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re: Black mirror season 4 SPOILERS thread that NOBODY asked for
Posted on 1/9/18 at 5:39 am to Napoleon
Posted on 1/9/18 at 5:39 am to Napoleon
quote:
saw uss callister. Liked it but, I felt bad for Meth Damon. I mean those people sucked IRL. Even the intern punked him and who didn't torture their SIMs?
There are 2 issues at play. First the sentience level of these virtual people and if that affords them any rights like #metoo.
Second is are you allowed to use the likeness of real people. You can’t just make a video game featuring LeBron or Tom Brady’s likeness without their consent for example. It’s all just personal rather than commercial use until some idiot posts his Jennifer Lawrence sex video online and people start asking about the EULAs they always click OK on without reading. (In my more realistic version of how this happens a virtual person is built off of interaction with apps. Kind of like how Facebook has been able to build personal profiles of us. )
This post was edited on 1/9/18 at 5:45 am
1
Posted on 1/9/18 at 7:39 am to TigerinATL
quote:
Second is are you allowed to use the likeness of real people. You can’t just make a video game featuring LeBron or Tom Brady’s likeness without their consent for example. It’s all just personal rather than commercial use until some idiot posts his Jennifer Lawrence sex video online and people start asking about the EULAs they always click OK on without reading. (In my more realistic version of how this happens a virtual person is built off of interaction with apps. Kind of like how Facebook has been able to build personal profiles of us. )
Can you not make something in their likeness, or can you simply not make money off of it? I believe it is the latter, no? I could make a simulation of Jennifer Lawrence, to use your example, and use it for myself all day long. But it becomes illegal once I try to profit from her likeness. No?
Posted on 1/9/18 at 8:34 am to CocomoLSU
quote:
I could make a simulation of Jennifer Lawrence, to use your example, and use it for myself all day long. But it becomes illegal once I try to profit from her likeness. No?
More or less, but just like YouTube takes down personal homemade videos with copyright infringing music in them to avoid legal issues, commercial services can't be involved and to create this tech they'd have to be unavoidably involved. Again, my premise is that rather than use DNA, which has no information about a person's memory or experiences, a more technically accurate way to make the USS Callister happen is to make a digital simulation of people based on their history of personal interaction with some sort of social app(s).
Imagine 20 years from now where Siri, Google or Alexa is even more integrated in our daily lives and watches and records everything we do. They'd know our mannerisms, our likes, our dislikes, things we say about people behind their back. The gaming company is a subsidiary of one of those bigger tech companies with the virtual assistant and has personal profiles of people that they keep secret and use for advertising/monetization purposes. Instead of stealing DNA he hacks these profiles to build game characters on his private server.
I just don't see a way this kind of thing would ever be available to the public because the users giving up all their personal information would revolt. That's not to say you couldn't have a USS Calister situation where an employee does something like this, and then maybe a data breach puts a lot of people's personal profiles out on the dark web, but that's the only way I would see this ever becoming accessible.
Posted on 1/9/18 at 9:39 am to TigerinATL
quote:
More or less, but just like YouTube takes down personal homemade videos with copyright infringing music in them to avoid legal issue
They don't.
All youtube does is rely an algorithm that autoflags them and for copyright and demonetizes them. They won't pull the video unless the copyright owner asks for a takedown and 9/10 they won't.
The interesting thing about this, I read a few weeks ago a reddit user figured out how to faceswap video in real time and created "fake porn" videos that had people like taylor swift, scarlett jo, maisie williams, gal godat, etc and it's easy now for anyone to do it but he released his tools and tutorial. The videos arent perfect but it's damn convincing because it's use real time celeb face video data and pasting it to a pornstar.
Is it illegal? No. Immoral? Probably.
AI-assisted face porn Vice article.
Tools and tutorial to do it yourself
This post was edited on 1/9/18 at 9:41 am
Posted on 1/9/18 at 10:02 am to musick
That fake porn could be considered parody like a presidential impersonation on Saturday Night Live. They probably just need to put the right legalese at the front of the video.
That also is essentially reverse engineered from publicly available information. Maybe in the future people will post enough personal information publicly that you could do what I'm proposing by scraping their instagram feed and get into this legal gray area. The scraped public version wouldn't be a true clone like we saw in the USS Callister, but it may be good enough for most people's purposes. I could see a Kodi of VR providing "experiences" with celebrities and Instagram models and even normal people with enough publicly available data.
The uses for this stuff are not all terrible and immoral. Maybe you can simulate a job interview to practice before the real one. Or police could simulate a hostage negotiation with a terrorist in real time.
That also is essentially reverse engineered from publicly available information. Maybe in the future people will post enough personal information publicly that you could do what I'm proposing by scraping their instagram feed and get into this legal gray area. The scraped public version wouldn't be a true clone like we saw in the USS Callister, but it may be good enough for most people's purposes. I could see a Kodi of VR providing "experiences" with celebrities and Instagram models and even normal people with enough publicly available data.
The uses for this stuff are not all terrible and immoral. Maybe you can simulate a job interview to practice before the real one. Or police could simulate a hostage negotiation with a terrorist in real time.
This post was edited on 1/9/18 at 11:31 am
Posted on 1/9/18 at 11:28 am to TigerinATL
just thought of something. was the alien and the rockstar villian still left alive in the 'hack' where meth damon ended up at the end? what happened to them? the others made it through the wormhole but what about the poor people left behind?
Posted on 1/9/18 at 11:42 am to CAD703X
quote:
just thought of something. was the alien and the rockstar villian still left alive in the 'hack' where meth damon ended up at the end? what happened to them? the others made it through the wormhole but what about the poor people left behind?
The villain guy was shown on the ship in the last scene, the black lady was back to normal, and Jimmi Simpson's character was back as well despite being blasted out of the engine, so I assume they all ended up on the ship at the end, even the one that was turned into the first monster.
Posted on 1/9/18 at 11:47 am to CAD703X
One thing I wasn't quite sure of about the end of callister...aren't the clones still in the game? Once they went through the wormhole/patch in the game, they are now online (as in, not in the private version of the game only controlled by the todd) and we even hear other game users communicating wiht them.
That's great and all, but they're still in teh game trapped right? Granted they aren't "controlled" by anyone and have free will to travel around and explore and talk to people and all that, but they're still friggin trapped for eternity right?
That's great and all, but they're still in teh game trapped right? Granted they aren't "controlled" by anyone and have free will to travel around and explore and talk to people and all that, but they're still friggin trapped for eternity right?
Posted on 1/9/18 at 11:51 am to WG_Dawg
quote:
That's great and all, but they're still in teh game trapped right? Granted they aren't "controlled" by anyone and have free will to travel around and explore and talk to people and all that, but they're still friggin trapped for eternity right?
Yep.
Unless they can delete themselves once they are in the cloud version?
Posted on 1/9/18 at 12:28 pm to LSUBoo
quote:
The villain guy was shown on the ship in the last scene, the black lady was back to normal, and Jimmi Simpson's character was back as well despite being blasted out of the engine, so I assume they all ended up on the ship at the end, even the one that was turned into the first monster.
ah makes sense. its been a couple weeks since i watched this and i forgot guitar guy was on the ship. i was thinking they left the other monster behind on that planet.
Posted on 1/9/18 at 12:43 pm to WG_Dawg
quote:
That's great and all, but they're still in teh game trapped right? Granted they aren't "controlled" by anyone and have free will to travel around and explore and talk to people and all that, but they're still friggin trapped for eternity right?
They aren't "trapped" there, they were born there. They are digital clones, not biological clones. They've never existed IRL and the only way for them to exit The Matrix would be to have their consciousness transferred. Considering the shite show, medieval state that consciousness transference is in for season 4, I'd rather stay in the game.
Posted on 1/9/18 at 12:47 pm to TigerinATL
Beta stages of San junipero technology.
Posted on 1/9/18 at 1:34 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
They aren't "trapped" there, they were born there. They are digital clones, not biological clones. They've never existed IRL
That may be true in the "physical" sense, but it's not like they only know that world. Mcpoyle knew all about his IRL son, they all know about their real world jobs, they know exactly how they came to exist in this world from meth damon using their DNA, etc. So even though they essentially spawned into existence in that world they would still basically be trapped there.
I wonder if since the system is live and public if they can just "exit game" like meth damon could and end it?
Posted on 1/10/18 at 9:07 am to WG_Dawg
Watched metalhead last night. Pretty disappointed, it just seemed extremely pointless and kind of a waste of time.
-Why was a box of teddy bears so highly guarded?
-I get this is supposed to be some kind of post apocolyptic world but is there no other way to safely acquire teddy bears?
-Who put these dogs there to protect the boxes, and why?
-In the tree...she drains the thing of battery by making it turn on, stand up for a second, then power back down. Supposedly these dogs can run for miles, sense radio waves, use heat imagery to detect humans, shoot a gun, all thsi other stuff...but simply turnign on for a few seconds then turning off drains him down? Unless she had a few thousand candies in her bag that seems unlikely.
-Who is she communicating with on the radio?
I by no means expect every BM episode to give us every.single.answer to everythign going on in that universe, but this one was just kind of a jumbled mess. It feels like the writers had the idea for a killer robot dog but nothing else, so just hastily put together a story with nothign else to go on other than the dog.
I'm through all new eps besides black museum which I'll watch tonight. Excited about that one.
-Why was a box of teddy bears so highly guarded?
-I get this is supposed to be some kind of post apocolyptic world but is there no other way to safely acquire teddy bears?
-Who put these dogs there to protect the boxes, and why?
-In the tree...she drains the thing of battery by making it turn on, stand up for a second, then power back down. Supposedly these dogs can run for miles, sense radio waves, use heat imagery to detect humans, shoot a gun, all thsi other stuff...but simply turnign on for a few seconds then turning off drains him down? Unless she had a few thousand candies in her bag that seems unlikely.
-Who is she communicating with on the radio?
I by no means expect every BM episode to give us every.single.answer to everythign going on in that universe, but this one was just kind of a jumbled mess. It feels like the writers had the idea for a killer robot dog but nothing else, so just hastily put together a story with nothign else to go on other than the dog.
I'm through all new eps besides black museum which I'll watch tonight. Excited about that one.
Posted on 1/10/18 at 9:23 am to WG_Dawg
quote:
-Why was a box of teddy bears so highly guarded?
The dog being in the warehouse wasn't that odd. Being on a shelf right behind the one box they go for was. It was just shoddy writing, they wanted a way for them to not be discovered until they got the box and took the lazy writing way out.
quote:
-I get this is supposed to be some kind of post apocolyptic world but is there no other way to safely acquire teddy bears?
When the threat that created the apocalypse is still out there doing work, yes, teddy bears would be hard to acquire. I really didn't like this episode because this is a story we've seen many times before and there no longer is any shock value in "they risked all that for a teddy bear!". We've seen enough apocalypse based movies/shows now that our reaction is "they risked all that for a teddy bear?"
quote:
-Who put these dogs there to protect the boxes, and why?
This was my least favorite episode because it really seemed to be more focused on surviving the dog than why the dog was there in the first place. Someone posted a link to an interview and the original idea was to have these dogs controlled by people and then after he killed someone you'd see him go give the baby a bath like killing another human remotely was nothing. That would have made it interesting. Killer Robots being able to kill humans is well trod territory. But how does a society that thinks football is too violent get back to the kind of blood lust we haven't seen since Roman times when people would watch death matches in the Colosseum? I find that interesting.
Posted on 1/10/18 at 9:30 am to WG_Dawg
Theory on the teddy bears in Metalhead. Remember the monkey in Black Museum. Perhaps, this also happened with a bunch of bears before the laws about the cookies and senses and all that. Maybe that is why they were trying to find them. Rescuing old loved ones that got locked away in the bears and bring them back and put them in a robot like in Be Right Back.
Posted on 1/10/18 at 9:31 am to WG_Dawg
Didn’t care for Metalhead, either. I found it illogical and uninteresting.
Posted on 1/10/18 at 9:36 am to wareaglepete
quote:
Theory on the teddy bears in Metalhead. Remember the monkey in Black Museum. Perhaps, this also happened with a bunch of bears before the laws about the cookies and senses and all that. Maybe that is why they were trying to find them. Rescuing old loved ones that got locked away in the bears and bring them back and put them in a robot like in Be Right Back.
It honestly just felt like they were looking for an easy way to make the audience go “aww, the little dying boy just wanted a teddy bear” and didn’t really care if it made sense.
This post was edited on 1/10/18 at 9:37 am
Posted on 1/10/18 at 9:48 am to TigerinATL
quote:
This was my least favorite episode because it really seemed to be more focused on surviving the dog than why the dog was there in the first place.
the dogs are all over. did you not see the big walls put up around that house where the people killed themselves?
it made perfect sense to me; i can see the dogs being used to deliver packages, etc..mundane things to the point they disappear into the background.
then there is some war and the army reprograms them to go after the enemy (what better way to track your enemy than a dog exploding with a clusterbomb of trackers?) and at some point the dogs are unable to distinguish between 'good' and 'bad' guys and suddenly the war is irrelevant since the dogs are going after everyone.
i thought the story was great as is and left lots to the imagination.
Posted on 1/10/18 at 9:55 am to CAD703X
quote:
i thought the story was great as is
eehhh...as the viewer why shoudl I care? Most of the great BM episodes pull you in and have you care about someone or something. This episode didn't, I mean sure I wanted the lady to live or whatever, but I don't know anythign about her so what does it matter? We have essentially zero backstory so we don't feel a connection. Just seemed pointless.
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