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Message
re: New Netflix docu-series "Making a Murderer" (Spoilers)
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:39 pm to I B Freeman
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:39 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
They didn't even call a prosecutor and ask "what do you say to those that say you framed Avery?"
A "documentary" would have attempted to show the other side.
The filmmakers reached out to the prosecution and they wanted no part in it. You really can't be this dense.
0
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:43 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
They didn't even call a prosecutor and ask "what do you say to those that say you framed Avery?"
A "documentary" would have attempted to show the other side.
YES.THEY. DID.
LINK
quote:
Then there’s Kratz, the oft-smug, portly District Attorney who easily emerges as Making a Murderer’s villainous, mustache-twirling personification of The Man. Kratz declined to be interviewed for the film and earns a memorable coda when the series notes the unrelated sex scandal that got him fired after the Avery case. He publicly decried the series after its debut, and after irate fans bombed his Yelp page with negative reviews. More pointedly, he took to the media to slam Demos and Ricciardi for not including crucial evidence in their film that helped a jury convict Avery.
quote:
“We wrote a letter to Ken Kratz saying who we were, and that we were interested in including as many points of view as possible in the series,” Ricciardi said. “We offered [Kratz] the opportunity. We offered it to the Halbach family. We offered it to Penny Beernsten, who was the victim in the 1985 case, Tom Kocourek who was the Sheriff, Dennis Vogel, and other members of law enforcement.”
I provide links, you provide idiocy. All is well in the universe.
This post was edited on 1/5/16 at 10:44 pm
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:45 pm to tiggerthetooth
quote:
that Avery was not obsessed with the girl?
Never confirmed. Please post links.
Never confirmed?? they had testimony he insisted she be the photographer auto trader sent out and they introduced evidence he dial her phone repeatedly using the *67 feature to hide his number because he had called she much she was ignoring calls he knew was him.
quote:
that a bullet was found in his shed with her DNA?
Please read above the link I posted. I guess it shouldnt be a surprise your reading comprehension equals that of your listening comprehension.
The testimony went in. The juror accepted and the post about lab procedures did not say the DNA was not found on the bullet.
quote:
To believe he was framed you have to believe the cops murdered the girl.
Please provide the logic to this, because it simply isn't true. She could have been murdered by a third party and the cops used to opportunity to not just make their humiliation go away, but to keep themselves from having to pay a $36 million stipend. Just like they did the first time. They used the circumstance for their own agenda.
Only in the most cynical mind would someone believe this. The jury did not.
The only way you would believe Avery killed the girl was if you saw it yourself. You ignore and try explain away with wild theories the very basic evidence against the guy.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:46 pm to brmark70816
quote:
Ok, let's play it out. Her brother or her roommate or ex kills her. Where did they do it? How do they get any evidence back to Avery's place? How did they even know she had gone there? Were they following here all day?
I don't know about any of that because investigators didn't bother to check any of that out. They had their suspect and that's all they needed. A few people managed to "guess" two of her passwords, but you don't think someone could have figured out her plans for the day?
As far as transporting evidence, or anything else, her body had been in the cargo area of her vehicle. Not too difficult to guess how transporting evidence could have happened. Honestly, I'm more inclined to believe she was killed elsewhere and driven to Avery's property than I am to believe he killed her in his trailer, loaded her body into the back of her vehicle, then drove her 10 feet to his burn pit.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:47 pm to 13SaintTiger
quote:
Go back and read the responses to when you first posted that. You've posted the same shite for the past two days.
I did. None valid particularly yours.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:54 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
Never confirmed?? they had testimony he insisted she be the photographer auto trader sent out and they introduced evidence he dial her phone repeatedly using the *67 feature to hide his number because he had called she much she was ignoring calls he knew was him.
I thought it was quoted that Avery requested them to "send the same photographer as last time". Is it not possible he just wanted something routine? I have the same lady cut my hair every time. Doesn't mean I'm obsessed with her. She just does a good job and doesn't talk too much. Also, calling her "repeatedly" was three times on a day they had a scheduled appointment, wasn't it?
quote:
Only in the most cynical mind would someone believe this. The jury did not.
Clearly, some of them did.
One of the dismissed jurors who was present for deliberation:
quote:
Early on, the jurors took a vote: seven innocent, three guilty and two undecided.
quote:
He seemed like he was honestly innocent.
quote:
Adds Mahler: "Since the trial ended, I've had a hard time sleeping over it because of that feeling of innocence. I keep going over and over it. It's still in the back of my head. What if I would've stayed?"
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:54 pm to tiggerthetooth
quote:
We offered it to the Halbach family. We offered it to Penny Beernsten, who was the victim in the 1985 case, Tom Kocourek who was the Sheriff, Dennis Vogel, and other members of law enforcement.”
You believe the filmmakers made a proper effort to examine the positions of these people?? No way. Given their motive--to make a film called "Making a Murderer" do you really think they wanted to hear things that disputed that a murderer was not "made".
The same Wisconsin Innocence program that wanted to help him in the rape conviction refused to help post conviction on the murder conviction.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:58 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
they had testimony he insisted she be the photographer auto trader sent out
Who made this testimony? Link? Where in the video?
quote:
her phone repeatedly using the *67 feature to hide his number because he had called she much she was ignoring calls he knew was him.
He called 3 times.
quote:
he testimony went in. The juror accepted and the post about lab procedures did not say the DNA was not found on the bullet.
What are you talking about? You aren't even making sense. READ THE LINK I POSTED EARLIER. READ IT. If you read the link, you'd stop repeating this.
quote:
Only in the most cynical mind would someone believe this. The jury did not.
Says who? You? You're obviously not any authority on the matter, so I don't see why I should give this any attention.
And yes, the jury did not, and if you had been paying attention, several jurors have already made comments on what went on behind the scenes. You are a lazy seeker of answers, but really diligent at posting half-arse opinions with no factual backing.
quote:
The only way you would believe Avery killed the girl was if you saw it yourself.
You keep posting things you have no idea about. You don't even know my first name, where I live, how old I am, or any basic facts, yet somehow, you can know what you claim to know? This is absurd on all levels.
quote:
You ignore and try explain away with wild theories the very basic evidence against the guy.
Which evidence do you consider "basic"? Please provide the evidence and please include links.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:58 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:
As far as transporting evidence, or anything else, her body had been in the cargo area of her vehicle. Not too difficult to guess how transporting evidence could have happened. Honestly, I'm more inclined to believe she was killed elsewhere and driven to Avery's property than I am to believe he killed her in his trailer, loaded her body into the back of her vehicle, then drove her 10 feet to his burn pit.
If she was killed somewhere else, why would they transport her in her car? Where could they have burned her body? There would have to be a kill site, to separate and prepare the remains. Did they have access to that type of place? How would they know where to put everything to set him up and how did they get his sweat and blood to complete the scene?
You see, the set up only exists if you include the cops. Which means you have to admit that the cops worked with one or all of the other guys you want to implicate. You have to follow the whole thing out to it's logical conclusion.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 10:59 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:
One of the dismissed jurors who was present for deliberation:
quote:
Early on, the jurors took a vote: seven innocent, three guilty and two undecided.
quote:
He seemed like he was honestly innocent.
quote:
Adds Mahler: "Since the trial ended, I've had a hard time sleeping over it because of that feeling of innocence. I keep going over and over it. It's still in the back of my head. What if I would've stayed?"
Wrong. He was not there for the entire deliberation. He was there for four hours of deliberation--hardly time to discuss the judge's jury charge and review the law involved.
Every level of the Wisconsin court system says this was a fair trial and Avery had adequate representation. The FEDS refused to hear any appeals he had on constitutional grounds.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:02 pm to tiggerthetooth
quote:
quote:
they had testimony he insisted she be the photographer auto trader sent out
Who made this testimony? Link? Where in the video?
It was in the film. Don't believe if you don't want too.
quote:on the day of the murder.
her phone repeatedly using the *67 feature to hide his number because he had called she much she was ignoring calls he knew was him.
He called 3 times.
quote:You certainly are no authority.
Says who? You? You're obviously not any authority on the matter, so I don't see why I should give this any attention.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:04 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:
Only in the most cynical mind would someone believe this. The jury did not.
Clearly, some of them did
You got a link where a juror said he believed the cops conspired with a third party murderer as you said was possible?
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:05 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
You believe the filmmakers made a proper effort to examine the positions of these people??
Yes. They state as much, and do you have any reason to believe they didn't? I bet you don't even know their names without looking it up. You are in no position to judge their character.
quote:
The same Wisconsin Innocence program that wanted to help him in the rape conviction refused to help post conviction on the murder conviction.
Maybe because the evidence was all fricked up? There was no DNA testing when SA was initially convicted of rape. In this case, there was an attempt at DNA testing, but it was all fricked up. The innocence project specifically works with findings of new evidence, or in many cases that took place prior to the 1990s, there wasn't the opportunity for DNA testing.
LINK
quote:
Since its founding, WIP has successfully freed twenty wrongfully convicted individuals. Although WIP focuses on cases within Wisconsin, it also offers assistance in cases around the United States. WIP accepts cases with potential DNA evidence or other types of newly discovered evidence that support a claim of actual innocence.
Again. I provide links and sources, you provide shite.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:07 pm to brmark70816
quote:
Where could they have burned her body?
There was a burn site outside of the Avery's property where bones were found. Did you miss that.
I will also say, why are you insinuating the cops couldn't have had anything to do with this?
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:09 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
It was in the film. Don't believe if you don't want too.
I dont recall it. Who testified? You claim to know, so why are you unable to recall who it was on the stand?
quote:
on the day of the murder.
Whats your point? 3 times isn't exactly a red flag.
quote:
You certainly are no authority.
Thats why I provide links/sources. Also why I ask you to do the same, but you refuse.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:09 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
How do you have a fire and not notice a body in it?
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:09 pm to I B Freeman
quote:
Given their motive--to make a film called "Making a Murderer" do you really think they wanted to hear things that disputed that a murderer was not "made".
You do realize they started making this less than a month after he was arrested? This evolved from a decade of work, not from some made up agenda you want to tag on.
quote:
The same Wisconsin Innocence program that wanted to help him in the rape conviction refused to help post conviction on the murder conviction.
Where do you get this stuff? They are currently investigating his case as we speak.
Anything else you'd like to be wrong about?
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:11 pm to tiggerthetooth
quote:
WIP accepts cases with potential DNA evidence or other types of newly discovered evidence that support a claim of actual innocence.
Again. I provide links and sources, you provide shite.
Can you not read what that says?? They didn't see any new evidence to support a claim of actual innocence---that would include any evidence of a conspiracy to frame the guy.
It is your belief I suppose that every member of two sheriff's departments, one city police department, FBI lab people, judges at three levels of Wisconsin judiciary, and murderers who actually murdered the lady conspired to get Avery and they all keep their month shut?? That this massive conspiracy that you know about was ignored by the FEDS?
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:14 pm to DisplacedBuckeye
quote:
Where do you get this stuff? They are currently investigating his case as we speak.
Anything else you'd like to be wrong about?
Last episode showed a copy of a letter from them to Avery saying they were not going to try to help him.
Posted on 1/5/16 at 11:14 pm to brmark70816
quote:I was trying to finish this thread before making a comment.
I thought it was a pretty fascinating breakdown. I didn't say he was an expert or anything, just gives a bit of a different view. Seriously, your bias and knighting is starting to reach another level. As for the guy and his "credentials"..
And I was able to disregard some of your absurd posts that essentially implied that the "prosecution carry the burden of proof.
However, that fact that you find this pointless linguistic analysis interesting is even more telling. Breaking down the somewhat scattered syntax of a poor, uneducated person under stress has no logical basis.
How many times do we hear people, including Avery, say, "I didn't do nothing?" We don't foolishly think,"the double negative means you did something." Well at least logical people don't think that, unless they're joking.
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