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Posted on 3/30/19 at 11:17 pm to ShamelessPel
Of course Tatum will be "fine"
But 8 months ago, many thought he could be a future MVP. There is a big gap between that and "fine"
But 8 months ago, many thought he could be a future MVP. There is a big gap between that and "fine"
Posted on 3/30/19 at 11:24 pm to BetOnIt
Gonna be honest, I think at his peak he is an all star guy but not an all nba guy. And I really like Tatum.
If the Knicks pick even lands at #3 I take a deal with them. I like the floor/ceiling of Barrett, even though he’s a step down from Zion/Morant
If the Knicks pick even lands at #3 I take a deal with them. I like the floor/ceiling of Barrett, even though he’s a step down from Zion/Morant
This post was edited on 3/30/19 at 11:30 pm
Posted on 3/31/19 at 1:23 am to NOSHAU
Hell no. He will never sniff the heights AD got to which is top 5 NBA player
Posted on 3/31/19 at 2:10 am to BetOnIt
quote:
Of course Tatum will be "fine"
But 8 months ago, many thought he could be a future MVP. There is a big gap between that and "fine"
You’re not going to trade 1 year of AD for a sure fire future MVP level talent on a rookie deal AND more assets.
Tatum has an all nba 2nd/3rd ceiling with a very high floor going into the 3rd year of his rookie deal. On top of that, I legitimately think he’d welcome coming here and be excited about getting the opportunity to shine.
That’s a pretty good starting point for a 1 year player who’s openly stated he’s hitting FA next offseason. I’m way more concerned that Boston doesn’t feel confident enough in Irving to move Tatum than I am with Tatum being what we hope he’s going to be.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 2:54 am to BetOnIt
quote:I get that. But that deal maybe has us fighting for an 8 seed. I have to think somewhere around the league there would be a better package.
Clippers package would also feature actual good players who are good now. I know its always about the prospects and the picks and the future. But it would be nice to have Montrezl Harrell on this team. Gimme Lou Will and/or Shamet. And then yes, those picks for the future. So I can have a quality team now with SGA and my picks developing.
The Clippers package honestly looks a lot like the original Chris Paul/Lakers trade that Dell tried to make.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 7:53 am to ShamelessPel
I guess I am asking if Tatum even has that level of a ceiling. 2nd or 3rd team NBA is Bradley Beal, KD, Kyrie, etc territory. What have we seen to give us any confidence he gets there?
What I am saying is that what if his peak is like Tobias Harris? How appealing is the Boston deal then?
What I am saying is that what if his peak is like Tobias Harris? How appealing is the Boston deal then?
Posted on 3/31/19 at 8:17 am to eyeran
quote:
The Clippers package honestly looks a lot like the original Chris Paul/Lakers trade that Dell tried to make.
Plus I really think you could trade Jrue to the Clippers for a decent chunk of the same assets they’d give you for AD. Maybe it’d just be SGA, Shamet and some Clippers picks, but Ballmer is ready to swing big. Even if they land a Kawhi they need to add other pieces.
To me this isn’t Boston vs. Lakers but Boston vs. Knicks. The problem is the new lottery odds make it highly likely the Knicks won’t get a good enough pick. 27% odds at top 2 means 73% odds of 3 or higher.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 9:42 am to BetOnIt
I think it’s funny how we tear down Tatum, but assume Zion and Ja will be great.
We won’t likely get equal value for AD. Just not likely to happen.
We won’t likely get equal value for AD. Just not likely to happen.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 9:45 am to Suntiger
Zion will be great. I wouldn't bet everything on Ja. But barring major injury, there is zero way Zion can fail.
And don't quote other #1 picks who failed. Its not the same thing. There are prospects that come along that are just different, and even though they haven't played in the NBA yet, you know. Zion is one of those guys.
And don't quote other #1 picks who failed. Its not the same thing. There are prospects that come along that are just different, and even though they haven't played in the NBA yet, you know. Zion is one of those guys.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 9:53 am to BetOnIt
I think the biggest question is whether Tatum can have a bigger impact on the team than AD depending on other assets we get. I understand he is our best option so far but it also really matters what package we get with him to fill other needed roster spots that we failed to do with AD. He might not be as a complete player as AD but the move may be able to create a more complete overall roster.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 10:17 am to BetOnIt
quote:
I guess I am asking if Tatum even has that level of a ceiling. 2nd or 3rd team NBA is Bradley Beal, KD, Kyrie, etc territory. What have we seen to give us any confidence he gets there?
What I am saying is that what if his peak is like Tobias Harris? How appealing is the Boston deal then?
I don’t think you can say his ceiling is Tobias, but even if that’s the case, a cost controlled present day Tobias Harris for the next 5 years is still not a bad haul if Zion/Morant aren’t an option.a I’ve said this before. Jayson Tatum rookie cards are expensive as hell even with the down season. That’s basically the player stock market amongst fans. Many people are still very high on Tatum that buy and sell player stock for a living.
I also don’t see any other player on the prospective teams already that comes close to Tatum. Knox? DSJ? SGA? Any Laker? Any Buck? Mitchell Robinson? None imo come close as a prospect.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 10:39 am to ShamelessPel
I don't care what nerd collectors think of Tatum. I have watched him a lot with my own eyes and both my eyes and advanced stats see a slightly above average scorer and rebounder who doesn't do anything else particularly well. And it's not like he is some Uber athlete who just needs to refine skills or add IQ. Those are the guys who tend to make major leaps. Tatum feels like he is 90 percent of the way to his ceiling already
I bet there is someone out there right now who nobody sees as the level of trade chip Tatum is that ends up having a better career. I can even see Pascal Siakam having a better career honestly. I wouldn't be surprised if RJ Barrett had a better career because of his play making ability
Bottom line, I am just far less excited about a Boston package than I used to me, unless they get a third team involved
I bet there is someone out there right now who nobody sees as the level of trade chip Tatum is that ends up having a better career. I can even see Pascal Siakam having a better career honestly. I wouldn't be surprised if RJ Barrett had a better career because of his play making ability
Bottom line, I am just far less excited about a Boston package than I used to me, unless they get a third team involved
Posted on 3/31/19 at 10:41 am to Eman5805
quote:*if they get KD and Kyrie. If not, why would they want AD? If the Knicks get Zion or Ja, I'd either ask for one of those and either Mitch, or DSJ and Knox
they remain my #1 choice to deal AD to.
This post was edited on 3/31/19 at 10:47 am
Posted on 3/31/19 at 10:46 am to chalmetteowl
So many people, including the national media, seem to have this backwards and it's so frustrating
The AD trade negotiations will happen in late May and early June, with a trade being agreed to no later than June 20th. Heck, KD might still be playing when the trade is finalized.
Teams will be trying to get AD to persuade Kyrie and/or KD or Kawhi, etc to come to their team. They will think of it as acquiring two superstars or maybe three.
So, would you trade Zion for 3 superstars? Yes. Would you give up all your assets for AD and Kyrie, when the alternative is not getting AD and Kyrie leaves you in the summer? Yes.
When are people going to realize that the AD trade is the first domino, not one that happens after other guys decide?
The AD trade negotiations will happen in late May and early June, with a trade being agreed to no later than June 20th. Heck, KD might still be playing when the trade is finalized.
Teams will be trying to get AD to persuade Kyrie and/or KD or Kawhi, etc to come to their team. They will think of it as acquiring two superstars or maybe three.
So, would you trade Zion for 3 superstars? Yes. Would you give up all your assets for AD and Kyrie, when the alternative is not getting AD and Kyrie leaves you in the summer? Yes.
When are people going to realize that the AD trade is the first domino, not one that happens after other guys decide?
This post was edited on 3/31/19 at 10:47 am
Posted on 3/31/19 at 10:46 am to chalmetteowl
quote:
*if they get KD and Kyrie. If not, why would they want AD?
Because of the timing. This would likely need to be agreed to before Free Agency starts. The Knicks have gone all in on Max Player Free Agency before burning 1sts to dump salary and then ended up with a disappointing Melo and hobbled Amare instead of LeBron like they had hoped. They clearly are all in on FA again and trading for AD before FA gives them a much better chance of landing a Max worthy player than having a bunch of kids. Look at how much the talented kids are helping LeBron in LA.
I get why people think that Zion > AD because of the age and years of control. I don't get why people don't see for the Knicks it's not about Zion vs. AD but what gets them closer to maximizing the 2 Max salary slots they created. AD does that much better than Zion.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 10:47 am to BetOnIt
100 percent agree with this. Feels like hes 80-90 percent at his ceiling right now. I think he will just be a good nba player. Tobias Harris is a good comparison. Polished offensive player who isnt extremely athletic. 18-20 Ppg guy who would be third best player on a really good team. I would take Morant over him right now and see how it plays out. I get that fact we know more about Tatum but i could also throw out Avery Bradley, Thomas, Crowder and others.
Posted on 3/31/19 at 10:49 am to BetOnIt
What other guys do has an effect on the AD trade market... Pels control the timeline here
Posted on 3/31/19 at 1:39 pm to Pelefraan 1
quote:And who do you think we are realistically going to get in a trade that matches that?
Hell no. He will never sniff the heights AD got to which is top 5 NBA player
Posted on 3/31/19 at 1:41 pm to BetOnIt
quote:Your views on Tatum sure have changed a lot since the trading deadline.
I don't care what nerd collectors think of Tatum. I have watched him a lot with my own eyes and both my eyes and advanced stats see a slightly above average scorer and rebounder who doesn't do anything else particularly well. And it's not like he is some Uber athlete who just needs to refine skills or add IQ. Those are the guys who tend to make major leaps. Tatum feels like he is 90 percent of the way to his ceiling already
I bet there is someone out there right now who nobody sees as the level of trade chip Tatum is that ends up having a better career. I can even see Pascal Siakam having a better career honestly. I wouldn't be surprised if RJ Barrett had a better career because of his play making ability
Bottom line, I am just far less excited about a Boston package than I used to me, unless they get a third team involved
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