- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
Could Jaxson Hayes become a starter this season?
Posted on 9/8/21 at 6:39 am
Posted on 9/8/21 at 6:39 am
Jake discussed the question on his podcast today and said that he thinks that, yes, there's a good chance that Jaxson could become a starter by midseason. His reasoning:
- Jonas may not be the best fit with Zion, because he isn't a vertical threat at all, and Jaxson most definitely is. Jake envisions Point Zion dribbling toward the rim, and sees a lob to Jaxson when the defense tries to collapse on Zion.
- The threes that Jaxson was shooting at the end of the year were clearly shots that the staff wanted him to take. If Jaxson develops that shot, he can become a floor spacer who opens up more room for Zion. Jonas, by contrast, has such a slow, methodical 3-pt shot that he's never going to shoot a lot of 3s, even if we wanted him to shoot more.
- The 17 ppg that Jonas averaged last season can be deceiving, because he had a high usage rate in Memphis, and he's not going to be fed the ball in the post a lot on this team -- at least with the starting unit. Jake sees a Jonas post-up as a quality play for the Pels reserves, however.
- David Griffin didn't offer Jonas an extension, which means that he may simply be a stopgap until Jaxson is ready.
- Jaxson significantly improved defensively as last season progressed, and he looks like he may be developing into a quality rim protector.
Jake did mention the main reason that this might not happen, which is that Jaxson hasn't shown that he can rebound the basketball.
That, of course, is why I prefer Jaxson on the floor with Kira and Hart. Kira as a lightning-quick P&R initiator creates lob opportunities for Jaxson, and Hart is out there to help on the defensive glass. As I mentioned, Cleaning the Glass shows that this trio was +12.5 points per 100 possessions when together on the floor last season, and they could be even better this year.
- Jonas may not be the best fit with Zion, because he isn't a vertical threat at all, and Jaxson most definitely is. Jake envisions Point Zion dribbling toward the rim, and sees a lob to Jaxson when the defense tries to collapse on Zion.
- The threes that Jaxson was shooting at the end of the year were clearly shots that the staff wanted him to take. If Jaxson develops that shot, he can become a floor spacer who opens up more room for Zion. Jonas, by contrast, has such a slow, methodical 3-pt shot that he's never going to shoot a lot of 3s, even if we wanted him to shoot more.
- The 17 ppg that Jonas averaged last season can be deceiving, because he had a high usage rate in Memphis, and he's not going to be fed the ball in the post a lot on this team -- at least with the starting unit. Jake sees a Jonas post-up as a quality play for the Pels reserves, however.
- David Griffin didn't offer Jonas an extension, which means that he may simply be a stopgap until Jaxson is ready.
- Jaxson significantly improved defensively as last season progressed, and he looks like he may be developing into a quality rim protector.
Jake did mention the main reason that this might not happen, which is that Jaxson hasn't shown that he can rebound the basketball.
That, of course, is why I prefer Jaxson on the floor with Kira and Hart. Kira as a lightning-quick P&R initiator creates lob opportunities for Jaxson, and Hart is out there to help on the defensive glass. As I mentioned, Cleaning the Glass shows that this trio was +12.5 points per 100 possessions when together on the floor last season, and they could be even better this year.
10
Posted on 9/8/21 at 6:48 am to GOP_Tiger
If he starts the game on the floor he most certainly could
Posted on 9/8/21 at 10:24 am to GOP_Tiger
I’m watching that one right now.
I’m a huge Hayes Stan. I think he’s the obvious future plan at C. Now can he handle that full time by the end of THIS year? We’ll see. I’m sure JV is looked at as the stop gap until Hayes is ready and can be helpful in the meantime.
Hayes improved SO much last year. He’s so damn athletic. Him and Zion I think complement each other pretty well too.
Also, the thought of a starting lineup of:
Kira
NAW
Ingram
Zion
Hayes
With Trey very much in the mix.
Man, that’s a super athletic crew.
I’m a huge Hayes Stan. I think he’s the obvious future plan at C. Now can he handle that full time by the end of THIS year? We’ll see. I’m sure JV is looked at as the stop gap until Hayes is ready and can be helpful in the meantime.
Hayes improved SO much last year. He’s so damn athletic. Him and Zion I think complement each other pretty well too.
Also, the thought of a starting lineup of:
Kira
NAW
Ingram
Zion
Hayes
With Trey very much in the mix.
Man, that’s a super athletic crew.
This post was edited on 9/8/21 at 10:26 am
Posted on 9/8/21 at 10:24 am to GOP_Tiger
years ago I noticed that big time college rebounder numbers translate pretty well.
I find it disturbing that
1. you say hayes is not much of a rebounder
2. setting up a bench rotation with a hard nosed teammate to compensate.
besides having squandered the 4th pick in 2019 and having hayes under contract why is there this sense hayes is going to break out?
how is a non rebounding front line guy going to be starter on a contender?
sure he will start some games.
he may be ok vs bench guys and get run when a starter needs a day off or is beat up.
I find it disturbing that
1. you say hayes is not much of a rebounder
2. setting up a bench rotation with a hard nosed teammate to compensate.
besides having squandered the 4th pick in 2019 and having hayes under contract why is there this sense hayes is going to break out?
how is a non rebounding front line guy going to be starter on a contender?
sure he will start some games.
he may be ok vs bench guys and get run when a starter needs a day off or is beat up.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 10:39 am to GOP_Tiger
Jake has this weird thing against Jonas Val and doesn't think he is that good which is weird because Jake Madison is presented as one of the smarter Pelicans bloggers yet he ignores the analytics about Val being a top 10 center in this league.
Everytime he says Val is pretty similar to Adams I cringe, Val can actually contribute on the court offensively and is basically what we had in David West here as far as impact yet Nola Jake treats him like a slightly better version of Steven Adams. It's just really weird how low he is on the Grizzlies best player from last year.
Even if it's based on fit, Val actually presents more of a threat stretching the floor and with more attempts can potentially have something there, but hey I'm no expert so I expect that I'm an idiot for thinking this.
Everytime he says Val is pretty similar to Adams I cringe, Val can actually contribute on the court offensively and is basically what we had in David West here as far as impact yet Nola Jake treats him like a slightly better version of Steven Adams. It's just really weird how low he is on the Grizzlies best player from last year.
Even if it's based on fit, Val actually presents more of a threat stretching the floor and with more attempts can potentially have something there, but hey I'm no expert so I expect that I'm an idiot for thinking this.
This post was edited on 9/8/21 at 10:40 am
Posted on 9/8/21 at 10:44 am to CelticDog
Hayes needs to learn to box out opposing bigs to get defensive rebounds. Form him, part of that is simply gaining more strength, which I hope he's been doing this offseason.
But part of it is technique, and I hope that Jaxson has been working with a coach/trainer in learning how to get better at boxing out.
There's no denying that getting DREBs has been the biggest weakness in Jaxson's game. If he shoots 3s at a good rate, and if he learns to put the ball on the floor and drive to the basket -- those things will be nice, but they won't be good enough for him to be a quality starter without the rebounding improvement.
But part of it is technique, and I hope that Jaxson has been working with a coach/trainer in learning how to get better at boxing out.
There's no denying that getting DREBs has been the biggest weakness in Jaxson's game. If he shoots 3s at a good rate, and if he learns to put the ball on the floor and drive to the basket -- those things will be nice, but they won't be good enough for him to be a quality starter without the rebounding improvement.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 10:44 am to Honest Man
I think his point was that in order to get to those numbers, he had a high usage rate. If he’s not getting that, is he more similar to a healthy Adams? Maybe. We’ll see
Posted on 9/8/21 at 10:56 am to GOP_Tiger
quote:Would be fantastic if so, that would mean he's a better player or better fit than JV, which would mean Jaxson has improved a lot and is a really solid player.
Could Jaxson Hayes become a starter this season?
Odds of that happening to that extent...I'd say very low. JV is legit.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 11:30 am to shel311
I don’t think it’s low at all. I don’t think it’s a stretch to think that after seeing his improvement last year, he couldn’t be on the trajectory to at the very least start next year. I think he will get a TON of time this year anyway.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 11:53 am to Brettesaurus Rex
I see him getting 20mpg as JV's backup, and I don't think it's likely he cuts into JV's minutes.
But again, I hope I'm wrong as that would be a good sign for us if he's better than I think he'll be.
But again, I hope I'm wrong as that would be a good sign for us if he's better than I think he'll be.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 11:53 am to GOP_Tiger
The biggest talking point for this should be Jaxson Hayes development. We saw Hayes improve last year and I think Adams helped him develop under the rim. I also think Hayes just needs more weight to be dominant around the rim. If Val can help improve Hayes shot selection and teach him some things then I can see it.
This really will factor on 3 things.
1. How much weight/ size Hayes will add through the year
2. How well Val is playing with BI/ Zion
3. How much playing time/ development Hayes gets with being our #2 C and maybe #2 PF
This really will factor on 3 things.
1. How much weight/ size Hayes will add through the year
2. How well Val is playing with BI/ Zion
3. How much playing time/ development Hayes gets with being our #2 C and maybe #2 PF
Posted on 9/8/21 at 12:34 pm to Dantheman504
quote:
If Val can help improve Hayes shot selection
do you see valunciunas as some expert at shot selection? his is a very limited palette. head of circle. good.
close to basket flip up and often rushed without really aiming and then tip the miss.
if he tries a mid range on the move he's nothing special.
in what context is jv willing to share his observations if he even has any?
valenciunas has no motivation to coach the colt.
there are assistant coaches who will attempt to guide hayes.
not valenciunas.
This post was edited on 9/8/21 at 12:46 pm
Posted on 9/8/21 at 12:54 pm to Honest Man
quote:
he ignores the analytics about Val being a top 10 center in this league.
Adams was as well before he got to us….it is just about the fit and how he will be used here. I can actually see Adams putting up better numbers in Memphis this year because his fit is better there.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 12:59 pm to GOP_Tiger
Of course he could. Hayes has all the athletic gifts you could possibly want at his size. He even had a few stretches last season where he was quite dominating. If he has the drive and work ethic, I think has has the potential to be among the top centers in the league.
He can handle the ball well for his size, can jump out of the gym and can make some highlights plays defensively. The only problem is that, to this point, he’s not shown enough consistency, specifically on the defensive end. If he can put it all together for a full 30 minutes, he has the potential to be among the leagues too centers. If he can do all that and make 2-3 threes a game at close to 37%, he could be a game breaker.
Seems simple enough, but these types of raw and supremely athletic players show up every couple of years and few are able to put it all together. For every Giannis there are 3 or 4 Aminu’s
He can handle the ball well for his size, can jump out of the gym and can make some highlights plays defensively. The only problem is that, to this point, he’s not shown enough consistency, specifically on the defensive end. If he can put it all together for a full 30 minutes, he has the potential to be among the leagues too centers. If he can do all that and make 2-3 threes a game at close to 37%, he could be a game breaker.
Seems simple enough, but these types of raw and supremely athletic players show up every couple of years and few are able to put it all together. For every Giannis there are 3 or 4 Aminu’s
Posted on 9/8/21 at 1:03 pm to TechTiger
Agree on Adams. He’s not washed, he’s just a terrible fit next to Zion. Adams makes his money setting screens, defending the paint and getting offensive rebounds. Tough to do the former for a team lacking quick guards who can get up 3’s off screens. Also pretty tough to work the paint offensively when the starting power forward attracts 4 defenders to the paint on every drive.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 1:07 pm to SCLSUMuddogs
quote:
Agree on Adams.
We also have not offered an extension to Val. We should honestly be looking to move him for a protected first of Hayes and Billy have shown enough to lock down the center position….or if we aren’t doing well by the deadline.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 1:26 pm to Honest Man
quote:
Everytime he says Val is pretty similar to Adams I cringe, Val can actually contribute on the court offensively and is basically what we had in David West here as far as impact yet Nola Jake treats him like a slightly better version of Steven Adams. It's just really weird how low he is on the Grizzlies best player from last year.
Even if it's based on fit, Val actually presents more of a threat stretching the floor and with more attempts can potentially have something there, but hey I'm no expert so I expect that I'm an idiot for thinking this.
I agree a lot of people on this board, myself included, have been thinking that Val is gonna be a huge upgrade to Adams. He will be an upgrade, but Val won't be a panacea for this team.
He is no David West as a shooter, driver or back to the basket shot creator.
I think it's fair to say he's gonna be similar to Adams but with a Jason Smith level added jumper.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 3:16 pm to GOP_Tiger
JV's usage rate would put him below naw, above zo.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 7:30 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
quote:
is he more similar to a healthy Adams? Maybe. We’ll see
No is he isnt you fricking casual. frick.
Posted on 9/8/21 at 11:12 pm to GOP_Tiger
I would have started him over Adams...
Jonas looks head and shoulders better than Adams on offense and just as effective a rebounder, actually more effective because he can play offense AND be in position to get an offensive rebound. Adams just stood under the goal clogging the lane waiting for someone to take a shot... a waste of space on offense.
Jonas looks head and shoulders better than Adams on offense and just as effective a rebounder, actually more effective because he can play offense AND be in position to get an offensive rebound. Adams just stood under the goal clogging the lane waiting for someone to take a shot... a waste of space on offense.
Page 1 of 2
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News