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Message
re: Serial is back, Episode 1 DUSTWUN
Posted on 12/10/15 at 10:38 am to 1999
Posted on 12/10/15 at 10:38 am to 1999
quote:
wasn't it produced by adnan's family? i thought it might be a little biased so i avoided it.
It's produced by:
Rabia - Adnan's family friend who is the person who brought Adnan's case to Sarah in the first place. She appears in the 1st episode of Serial.
Susan Simpson - an attorney who did a lot of in-depth work on Serial while it was on the air
Colin Simpson - law professor at USCe
They clearly are highly skeptical of the state's case...but they should be. It's a preposterously in-depth examination of the Adnan case as well as similar cases with relevance. It's way better than Serial and mostly makes me annoyed that Serial left out so many relevant things.
The takeaway? There is exactly a 0% chance the state's case transpired as presented to the jury.
0
Posted on 12/10/15 at 10:55 am to tccdc
quote:
mail keemp
this is when i knew it was real.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 2:55 pm to hawkeye007
quote:
did you listen to the undisclosed pod cast that follows up on season 1 of serial? it's much better than serial to me
Seriously? Undisclosed was almost unlistenable for me. They make absolutely zero effort to be unbiased and they don't bring anything new to the discussion that serial didn't talk about. Basically the whole point of all of their episodes is "Jay's story has some holes". Something that Jay himself has acknowledged.
But anyway, sorry to hijack. I listened to the first episode of season 2 and Sarah's story telling is as strong as ever but this story just doesn't interest me nearly as much. With season 1, whether Adnan was innocent or guilty it would still be crazy. If he's innocent, then holy shite an innocent man has been in jail all this time and Jay is a mastermind psychopath. If he's guilty, holy shite this murderer is a damn convincing liar and manipulator. With the new season, it's not really that crazy either way. If he deserted his platoon for selfish reasons, big deal. If he did for noble reasons, still not really a big deal. The only thing that would be really interesting is if he was working with the Taliban and his parents were in on it. But I seriously doubt that will come out even if it's true
Posted on 12/10/15 at 2:57 pm to hawkeye007
quote:
did you listen to the undisclosed pod cast that follows up on season 1 of serial? it's much better than serial to me
That was terribly done. Very hard to listen to. I know they weren't professional podcasters but still....was a rough listen for me. I couldn't make it all the way through.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 2:58 pm to Grim
quote:
I listened to the first episode of season 2 and Sarah's story telling is as strong as ever but this story just doesn't interest me nearly as much. With season 1, whether Adnan was innocent or guilty it would still be crazy. If he's innocent, then holy shite an innocent man has been in jail all this time and Jay is a mastermind psychopath. If he's guilty, holy shite this murderer is a damn convincing liar and manipulator. With the new season, it's not really that crazy either way. If he deserted his platoon for selfish reasons, big deal. If he did for noble reasons, still not really a big deal. The only thing that would be really interesting is if he was working with the Taliban and his parents were in on it. But I seriously doubt that will come out even if it's true
Kind of how I feel...wanted this to be another murder mystery.
But I'll give it a chance.
This post was edited on 12/10/15 at 2:59 pm
Posted on 12/10/15 at 3:05 pm to bwallcubfan
And another thing that made season 1 so good was the amount of access Sarah had. She basically just showed up in this town and pretty much everyone involved was at her disposal, including the guy in jail. Not only that, but they were just regular people who were willing to open up to her. With this case, we're talking about a high profile US military case involving a terrorist organization. She obviously can't go to the scene of the crime, she can't talk to Beau, and the FBI and CIA have no doubt already heavily investigated this. Are we really supposed to believe a journalist from a podcast is going to do what they couldn't?
Posted on 12/10/15 at 3:07 pm to Grim
couldn't agree more
Posted on 12/10/15 at 3:17 pm to Grim
quote:If that's what you took away from it, then it's clear you barely listened to it. It's fine, but don't act like your presenting a well-formulated opinion, when your factually wrong (they presented a bunch of new information; they focus on way more than Jay).
They make absolutely zero effort to be unbiased and they don't bring anything new to the discussion that serial didn't talk about. Basically the whole point of all of their episodes is "Jay's story has some holes". Something that Jay himself has acknowledged.
This post was edited on 12/10/15 at 3:18 pm
Posted on 12/10/15 at 4:53 pm to Grim
Good analysis.
I loved S1, but the shift to covering this kind of story is very disappointing.
I loved S1, but the shift to covering this kind of story is very disappointing.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 5:00 pm to DallasTiger11
I had concerns when I figured out that season 2 was going to be about Bergdahl. Seeing them taking on something politically charged worried me. I was afraid it was going to be an attempt to whitewash Bergdahl.
The first episode wasn't way over the top with any bias but it did give me cause for concern. Bergdahl's version of the story was front and center but Sarah did make it clear this was his version.
Too soon to tell if this is going to biased garbage. I'm out the second it becomes obvious.
The first episode wasn't way over the top with any bias but it did give me cause for concern. Bergdahl's version of the story was front and center but Sarah did make it clear this was his version.
Too soon to tell if this is going to biased garbage. I'm out the second it becomes obvious.
This post was edited on 12/10/15 at 5:07 pm
Posted on 12/10/15 at 5:03 pm to buckeye_vol
Undisclosed is pretty terrible. I finally quit on it basically because the people that make it don't have any talent for the medium. They jump around and have weird episodes that don't have much to do with anything. It's a tough listen. They need a good producer. It's basically just a bunch of non-linear rambling.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 5:25 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
If that's what you took away from it, then it's clear you barely listened to it. It's fine, but don't act like your presenting a well-formulated opinion, when your factually wrong (they presented a bunch of new information; they focus on way more than Jay).
I listened to every episode, mostly because the people from the S1 thread kept saying "Just wait til you get to the motorcycle episode!" or "Just wait til you get to the Tina episode!". But it disappointed every time. If you only wanted more evidence that the prosecution's case was a bit shaky, then I can see how undisclosed may appeal to you. But as far as evidence that in any way convinced me of Adnan's innocence? There was none. And like I said, the fact that the state's story had holes was already addressed in serial. You add in the fact that they never address the facts that look bad for Adnan (unless they're trying to discredit them) and the terrible production quality/organization and you've got a pretty shitty podcast
Posted on 12/10/15 at 6:24 pm to Grim
quote:So evidence that casts more doubt on his guilt, isn't evidence toward innocence?
But as far as evidence that in any way convinced me of Adnan's innocence? There was none.
quote:So because Serial shows some holes in the case, it's not noteworthy, interesting, or important that even more holes are found?
And like I said, the fact that the state's story had holes was already addressed in serial.
quote:So you were unsatisfied by new facts, but you wanted them to address old facts, which either are truly evidence of the guilty verdict or unimportant facts used to the DA used to create a false narrative. You're being inconsistent.
ou add in the fact that they never address the facts that look bad for Adnan
quote:I don't disagree that the less than stellar production value, but I enjoyed learning new facts so it made up for it.
the terrible production quality/organization and you've got a pretty shitty podcast
This post was edited on 12/10/15 at 6:26 pm
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:06 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:
So evidence that casts more doubt on his guilt, isn't evidence toward innocence?
To me it didn't cast any more doubt on his guilt. I had already accepted the fact that Jay lied about portions of his story
quote:
So because Serial shows some holes in the case, it's not noteworthy, interesting, or important that even more holes are found?
Maybe if you're ONLY looking at it from a legal perspective, but once you've accepted that an inconsistent recounting of the narrative doesn't discredit the most important parts of the story (the parts supported by the cell phone records), continuing to pick apart the inconsistencies does nothing to convince me of Adnan's innocence.
quote:
So you were unsatisfied by new facts, but you wanted them to address old facts, which either are truly evidence of the guilty verdict or unimportant facts used to the DA used to create a false narrative. You're being inconsistent
I was unsatisfied with the new "facts" because they were always either inconclusive or irrelevant. Perhaps I misphrased when I said "address the facts that look bad for Adnan". I don't necessarily mean they should've dedicated episodes to those facts, I just mean that any time they mentioned those facts it was only to try to discredit them, never considering that maybe, just maybe, Adnan is lying. That's part of what made Serial so much better (to me at least), Sarah didn't have a clear agenda. If something looked incriminating for Adnan, she said it straight up. You got the feeling that more than anything she just wanted to know the truth, whatever it was. The undisclosed guys so clearly want the truth to be that Adnan is innocent. For me that's a huge turnoff. Obviously it doesn't bother you and that's cool. Different strokes
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:33 pm to Grim
quote:Again we find out all sorts of sketchy information about the detectives, the suppressing of information that discredited the validity of the cell phone evidence, etc., and you act like Jay was the only person that they focused on.
To me it didn't cast any more doubt on his guilt. I had already accepted the fact that Jay lied about portions of his story
quote:A legal perspective on a legal case? That's not a perspective to consider.
Maybe if you're ONLY looking at it from a legal perspective
quote:You mean the cell phone records that are not valid? I thought you listened to the podcast.
inconsistent recounting of the narrative doesn't discredit the most important parts of the story (the parts supported by the cell phone records),
quote:Again focusing solely on Jay's story. Regardless, when the case is primarily built on a person's story, and more inconsistencies are reveled, logically more doubt should be cast.
continuing to pick apart the inconsistencies does nothing to convince me of Adnan's innocence.
quote:Well they are presenting it from a defense perspective. Is there anything they've presented that was factually incorrect? Besides Rabia, who has a personally connection, the other two are unlikely to risk their professional reputation by not presenting facts.
The undisclosed guys so clearly want the truth to be that Adnan is innocent.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:46 pm to Grim
quote:
They make absolutely zero effort to be unbiased and they don't bring anything new to the discussion that serial didn't talk about.
If that was your takeaway, then you are utterly hopeless.
Seriously...NOTHING NEW TO THE DISCUSSION? Are you literally insane?
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:48 pm to Grim
quote:
the prosecution's case was a bit shaky
A bit? Like their entire timeline being impossible? Like they're LYING to a 17 year old and to a judge about it being a capital crime? etc. etc.
Posted on 12/10/15 at 7:49 pm to Grim
quote:
(the parts supported by the cell phone records
I get it. Just carry on trolling.
Posted on 12/11/15 at 8:33 am to 1999
Listened to it last night. So far I'm interested. It's a story we still don't know a lot about. I hear they are also doing another story pretty soon after this one so I'm interested to see what that is.
Posted on 12/11/15 at 9:10 am to itawambadog
I enjoyed the first episode and think the story is pretty fascinating. We'll see how it plays out.
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