the most economical route for us to get a solid starting qb.
This post was edited on 2/8/23 at 8:03 am
Posted by Proximo
Member since Aug 2011
15554 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 8:11 am to
quote:

Can Carr win us the division? Probably because it sucks. Anything above that? Nope.

Brad Johnson won a super bowl for the bucs
Posted by VictoryHill
Alabama
Member since Nov 2013
3210 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 8:41 am to
quote:

HotCarl

Nobody is reading all that, dude.

Posted by msstate7
Member since Oct 2014
10778 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 9:00 am to
Trade still unlikely according to Florio..

LINK /
Posted by A Smoke Break
Lafayette
Member since Nov 2018
2063 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 9:03 am to
quote:

Nobody is reading all that, dude.


He probably has the best post in the thread.
Posted by msstate7
Member since Oct 2014
10778 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 9:09 am to
The oline from NDSU may be a great choice early. He can play all 5 spots on line. He and hurst would be a pretty solid insurance policy
Posted by VictoryHill
Alabama
Member since Nov 2013
3210 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 9:09 am to
quote:

I never said he would have more weapons with the Saints?

Here's the thing though, I never said you said he'd have more weapons. I replied to you laughing at someone else saying Carr had a bunch of good players around him like it wasn't true when it was.
Posted by LSUPilot07
Member since Feb 2022
5728 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 9:43 am to
If you would’ve bothered to keep reading instead of just picking the parts out you care too like you’re a democrat or something you would see I wasn’t giving a preference at all. I was giving the two points of view. If the Saints end up falling in love with Hooker then I can promise you that 5th year option is more valuable to them than waiting those few picks until the Saints pick next in the 2nd. After what you picked out I also said if they weren’t in love with a QB to draft that high then you try to trade back out if 29 to gain an extra 2nd or 3rd now or 2024 or you if you can’t then you use 29 to try to bolster the team around the future QB that you still don’t yet have like either interior OL or DL. Normally I would never draft a RB in round 1 but I’d have to think long and hard about it if Bijan Robinson were somehow still there. He would team with Kamara perfectly.
Posted by goatmilker
Castle Anthrax
Member since Feb 2009
64347 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 9:52 am to
Cmon man. That team was primed and ready to go. We have holes at DE,S, DT,WR,TE and guard. Throw in coaching while we're at it.
Posted by Townedrunkard
Member since Jan 2019
8815 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 11:21 am to
quote:

And who is that exactly?


You have numerous options, Bridgewater, Mayfiekd, Matt Ryan, Wentz, maybe Dalton again if someone doesn’t value backups. I’d concentrate on the first two, but beggars can’t be choosers.

The point is to get our cap issue under control.
Posted by Townedrunkard
Member since Jan 2019
8815 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 11:28 am to
quote:

I would argue the only better value at starting QB for a veteran than Carr is Cousins or Goff. At 40 million a year, he is getting paid the same as comparable QBs in Stafford and Prescott.


Lol. Prescott and Stafford are way overpaid. Cowboys definitely regret giving him that contract and probably Rams too.

You looking at it the wrong way. You think Mahomes and Allen are only 3-5 million a year better than Carr? Hell nah…..

Carr is a few tiers below them but is right there with them in salary. It’s why the Raiders have to cut bait with him. They way overpaid him and they know it. Can’t win with a team paying him that much.
This post was edited on 2/8/23 at 11:32 am
Posted by saints5021
Louisiana
Member since Jul 2010
17480 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 12:33 pm to
You are looking at it the wrong way. The price for an NFL veteran QB that is not on a rookie contract is between 35 and 40 million. Dak and Stafford are not overpaid if they are making damn near the average.

Like it or not, a guy like Carr is a 35 million a year QB. That is the market.
Posted by WicKed WayZ
Louisiana Forever
Member since Sep 2011
31589 posts
Posted on 2/8/23 at 12:40 pm to
Exactly. Maybe they are overpaid but you’d rather have a Dak or Cousins than be in Carolina or the Jets situation or ours…
first pageprev pagePage 5 of 5Next pagelast page
refresh

Back to top
logoFollow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News
Follow us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram to get the latest updates on LSU Football and Recruiting.

FacebookTwitterInstagram