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re: Planning to watch every Oscar best picture winner
Posted on 12/5/20 at 7:55 pm to wildtigercat93
Posted on 12/5/20 at 7:55 pm to wildtigercat93
quote:
Most? Let’s calm down
Yes, most Best Picture winners are terrible. This is my hill to die on, I'd be happy to die on it. The Oscars are shite, and if you want proof of that look at the list of Best Picture winners and Best Picture losers.
1
Posted on 12/5/20 at 8:01 pm to Jay Are
quote:
I think Casablanca, The Apartment, The Godfather, and Unforgiven are the only best picture winners that actually top my best of the year lists from their respective years.
The fact that you didn't list Gone With the Wind or Lawrence of Arabia.....
From its inception to about 2002-03, I'd say dang near 80% of Best Picture winners were correct. Yes, an argument can be made that one picture can be ever so slightly better, but for the most they are at least a "Top tier" picture of the year, and yes, then it can be looked as a snapshot in time.
Since that point, however, the BP winner is usually nominated for "some reason," and not because it's the Best picture.
Chicago - Nominated because it was a modern, competent musical. Which was strange.
RotK- Look I love the films, but The Two Towers probably deserved the award the year before. RotK got it because of the "culmination" of the trilogy, not because it itself was the Best Picture. That was probably Master and Commander.
Million Dollar Babe. Female Lead. End of Story. The Aviator was the better nominee by a big margin.
Crash. We don't need to argue this one. Brokeback and GNGL were better nominees.
And so forth. Sure, before that point there are some slightly better films, but when the Oscars got more popular, they wanted to create contention and debate. Casablanca, Lawrence, Kwai, Sound of Music, Going My Way, Man for all Seasons - there are no debates those years.
This post was edited on 12/5/20 at 8:02 pm
Posted on 12/5/20 at 8:05 pm to Freauxzen
quote:
Crash. We don't need to argue this one. Brokeback and GNGL were better nominees.
I'd argue all of the other films nominated in the category were better.
Posted on 12/5/20 at 8:14 pm to RollTide1987
quote:I mean there were 30 better films that year at the very least, probably 80 or so films.
I'd argue all of the other films nominated in the category were bette
Posted on 12/5/20 at 8:54 pm to A Menace to Sobriety
quote:
Bad:
The Artist
Slumdog Millionaire
Moonlight
Spotlight
The Shape of Water
I thought Spotlight was very good. Have no issue with it winning that year. I wasn’t as high on The Martian as some people were
Posted on 12/5/20 at 9:16 pm to jg8623
Shakespeare in love wasn’t memorable at all to me. After watch in hit recently I couldn’t help but am how did this best saving private Ryan ????
Posted on 12/5/20 at 9:27 pm to Freauxzen
quote:
The fact that you didn't list Gone With the Wind or Lawrence of Arabia.....
I love movies, dude. I didn't make a mistake in my list.
Gone with the Wind came out the same year as Only Angels have Wings, Rules of the Game, Ninotchka, The Story of the Last Chrysanthemum, stagecoach, and Le Jour se Leve. 1939 was insane.
I love Lawrence, but it came out the same year as The Trial, The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, La Jete, The Exterminating Angel, and Harakiri. Sometimes truly great movies come out the same time as other truly great movies.
quote:
there are no debates those years.
If we're talking about snapshot of Hollywood, I absolutely agree. I really like or love most best picture winners (absolutely different story if we're talking all nominees).
But Going My Way? That's a weird one. It won in a year that produced Double Indemnity, Laura, To Have and Have Not, Arsenic and Old Lace, Gaslight, and The Miracle of Morgan's Creek. Going My Way might be your own personal hill.
quote:
Since that point, however, the BP winner is usually nominated for "some reason," and not because it's the Best picture.
Chicago made a massive amount of money and was critically acclaimed.
Rotk made a massive amount of. Money and was critically acclaimed.
Million dollar baby made a massive amount of money, in a genre where that makes little sense, was maybe the most critically acclaimed movie of its year, and came from Clint Eastwood, an academy favorite. (I personally severely dislike this movie.)
Crash was weird and was an example of a late in the game "campaign" push really working. It also made a massive amount of money.
None of these are weird in the context of how the Academy has and had been awarding best picture. Crash is the weirdest, for sure. And there's a version of this conversation where someone is arguing that Brokeback wins only because it features gay characters.
But, again, I'm not trying to say most best picture winners aren't good. I definitely don't think there's been a shift in who wins. We'll see what happens going forward. Moonlight (an indo darling) and Parasite (the first non-English language winner) are still outliers. I guess that could change, but shite like Green Book winning suggests they'll stay outliers.
Posted on 12/5/20 at 9:30 pm to Lawyered
quote:
Shakespeare in love wasn’t memorable at all to me. After watch in hit recently I couldn’t help but am how did this best saving private Ryan ????
Maybe my favorite Best Picture debate.
I'll say it again, outside of the first sequence, SPR is a fairly rote war film. It did very little new, relied completely on Tom Hanks' everyman appeal, and not on a great acting performance. It's maybe the 10th best Speilberg film. Maybe.
Shakespeare in Love is unique, memorable (most guys just don't like the romance), and was an interesting take on the most important writer the world has ever seen. And it had a GREAT ensemble performance.
To be fair, it's also a perfect Hollywood film - it's about the artist. It isn't the best film about the artist (Barton Fink - completely robbed its year), but it is a Top 5 film about the artist and the art he creates.
This post was edited on 12/5/20 at 9:36 pm
Posted on 12/5/20 at 9:35 pm to Jay Are
quote:
I love movies, dude. I didn't make a mistake in my list.
Gone with the Wind came out the same year as Only Angels have Wings, Rules of the Game, Ninotchka, The Story of the Last Chrysanthemum, stagecoach, and Le Jour se Leve. 1939 was insane.
I love Lawrence, but it came out the same year as The Trial, The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, La Jete, The Exterminating Angel, and Harakiri. Sometimes truly great movies come out the same time as other truly great movies.
Like I said, there are some where you could say one film is "sightly" better, but they are the very least in the Top Tier of those years with an argument to make. The same can't be said for post-2002. Most of those winners are NOT top tier.
That's also after the indie boom, where Independent Films truly became artistic rivals, but didn't get the street attention that is required for the modern BP per your point. And that's why there are so many better films that weren't even nominated.
quote:
Chicago made a massive amount of money and was critically acclaimed.
Rotk made a massive amount of. Money and was critically acclaimed.
Million dollar baby made a massive amount of money, in a genre where that makes little sense, was maybe the most critically acclaimed movie of its year, and came from Clint Eastwood, an academy favorite. (I personally severely dislike this movie.)
Crash was weird and was an example of a late in the game "campaign" push really working. It also made a massive amount of money.
None of these are weird in the context of how the Academy has and had been awarding best picture. Crash is the weirdest, for sure.
Fair point.
quote:
And there's a version of this conversation where someone is arguing that Brokeback wins only because it features gay characters.
Honestly, it was the Best film that year. By a big margin. Homosexual film or not. It was the Best film. I feel like it's an outlier because it DIDN'T win.
quote:
But, again, I'm not trying to say most best picture winners aren't good. I definitely don't think there's been a shift in who wins. We'll see what happens going forward. Moonlight (an indo darling) and Parasite (the first non-English language winner) are still outliers. I guess that could change, but shite like Green Book winning suggests they'll stay outliers.
Probably so.
Posted on 12/5/20 at 9:36 pm to pevetohead
quote:
Yes, most Best Picture winners are terrible. This is my hill to die on, I'd be happy to die on it.
We welcome your eternal repose. It reveals that you've seen very few best picture winners.
As far as your English Patient example goes, it's impossible to predict what will age like fine wine and what won't. They're deciding winners for movies released between (realistically) 8-2 months before the voting. This is a shitty criticism. The Oscars are fun if you're not judging for what will be remembered best 20 years into the future.
Hey, you know what won't be remembered as amazing in the future? La La Land, a derivitave inadequacy of a dead genre, meant to glorify said genre. Who's that for? I don't like Moonlight either, but it's structure and performances, at the very least, make it more interesting than what almost won.
It's best picture of that year based on what thousands of voters feel in that moment. Not one of us knows what will live on forever.
Posted on 12/5/20 at 9:55 pm to pevetohead
quote:
I'd say that 90% of Best Picture winners were flavor of the month movies that either didn't age well, or are totally forgotten
quote:
you'll find out that most Best Picture winners are actually fricking terrible movies
What absurd hyperbole a contrarian take for the sake of contrarianism
Most is more than half, no most Best Picture winners weren’t terrible. There are some that are bad for sure (The English Patient tops that list
) and you can argue some nominees were better than the winner but that doesn’t make the winner “terrible”This post was edited on 12/6/20 at 2:23 am
Posted on 12/6/20 at 12:32 am to H-Town Tiger
quote:
The English Patient tops that list
I don't know about you "The English Patient is the worst" guys. I understand it's long, and some find it boring. Long and boring is truly more offensive than the new sound incompetence of The Broadway Melody, the bland incompetence of Cimarron or Cavalcade, the overlong banality of The Great Ziegfield, or the bullshite political pandering of Gentlemen's Agreement?
The English Patient is worse than Crash? It's worse than the feel-good pandering of The King's Speech? It's worse than the fake progressive message of Green Book? If the answer to any of these questions is "yes", I truly do not understand your taste.
Posted on 12/6/20 at 12:52 am to A Menace to Sobriety
quote:
Spotlight
quote:
Slumdog Millionaire
Both were fantastic movies.
Admittedly do not know the other nominees off hand.
Posted on 12/6/20 at 12:54 am to Freauxzen
quote:
Moonlight
God LaLa Land deserved it so much more than this trash.
Posted on 12/6/20 at 12:58 am to Jay Are
The Oscars rarely had dud winners through ROTK.
Starting in 04, the Academy started doing what it never did before: put the message of the movie above the artistic and technical achievement. There are very few winners I agree with in the current era. It’s part of the reason, along with obnoxious political pandering, why I stopped watching.
Since ROTK, only two films should have won that did: The Hurt Locker (09) and Parasite (19). The rest are egregious choices that passed over films that were far more superior in craft or original in conception and execution.
I say skip the winners from 04 on except for the two above.
Watch instead:
04-The Passion of the Christ (not nominated), Finding Neverland and Sideways
05-Munich (Brokeback is just as heavy handed in its message and moralizing as Crash)
06-Letters From Iwo Jima and Casino Royale (yes, the Bond movie really was the BP that year)
07-The other four nominees are much better than No Country which isn’t even close to being the Coen brothers best film (unpopular opinion on this board)
08-The Dark Knight (not nominated, so egregious was this slight that the Academy expanded the number of nominees the following year)
10-The Kings Speech is a very good film but this was an exceptional year. Inception, The Social Network, Black Swan, The Fighter, and True Grit were all better films.
11-The Descendants
12-Life of Pi, Silver Linings Playbook, and Django (if you like Tarantino)
13-Gravity was fricking robbed. I’m still pissed off about it. It’s a film made for cinema and set the tone for an entire genre for the rest of the decade. American Hustle and Dallas Buyers Club are also better than 12 Years which is simply a remake of Schindler’s List set on a plantation.
14-Birdman isn’t bad. Keaton was robbed ( I can’t believe Eddie Redmayne is an Oscar winner). See Grand Budapest, Imitation Game, and Whiplash and you decide.
15-The Big Short. See Brooklyn for Ronan’s performance.
16-2013 all over again. La La Land is a visual revelation. It gets a lot of flack around here, but it should have won. No one had even seen (or heard of) Moonlight until it won. Hell or High Water is better too.
17-I’d go with Call Me By Your Name or Dunkirk but this was a really weak year. The Academy wanted to honor Del Toro.
18-An even weaker year. Skip it.
Starting in 04, the Academy started doing what it never did before: put the message of the movie above the artistic and technical achievement. There are very few winners I agree with in the current era. It’s part of the reason, along with obnoxious political pandering, why I stopped watching.
Since ROTK, only two films should have won that did: The Hurt Locker (09) and Parasite (19). The rest are egregious choices that passed over films that were far more superior in craft or original in conception and execution.
I say skip the winners from 04 on except for the two above.
Watch instead:
04-The Passion of the Christ (not nominated), Finding Neverland and Sideways
05-Munich (Brokeback is just as heavy handed in its message and moralizing as Crash)
06-Letters From Iwo Jima and Casino Royale (yes, the Bond movie really was the BP that year)
07-The other four nominees are much better than No Country which isn’t even close to being the Coen brothers best film (unpopular opinion on this board)
08-The Dark Knight (not nominated, so egregious was this slight that the Academy expanded the number of nominees the following year)
10-The Kings Speech is a very good film but this was an exceptional year. Inception, The Social Network, Black Swan, The Fighter, and True Grit were all better films.
11-The Descendants
12-Life of Pi, Silver Linings Playbook, and Django (if you like Tarantino)
13-Gravity was fricking robbed. I’m still pissed off about it. It’s a film made for cinema and set the tone for an entire genre for the rest of the decade. American Hustle and Dallas Buyers Club are also better than 12 Years which is simply a remake of Schindler’s List set on a plantation.
14-Birdman isn’t bad. Keaton was robbed ( I can’t believe Eddie Redmayne is an Oscar winner). See Grand Budapest, Imitation Game, and Whiplash and you decide.
15-The Big Short. See Brooklyn for Ronan’s performance.
16-2013 all over again. La La Land is a visual revelation. It gets a lot of flack around here, but it should have won. No one had even seen (or heard of) Moonlight until it won. Hell or High Water is better too.
17-I’d go with Call Me By Your Name or Dunkirk but this was a really weak year. The Academy wanted to honor Del Toro.
18-An even weaker year. Skip it.
This post was edited on 12/6/20 at 1:05 am
Posted on 12/6/20 at 1:14 am to bluestem75
quote:
06-Letters From Iwo Jima and Casino Royale (yes, the Bond movie really was the BP that year)
I'm not shocked Letters from Iwo Jima didn't win as it was released so late...
But from 2000-2006 - this movie should've been right up the Academy's alley.
Showing the non-American side of war...and frankly being the best war movie of that entire decade and America was at war.
Giving Scorsese the Best Picture for The Departed felt like a lifetime achievement award. That movie seems like a caricature of all things we like about Scorsese.
Letters is one of the best war movies of all-time. And it pushed Oscar buttons as being sympathetic to the enemy.
Posted on 12/6/20 at 1:38 am to Lsujacket66
Silence of the lambs
Posted on 12/6/20 at 2:20 am to Jay Are
quote:
The English Patient is worse than Crash? It's worse than the feel-good pandering of The King's Speech? It's worse than the fake progressive message of Green Book?
If the answer to any of these questions is "yes", I truly do not understand your taste.
I haven’t seen Crash, The Kings Speech or Green Book so I can’t comment on those.
I’ve seen every Best Picture winner from the 70s and 90s (the 2 best movie decades imo) and all but 1 in the 80s (never saw Out of Africa) I saw 7 from the 2000 but the only one I’ve seen since Slumdog was Spotlight which I think was fantastic. I actually have seen 6 that were nominated last year, I guess I can credit covid for that at a quick glance ive seen about 17-18 pre 1970
Of the Best Picture winners I’ve seen The English Patient is BY FAR the worst, and I’ve seen The Greatest Show on Earth. American Beauty is Citizen Kane compared to The English Patient I’d rather listen to Ted Striker tell his story than watch the English Patient again
This post was edited on 12/6/20 at 3:24 pm
Posted on 12/6/20 at 8:13 am to bluestem75
quote:
The Hurt Locker (09)
Wasn't that great IMHO. The best film that year was District 9.
Posted on 12/6/20 at 10:38 am to RollTide1987
quote:
Wasn't that great IMHO. The best film that year was District 9.
Another great year for film and sci fi. But I wanted Hurt Locker to win from the moment I saw it. Bigelow earned that Directing Oscar. So fitting for the first (and only) woman to win it. I would also put Avatar, Up in the Air, Precious, and Inglorious Basterds ahead of D9.
Great great year.
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