re: New Netflix docu-series "Making a Murderer" (Spoilers)

Just to update this list a bit and so more people can downvote me, these are the facts...

1. He was the last person known to see TH.
2. She was never seen after arriving at SA.
3. She never answered her phone after getting to SA.
4. She reported that SA freaked her out.
5. He initially said that she never showed up at his place.
6. SA called her cellphone number later that day leaving a message asking where she was.
7. SA later said oh no, she had in fact been there.
8. TH car with SA blood in it.
9. TH car with SA dna under the hood.
10. TH bones found in the burn pit intertwined with steel tire belts signifying that was burn location.
11. Bullet with TH dna on it found in SA garage.
12. Bullet was fired from SA gun.
13. TH car key found in SA bedroom.
14. TH phone and palm pilot found in burn barrel.
15. TH tooth found in burn pit.
16. Rivet from the jeans that TH was wearing in burn pit.
17. BD confessed to the rape/murder.
18. BD stated things in the confession that only someone there would have known.
19. The DNA found under the hood was only looked for after BD stated what was done in his confession.
20. The bullet that was found was found because of what BD said in his confession.
21. BD stated that the two of them planned this for days.
22. restraints used during the rape that BD described were recently purchased by SA.
23. TH car was found concealed in the Avery family salvage yard.
24. BD also said he did it to his mother.
25. BD cousin reported to police that BD confessed taking part in the rape and murder.
26. BD was moody and sullen for months after this episode. He had lost significant weight and this prompted his cousin to ask him what was wrong. The cousin says this is when he confessed to her.
27. BD said they used bleach among other solvents to clean the garage.
28. BD mother had given statement that that night she saw bleach stains on BD clothes.
29. When police conducted their search of SA house, the bed was absent of any sheets, pillow cases or a comforter.
30.Luminol tests of SA garage showed multiple areas of blood that had been cleaned up, though those blood stains could not be identified as Halbach’s.
31. The hole in the vacutainer containing SA blood was put there by the nurse who drew his blood.
32. Chain of custody records show that the evidence container was opened by Avery’s previous defense team (who represented him in his 1985 trial for rape) on June 19, 2002. The container was opened in order to extract evidence for comparison purposes, which ultimately cleared him of the rape for which he was falsely accused.
33. Police found clothes of BD with bleach stains.
34. Inmates from when he was initially imprisoned stated that he wanted to build a torture chamber to rape women.

There are additional pieces of evidence that paint a bleak picture of steven avery that I didn't include here because they didn't apply directly to this case.

I'm sure I will get downvoted for this list of facts of the case. But if people wish to discuss these facts, feel free and I will revise the list. I slightly revised the list saying that BD cousin said he confessed from just stated that BD confessed to his cousin because we are going on her word at this point. Her word that led to BD confession mind you. And that confession led to finding more evidence.

Just an interesting site for some to read with some of the evidence I listed here...

LINK

Anyways, there really are intertwining pieces of evidence backing up and explaining other pieces of evidence that correlates with much of the confession. I would love to have someone who desperately believes in his innocence come up with a list of facts, not suppositions, that support his innocence.

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Regardless of the outcome, it is easily apparent that the investigators coerced that confession from the kid. Damn they literally fed him info no one else knew in order to have him regurgitate it. It was clear he had no clue about head trama/shot, he made up stabbings/bloody scene, and none of what he came up with on his own was even remotely close to the evidence they found.

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So coerced is an interesting term here. I am not sure if what you mean is that they tricked him into confessing to doing something he didn't do (which is coercion) or they coerced the truth out of him.

The evidence supports the latter meaning of coercion. Because while BD was fed some facts, he also supplied many facts that lead to additional evidence being found and explained other findings. This means he knew things that no one, not even the police knew at that time.

In other words, parts of his confession directly led the police to additional physical evidence of the crime linking SA to the rape/murder. That means there is physical evidence supporting the fact that BD was involved.

If you wish to say that the police coerced him using lies and other things (which are constitutional) into tricking BD to confess by saying they knew more than they actually did, well that is ok. But that means he still did it.

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Legally you should ask to recuse yourself since there is a significant conflict of interest. Anything that causes you to think you cannot do your duty to provide a defense for Dassey is depriving him of his rights.

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That is what should be done. What is done is often different than what should be done. I am just saying his behavior can be somewhat explained.

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I don't think it's a crazy conspiracy. I think it's a very good possibility Avery did it. I just don't think the story was the same as what the prosecution used to lock them up. I think they relied on Dassey's statements to build a case, and I think 99% of his statements were BS. I think it was all coerced from a significantly unintelligent kid. The freaking pictures they had him draw were used as evidence! The guy was telling him what to draw.

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Just be careful. You are only listening to the portions of the confession picked out by the film. There are other portions where it is not like that.

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I do believe there was evidence that you couldn't turn your head away from for Avery (now the circumstances of which aren't necessarily bordering conspiracy, but certainly were obtained unethically and questionably). But, there is not much physical evidence for Dassey at all (that I'm aware of at least). His story leads one to think there would be mountains of physical evidence, but there was none. So instead of that disproving his story, they ignore it and go off of the confession. A confession which was relatively unethically taken on more than one occasion.

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Actually there is physical evdience supporting his confession. And there was physical evidence found only because of his confession. So this really true. The unethical portion also is not really a question. Legally, nothing unethical was done. However, morally, one could have a problem with the tactics used.

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I don't believe this. I would do what it took to get off the case for sure. But working to get your client behind bars without consulting with him should get you disbarred (his first interview on TV he makes a statement saying the kid was guilty, but was a victim of circumstance being around his uncle at an unfortunate time. He hadn't even spoken to Brendan yet!).

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I know many extremely moral people who would do exactly what LK did. I'm not saying it is the correct thing to do, but it is easily explainable and many people on this board would have done the same thing if they were in LK shoes.

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I'm asking if you understand the difference between oxygen and chlorine bleaches.

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of course

Does anyone have any problems with the 30 some facts I listed previously on this page?

And if everyone agrees with these facts, is there really room for reasonable doubt?

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But legally, everything about that confession was found to be legal by multiple courts.

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Interesting. So there was no problem with questioning a minor w/out the parents consent, w/o a lawyer present, and taking him out of school?

I guess he never asked for a lawyer, but it seemed clear that he did not understand the gravity of the situation as he was being questioned.

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of course

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So you accept that it's impossible for bleach to have been used in the manner you present as "facts".

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. Its pretty ridiculous that people want the information he provided thrown out just because of technicalities. The context of what was discussed prior to the recorded session is not known and makes it impossible to judge the validity of the taped confession.

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Again, I am 4 episodes in. The way everything has been presented thus far makes me question the whole confession.

Yes I understand he will confess things that the police didnt know that will lead to further evidence finding. Yes I understand the video is over multiple interviews.

BUT, he also denied it in the beginning, gave them info which was false/incorrect/had nothing to do with what happened. His "confession" is all over the place and was extremely inconsistent.

They interviewed him at school and several times before they made the tape. The reason they interviewed him is because he told his little girl cousin the story he told the police. She told police and they started questioning him. Both parties tried to say the lied about it after the fact, but they told the same stories basically linked to pieces of physical evidence. Maybe they are not capable of understanding the consequences but tough shite. They said they killed and raped somebody. Don't really understand the misguided sympathy for them. Its severely misguided.

There are transcripts of every interview investigators conducted with him that I'm aware of. I encourage you to give those a read as well.