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re: First look at Galadriel in Amazon’s The Lord of the Rings series
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:30 pm to Bard
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:30 pm to Bard
quote:
Tolkien pulled dwarves from Nordic and Germanic folklore. Neither was known for racial diversity in their folklore.
No doubt, both of those were almost completely homogeneous. But not 100%. As far and wide as the Vikings traded and raided you don't think their gene pool expanded any?
The idea that one black Dwarf existing bothers so many people is confounding.
And like I said before, I agree that Hollywood has often gone too far to go out of their way to switch up races and genders on purpose for characters that weren't described as such and I think it's stupid.
This isn't one of those cases.
This post was edited on 2/10/22 at 12:33 pm
2
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:34 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
No doubt, both of those were pretty homogeneous. But not completely. As far and wide as the Vikings traded and raided you don't think their gene pool expanded any?
So you are arguing that dwarves went out into this world, came across a tribe of black dwarves, mated with one, and then brought back this singular interracial dwarf to their land, and this is the character we are looking at?
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:34 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
Exactly. Tolkien didn't specify their race or if they have multiple skin tones.
That means there's I can't offer you an explanation for why there should be black Dwarves and you can't explain why there shouldn't be.
I just did, right there. I’m sorry, have we lost all common sense. I know exactly where Tolkien got his inspiration from the Dwarves, and it was not in South Africa where he was born. People are wrong when they say dumb shite like this:
I’m sorry, but Tolkien is not made for everybody. If you try to make a work of art everyone will love, in the end you end up making a work no one truly loves and is a work with no convictions. To paraphrase a great villain:
This post was edited on 2/10/22 at 12:51 pm
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:35 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
OMLandshark
Trust me. No one on this board is surprised that you feel the way you do.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:36 pm to Hester Carries
quote:
So you are arguing that dwarves went out into this world, came across a tribe of black dwarves, mated with one, and then brought back this singular interracial dwarf to their land, and this is the character we are looking at?
Yep. That's what I'm saying. Critical thinking is clearly one of your strong suits.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:38 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
You stated that the relationship would be about racial politics and how the story is going to be overshadowed by racial identity.
So yes, you're already dismissing the interracial relationship because you're assuming it's going to be "woke" in nature rather than be about the legitimate and long-used story line of two people that aren't allowed to be together because of their race or creed.
Nope. It's going to be overshadowed by color instead of being about the actual story, which is almost certainly about an elf and a human. It may not be "woke" at all, but what I said will still be true.
This post was edited on 2/10/22 at 12:39 pm
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:38 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
Yep. That's what I'm saying. Critical thinking is clearly one of your strong suits.
Ok then. Without saying “why not” explain to me how a black dwarf exists in this world. Show your work.
You are choosing not focus on how world-building works, in the quintessential world-building universe, because you want to feel inclusive.
This post was edited on 2/10/22 at 12:40 pm
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:38 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
No doubt, both of those were almost completely homogeneous. But not 100%. As far and wide as the Vikings traded and raided you don't think their gene pool expanded any?
The idea that one black Dwarf existing bothers so many people is confounding.
I also can’t say with 100% certainty that the Millennium Falcon didn’t show up at the Battle of the Last Alliance and shoot down the Fell Beasts. Tolkien just forgot to mention that.
Do you not see how far you can go down this idiot rabbit hole? “Well he didn’t explicitly say that this didn’t happen.” Yeah, because he didn’t count on the world getting this insane that he’d have to clarify something every reader will innately understand.
This post was edited on 2/10/22 at 12:43 pm
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:38 pm to Hester Carries
quote:
Ok then. Without saying “why not” explain to me how a black dwarf exists in this world. Show your work.
Show me why they can't.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:40 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
Show me why they can't.
“Prove a negative”
Ok dude.
Ive already pointed out several absurd things that are implied by a black dwarf. You haven’t addressed any of them.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:42 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
Show me why they can't.
Why can’t the ponies from My Little Pony come in and save all the good Numenorians? I mean Tolkien didn’t say if cartoon ponies came to the rescue, but he didn’t say they didn’t either.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:42 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
I also can’t say with 100% certainty that the Millennium Falcon didn’t show up at the Battle of the Last Alliance and shoot down the Fell Beasts. Tolkien just forgot to add that.
Do not see how far you can go down this idiot rabbit hole. “Well he didn’t explicitly say that this didn’t happen.” Yeah, because he didn’t count on the world getting this insane that he’d have to clarify something every reader will innately understand.
What the frick are you talking about. He explained what happened in that battle. So yes, if the Falcon showed up that would be as idiotic as you thinking of that example. What I'm talking about is a physical description of a fantasy character. In his own works he described how elves looked. If there was a black actor playing one contrary to how Tolkien portrayed them, then sure, you rage all you want.
No such thing existed for the dwarves.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:43 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
How about simple common sense over the fact that Tolkien based them on Norse myths and Germanic folklore. We’re a few seasons away if someone saying “Well Tolkien never explicitly said that there wasn’t a transvestite non-binary half elf sired by Celebrimbor that fought in the Battle of the Last Alliance, so what’s the big deal?” All the Woke are capable of is corrupting and destroying art. They are incapable of creating it.
Dead on. "He didn't explicitly say that" is the worst possible argument that could be made here.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:44 pm to theGarnetWay
Do you think two red-haired white dwarves, can create a black dwarf child?
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:45 pm to Hester Carries
quote:
“Prove a negative”
Ok dude.
Ive already pointed out several absurd things that are implied by a black dwarf. You haven’t addressed any of them.
No dude.
It's a work of fiction that has never described the dwarves skin tone.
You assume that they're all supposed to be white and then ask me to offer what? My own fan fiction to explain how a group of black dwarves immigrated to Middle Earth?
As it's a work of fiction that doesn't describe the dwarves skin tone, there's no way you or can say that dark skinned dwarves weren't already there and created with the lighter skin ones.
It's not that hard.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:46 pm to Hester Carries
quote:
So this dwarf is an immigrant dwarf?
Immigrant isn't an ethnicity
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:46 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
What the frick are you talking about. He explained what happened in that battle. So yes, if the Falcon showed up that would be as idiotic as you thinking of that example.
Barely. He went into it for like four pages but the battle went on for seven years, so how do you know it didn’t show up and do that? Tolkien can’t mention everything that happened in that battle.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:47 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
It's a work of fiction that has never described the dwarves skin tone.
He didn't have to.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:48 pm to OMLandshark
Of fricking course this thread turned into this.
Posted on 2/10/22 at 12:48 pm to theGarnetWay
quote:
No dude.
It's a work of fiction that has never described the dwarves skin tone.
You assume that they're all supposed to be white and then ask me to offer what? My own fan fiction to explain how a group of black dwarves immigrated to Middle Earth?
As it's a work of fiction that doesn't describe the dwarves skin tone, there's no way you or can say that dark skinned dwarves weren't already there and created with the lighter skin ones.
It's not that hard.
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