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re: Will Benson's "Win-now" mode cripple the franchise?
Posted on 11/28/13 at 9:45 pm to The Future
Posted on 11/28/13 at 9:45 pm to The Future
Team is last in their division and 3rd worse team in the conference. Sorry but I see little to indicate a sudden turn around in the rest of this season.
Getting close to the TIme for some of this experimentation with Monty and Dell to come to a conclusion. We are 4 years into this couple running the team and we do not seem to be moving this team to a contender.
Seems like we are now salary capped strapped with just a bottom level franchise.
Not sure about the rest of you guys but I am tired of paying for season tickets with false hope year after year. You commit to the team but might as well wait to get the special deal of any 5 games you want at half price.
Just seems like a total rip off looking at it from a season ticket holder perspective.
AD will probably bolt out of this manure to the Lakers as Kobe retires. Just do not see him staying here without a better chance to get a championship.
Getting close to the TIme for some of this experimentation with Monty and Dell to come to a conclusion. We are 4 years into this couple running the team and we do not seem to be moving this team to a contender.
Seems like we are now salary capped strapped with just a bottom level franchise.
Not sure about the rest of you guys but I am tired of paying for season tickets with false hope year after year. You commit to the team but might as well wait to get the special deal of any 5 games you want at half price.
Just seems like a total rip off looking at it from a season ticket holder perspective.
AD will probably bolt out of this manure to the Lakers as Kobe retires. Just do not see him staying here without a better chance to get a championship.
4
Posted on 11/28/13 at 10:17 pm to PG
I stopped after Monty's first year.
Something about him just made me feel as if this was going to be a sinking ship (that and the CP3 crap) and since I was splitting it with a co-worker, we both agreed we're better off saving the money for a few years. I was going to buy season tickets this year, but Monty being coach held me back, and although I've been to 3 games this season, I'm disappointed.
Even though 2 were wins against cleveland and philly, and a loss to the pacers. That game was in the bag, and then 3rd quarter hit and I felt like the record was on repeat
Something about him just made me feel as if this was going to be a sinking ship (that and the CP3 crap) and since I was splitting it with a co-worker, we both agreed we're better off saving the money for a few years. I was going to buy season tickets this year, but Monty being coach held me back, and although I've been to 3 games this season, I'm disappointed.
Even though 2 were wins against cleveland and philly, and a loss to the pacers. That game was in the bag, and then 3rd quarter hit and I felt like the record was on repeat
Posted on 11/28/13 at 10:21 pm to PG
quote:
Not sure about the rest of you guys but I am tired of paying for season tickets with false hope year after year.
Playoffs or monty fired
Only way I renew again
Posted on 11/28/13 at 10:37 pm to htran90
quote:
We won in our gamble with AD, the key is to put people around him.
People are completely overstating the amount of risk in some of these prospects. Is there risk in everything regarding sports? Absolutely.
However, elite level prospects in the NBA are as close to a sure thing as any sport if not moreso. Guys like Melo, Lebron, Howard, Durant, Davis, Jordan, Ewing, Rose etc aren't really risks or gambles.
Do you know if you're getting a HOFer? No, but you're going to get a very VERY good player for many years barring injury. By all intent and purposes, this upcoming draft has a handful of those guys.
Posted on 11/28/13 at 10:39 pm to VOR
quote:
You do realize that you're not really addressing my point, much less refuting it, right?
You're saying the NBA Draft is far from a sure thing. I'm saying to get a superstar in the NBA Draft, it's statistically inarguable that you have to draft extremely high.
Can there be lottery picks who don't succeed? Absolutely. However, name me the last player with as much hype and as much of a surething as this upcoming draft to fail.
I'd argue it's probably Oden, and he's simply been injury prone.
Posted on 11/28/13 at 11:53 pm to FootballNostradamus
14 games into the season and its full meltdown smh... I agree on the point that Monty has to go though. I would quickly make a call to George Karl
Posted on 11/29/13 at 1:13 am to Mr.Perfect
quote:
Playoffs or monty fired
Only way I renew again
I'm starting to lean this way too to be honest. Why commit to full price tickets when I can let other people commit and sit lower bowl for 15$ a game cause we're losing?
The BIGGEST reason I am a STH is because I want my playoff tickets. And if we're not getting to the playoffs/getting bounced in round 1, what's the point?
Monty just flat sucks. There is no other way to put it. How do we keep ending up with stubborn mules for coaches? At least Byron Scott understood the simple basics of basketball, i.e. you don't sit your star player for the rest of the half with 2 fouls.
Honestly, the only 2 things in my opinion keeping him around. 1) His team USA gig. He's going to still have to be around Davis/Holiday/Gordon(?). 2) We don't want to look like Laker-esque aholes of a franchise that fire coaches 14 games into the season.
Doesn't discount the fact that most of us are starting to realize that Monty isn't just a stubborn fool, he's in way over his head. The quicker we cut bait, the better. It's almost a certainty at this point even if he were to last the season, he won't be here for the next.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 1:45 am to FootballNostradamus
quote:
The closest team recently with as many top picks in a row as us would be the Thunder.
Bobcats, Cavs, Kings, and Wizards have been mainstays in the high lottery the last several years. Plenty of others teams have also wallowed there for three to five years in a row like the Clippers, Raptors, Warriors, etc. The Thunder are the exception not the rule.
This post was edited on 11/29/13 at 1:49 am
Posted on 11/29/13 at 4:29 am to PG
quote:
PG
Giving danman a run for his money
Posted on 11/29/13 at 7:37 am to FootballNostradamus
quote:
You're saying the NBA Draft is far from a sure thing. I'm saying to get a superstar in the NBA Draft, it's statistically inarguable that you have to draft extremely high.
Can there be lottery picks who don't succeed? Absolutely. However, name me the last player with as much hype and as much of a surething as this upcoming draft to fail.
I'd argue it's probably Oden, and he's simply been injury prone.
The missing piece from your argument is a key one: keeping your star long enough to win a title. In most cases, those guys are gone without winning a title on the team that drafted them.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 8:14 am to LosLobos111
How much cash have you wasted supporting the Pelicans/Hornets year after year hearing the same old song and dance??
Posted on 11/29/13 at 8:15 am to PG
quote:
Just seems like a total rip off looking at it from a season ticket holder perspective.
The alternative to the moves Demps made was to tank. How is another year of tanking better for STHs than trying to win now?
quote:
Seems like we are now salary capped strapped with just a bottom level franchise.
Cap space isn't some magical "if you have it they will come" panacea. What FAs were we going to have a shot at that are better than Ryno, Holiday or Evans? Melo's not coming here next year. I have no desire to get in the Rudy Gay sweepstakes. Deng or Granger could be interesting options but they also have durability issues and may well be falling apart by the time you reach the end of the 4 year $10-$12 per you'd probably have to offer them. Maybe they'd be the David West veteran this team needs, maybe they'd be new Peja, help the team look great for 2 years and then be an albatross the last 2.
quote:
AD will probably bolt out of this manure to the Lakers as Kobe retires
If you're going to wallow in the worst case scenario, at least understand what the worst case scenario is. Anthony Davis will happily sign a 5 year $100ish million extension during the 2016-2017 offseason. The "Melodrama" dance doesn't begin until he hits 2 years left on that deal which will be the 2019-20 season.
That is 6 years after this season before we are officially "on the clock" with AD. That is sufficient time for at least 2 regime changes and roster turnovers if this is seen as a make or break year for Monty by Benson.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 8:33 am to TigerinATL
STHs - not sure where they come up with their numbers but the arena has more available seats game after game than I would have expected. Even Benson left his center court seats at halftime recently.
AD:
Let's hope so. LeBron even left his home town in the dust after making the NBA finals to get his rings. AD has no sentimental loyalty to NOLA.
Not sure where the problem is but after 4 years, Monty looks like he needs to hit the door. But he and Demps are tied at the hip.
AD:
Let's hope so. LeBron even left his home town in the dust after making the NBA finals to get his rings. AD has no sentimental loyalty to NOLA.
Not sure where the problem is but after 4 years, Monty looks like he needs to hit the door. But he and Demps are tied at the hip.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 8:45 am to corndeaux
quote:
Im not sure what you're arguing here. That they need to tank to get high lottery picks or that they just need draft picks?
Definitely think you're off on the first part. Indiana, Houston, SAS, Memphis, are all teams that didnt use a string of lottery picks to become part of the upper crust. None are glamour markets either. Outside of OKC, which recent contender hit on high lotto picks like that?
In fact, most recent title teams have only one star that they drafted on their championship rosters. Not 2 or 3 from consecutive lottery picks.
On this roster Evans, Gordon, Davis, Aminu and Rivers were lottery picks. Anderson, Smiht (I think) and Holiday were also first rounders. They have draft pedigree here. Perhaps not lived up to the hype for some, but thats the nature of the draft
This. Maybe I'm missing his argument? I think the issue for this thread is the wisdom of a) trading Noel and a protected pick for Holiday and b) the cost of his and Evans' contracts. Do those moves really hamstring us? I don't think so.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 8:54 am to PG
quote:
But he and Demps are tied at the hip.
They are and they aren't. If Demps was told to choose between himself and Monty I think he'd fire Monty, and honestly Monty seems like the kind of guy that wouldn't want his long time friend to get fired because of him.
I really like most of the moves Demps has made and I think there'd be plenty of coaches interested in working with Demps and the talent on this roster. Resigning Gordon is really the only bad move IMO, and that still gets a grade of incomplete because it's really not a failure unless we end up dumping him or he under performs for the entire contract.
People keep asking where is Demps' big move, but big moves don't happen because one GM outsmarts or out-negotiates another GM. Big moves happen because you have the right asset bundle available at the right time. Other teams stars don't get disgruntled on your schedule. There's really nothing he can do but amass good value contracts and wait for opportunity to knock.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 9:45 am to TigerinATL
After AD's rookie contract is up, he becomes a RFA, right? So we will match any offer that he gets?
On Demps, I don't have a problem with what he's done. He got us from under Okafor and Ariza's contract which I thought we would eat every bite of. He got us Ryan which is a key part of this team having a chance to succeed. My favorite move (ahem) was getting us an all star PG (even tho he's not playing like it now. Looking at you Monty) for a draft pick in last years draft that I've said was filled with terribleness. And even though we selected Noel doesn't mean we would have taken him if we were gonna keep that pick. We took him bc Philly wanted him.
On Demps, I don't have a problem with what he's done. He got us from under Okafor and Ariza's contract which I thought we would eat every bite of. He got us Ryan which is a key part of this team having a chance to succeed. My favorite move (ahem) was getting us an all star PG (even tho he's not playing like it now. Looking at you Monty) for a draft pick in last years draft that I've said was filled with terribleness. And even though we selected Noel doesn't mean we would have taken him if we were gonna keep that pick. We took him bc Philly wanted him.
Posted on 11/29/13 at 9:54 am to Gtothemoney
quote:
On Demps, I don't have a problem with what he's done. He got us from under Okafor and Ariza's contract which I thought we would eat every bite of. He got us Ryan which is a key part of this team having a chance to succeed. My favorite move (ahem) was getting us an all star PG (even tho he's not playing like it now. Looking at you Monty) for a draft pick in last years draft that I've said was filled with terribleness. And even though we selected Noel doesn't mean we would have taken him if we were gonna keep that pick. We took him bc Philly wanted him.
I really don't have a problem with Demps for now. When you think back on the circumstances surrounding the Gordon re-signing, it almost had to be done. For a number of reasons, Demps couldn't let a RFA simply walk. And there apparently no sign and trades that were worth it. Despite the grumbling around here, no one really predicted what was to follow last season with Gordon.
I also think Anderson and Evans (yeah, he could turn out to be overpaid like a lot of players in the league) were both good FA signings. The Holiday trade absolutely made sense and, you're right, they were not taking Noel if they were actually going to use the pick.
This post was edited on 11/29/13 at 9:56 am
Posted on 11/29/13 at 9:58 am to FootballNostradamus
quote:
Let's not even address the fact that if Noel returns healthy it was 100% the dumbest move we could have made. Noel being out is a tailormade situation for us to suck hard this year and get Noel back next year plus a Wiggins/Parker/Smart.
Are you f'n kidding me? That would be by far the best young trio since Westbrook, Durant and Harden.
settle down, bro
there was certainly a rough start to the year, but let's look at the last 5 games of our 2 new acquisitions
Jrue Holiday:
ppg: 14.4
rpg; 5.2
apg: 8.2
FG%; 47.0
FT%: 85.7
spg: 1.8
mpg: 33.6
Tyreke Evans:
ppg: 14.2
rpg; 6.0
apg: 3.6
FG%; 43.8
FT%: 66.7
spg: 1.6
mpg: 25.4
Posted on 11/29/13 at 10:06 am to FootballNostradamus
quote:
Guys like Melo, Lebron, Howard, Durant, Davis, Jordan, Ewing, Rose etc aren't really risks or gambles.
helo, durant, davis, LBJ? yes
howard was a gamble. people thought okafor was better...and i mean about half of "basketball" people
jordan wasn't even picked #1
rose...has had like 2 good years
none of the guys this past year or next year are close to the level of lbj/durant/melo/davis
Posted on 11/29/13 at 10:12 am to Gtothemoney
quote:
After AD's rookie contract is up, he becomes a RFA, right? So we will match any offer that he gets?
Yes, but what's most likely to happen is he won't reach RFA status and will sign an extension. The Pelicans will not get Anthony Davis cheaper than the max and AD can't get more money than the Max, so the extension is a no brainer for both sides. It will either be 5/$80ish like Wall/Westbrook got, or 5/$100ish like Rose/Griffin got. If he makes 2 All NBA teams, or 2 All Star starts(fan vote), or wins MVP he can get the higher amount of money. I expect he'll at least make the All NBA defense teams the next 2 years.
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