re: Kurt Cobain

Well we can probably put this thread to bed for another couple of months or so, until one of these inevitable threads pops up again...

Nirvana was over rated

or

Rank Seattle bands

happens at least 5-6 times a year

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*Actually, Pearl Jam's poor rep among indie kids stems from the root of the band and Mudhoney's creation story. Green River broke up because half the band wanted commercial success, and the other half wanted to stay "pure". One half formed Mudhoney, and the other half formed Mother Love Bone.Pearl Jam didn't live under the shadow of Cobain at first, but of Mark Arm.

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The STPs emergence on the scene prolly also hurt PJ's rep. That isn't fair, but I think it's probably the truth.

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Most importantly though, how was the sound that was coming from his playing?

Who had better brushstrokes? Titian or Willem de Kooning? who's work would you rather be hanging on your wall?

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I agree that people overrated guitar chops. I honestly don't care whether a guy is technically good or not. If he's good enough to make the song sound good, I'll ask no further questions.

Was Eric Clapton better than Jimmy Page at guitar? Based on my world view, nope.

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That's silly. Everybody who listened to Nirvana also listened to Pearl Jam and vice versa. You didn't have to choose one or the other.

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A lot did BUT people were choosing sides. I wasn't one of them. I enjoyed most of Nevermind. But when I heard Ten I was just hooked. It was Pearl Jam and everybody else in Seattle.

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But there's plenty wrong with thinking that people who don't love Pearl Jam arrived at that conclusion because "they invested in the wrong horse".

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I believe some of the venomous PJ hate is because of this. Cobain died. Those fans got screwed. "My band" is still putting on shoes that are sell outs. And Nirvana fans got robbed and that can make them bitter.

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I loved early Pearl Jam. And then I bought No Code. I never bought or otherwise acquired another Pearl Jam album.

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This would describe me. But with Pearl Jam Radio I just began to appreciate more of their songs more. Things you glaze through because it doesn't sound like Porch. I later grew to appreciate. Don't get me wrong I consider a few songs to be clunkers like The Fixer. But The End and Just Breathe are awesome IMO. Just getting older as the band does. They are less about angst and more about sadness and loss.

I am rambling.

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Was Eric Clapton better than Jimmy Page at guitar? Based on my world view, nope.

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Absolutely not

nah

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You're thinking of Guns 'n Roses.

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No, GNR probably had more in common with the glamour hair bands than did Jane's. Btw,Thank goodness Axl kept to his core after they tried that hair look with welcome to the jungle video.

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Jane's were bohemians who brought drag queens to their shows. They weren't 'gutter'.

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By the time Ritual came around I agree. Some of the early shows I saw, not so much.

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Nor were they grunge, although they were influential. They're a quintessential LA band all the way

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Which was my point. They had the grunge sound and attitude before that label. I can't dispute they were a quintessential LA band. But no where near the Poisons and Warrants of the day. Also, Janes if anything had more in common with the chili peppers with being an LA band than GNR.

Kurt Cobain could barely tune his guitar. He had trouble hitting his distortion pedal at the right time while recording Teen Spirit. A lot of his lyrics were laughable. Their most enjoyable recordings are covers. He sang out of his range all the time.

Him dying was the best thing that could have happened for his legacy.

I can't deny their influence. They just seemed to be the perfect face for the music that was reacting to the hair and glam of the 80's.

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The guyes in Jane's don't think so, at least not to nearly the degree musically you suggest. As a matter of fact they themselves say pretty much the exact opposite.

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The guys in Pearl Jam claim Fugazi as an influence despite sounding nothing like them. PJ has far more in common with Aerosmith than the bands they want to name drop.

Jane's Addiction was basically a proper glam rock band. Glam rock got perverted by hair metal, who didn't quite realize it was a joke. Jane's Addiction took the sound back to T Rex and the NY Dolls. But they are very similar to 80s hair metal both musically and aesthetically. They were a lot better than them, though.

G'n'R, BTW, was also heavily influenced by glam, though they had more punk influence. G'n'R is what happens when a 70s NYC punk band shows up by time machine to 1980's LA.

Every hair metal band was ripping off Johnny Thunders. The difference is, Jane's Addiction actually knew who Johnny Thunders was. Nirvana was ripping off Black Flag.

patrick, a lot of what you said isn't factual, but I will agree with you that nirvana came in at the right time and killed off all the bullshite 80's hair metal.