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Why hasn't the NBA Supermax Worked?
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:02 pm
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:02 pm
quote:
So far, the supermax has not worked as intended. Some teams had misgivings about offering their franchise players -- Jimmy Butler in Chicago, Paul George in Indiana, DeMarcus Cousins in Sacramento -- supermax deals that would carry them past their primes. The relationship between the Spurs and Kawhi Leonard deteriorated before San Antonio was ready to offer Leonard the deal.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:08 pm to JabarkusRussell
Because there are only a few guys in the whole league worthy of supermax money, and even then, committing that much money to one players means you can't mess up with any other contracts at all.
ETA: Also as people are pointing out, sometimes you'd rather win and make 150 million than have 200 million.
ETA: Also as people are pointing out, sometimes you'd rather win and make 150 million than have 200 million.
This post was edited on 12/20/18 at 1:41 pm
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:11 pm to JabarkusRussell
Supermax just helps small market teams keep drafted talent which isn’t the trend in the current nba. Currently, players want to join super teams and it’s better for small market teams to trade these players rather than let them walk in free agency. Trading a player under a supermax can’t be easy.
This post was edited on 12/20/18 at 1:12 pm
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:12 pm to JabarkusRussell
AD will be a huge test case to see if it will ever work without changing the current system.
If he leaves, he'll be passing up $70 million. That's more than "I'll make it up in endorsements" money.
If that happens, the NBA can go frick itself because that would mean small market teams legitimately have 0 shot.
If he leaves, he'll be passing up $70 million. That's more than "I'll make it up in endorsements" money.
If that happens, the NBA can go frick itself because that would mean small market teams legitimately have 0 shot.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:15 pm to JetsetNuggs
Davis would lose more than $70 million because of the tax rates in California compared to Louisiana.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:30 pm to JabarkusRussell
NBA should do away with truly limiting what players can make in free agency. Allow the market to dictate what players can get, it would allow a lot more teams to find an avenue to compete with big market teams. The "new" CBA rules and tax system only further separated the small market from the big market teams, because like others have alluded to or said as much. A small market team that drafts a player in even the Top-7 or so picks, and they even come close to max money with their performance in the first 4 years, they have to pay them the max even if their true value is nowhere near it because their being no alternative.
Granted the luxury tax has tremendously helped make all of the teams more profitable, but more and more teams are going to find themselves in prolonged tanking situations. Magic are now in year 7 of a complete and total rebuild and they may be worse off than 7 years ago.
My point is still allow after 4 years, teams to maintain RFA and/or teams that have bird rights be the only ones that can offer a fifth year, but allow any team to say offer a Lebron $80 million a year if they so choose.
Granted the luxury tax has tremendously helped make all of the teams more profitable, but more and more teams are going to find themselves in prolonged tanking situations. Magic are now in year 7 of a complete and total rebuild and they may be worse off than 7 years ago.
My point is still allow after 4 years, teams to maintain RFA and/or teams that have bird rights be the only ones that can offer a fifth year, but allow any team to say offer a Lebron $80 million a year if they so choose.
This post was edited on 12/20/18 at 1:31 pm
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:35 pm to JetsetNuggs
Having a salary cap is one thing, but a cap on individual player salaries is terrible for small market teams.
Imagine if New Orleans could throw all of their money (whatever money that may be) at Davis, and not some arbitrary number that is capped.
However, the union loves the max salaries for players because it means more money for everyone else in the league. Max salaries are a good deal for the majority of NBA players, so they're not going away.
Imagine if New Orleans could throw all of their money (whatever money that may be) at Davis, and not some arbitrary number that is capped.
However, the union loves the max salaries for players because it means more money for everyone else in the league. Max salaries are a good deal for the majority of NBA players, so they're not going away.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:40 pm to JabarkusRussell
I heard someone say when players are eligible for their supermax, them dudes are already banking. So they would rather take less and win them some chips
Posted on 12/20/18 at 1:47 pm to slackster
What Im saying it really sad. I think though the only shot is if the players who truly control the league go for no max individual player salaries out of greed. John Wall and Chris Paul's last years of their respective new deals are crazy and the teams know it but they really had little choice.
Did something crazy if you picked a team of 10 with guys making between $8-12M (excluding players still on rookie contracts) they would probably be a Top-4 seed in either conference. But there currently is not a single way a small market team can go about building depth like that, which is really the only way they could one day compete with a team that has 2-3 superstars.
Did something crazy if you picked a team of 10 with guys making between $8-12M (excluding players still on rookie contracts) they would probably be a Top-4 seed in either conference. But there currently is not a single way a small market team can go about building depth like that, which is really the only way they could one day compete with a team that has 2-3 superstars.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 2:05 pm to JabarkusRussell
Let's be honest here, the only person on that list that won't make a large part of that money is Cousins. Just like Davis in NO. Super Max or not, these guys are making obscene money that it just doesnt matter.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 2:05 pm to 21JumpStreet
quote:
I heard someone say when players are eligible for their supermax, them dudes are already banking. So they would rather take less and win them some chips
this
we should be happy for guys like that who sacrifice a few millions for a better shot at a ring. that's what they all play for.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 4:39 pm to JabarkusRussell
I think they should tweak the system so that drafted players take a smaller hit to the salary cap.
Like AD's supermax gets paid out like a supermax, but in terms of the salary cap, it's the same cap hit any other team would take on if they signed him in FA. You'd have to average it over the years. For example, AD's supermax would average out to 46/year for 5 years. But what if you paid him 46, but the cap hit was only say 36 (approximately what he'd be paid on a 4 year FA max). Basically you get the big benefits roster wise of a "hometown" discount without the player having to sacrifice actual dollars.
The problem with the Supermax is that there's only one or two guys who are truly truly worth it. AND you have to be borderline perfect in every other facet of roster construction because you have so much money tied up in one guy. If you have a supermax player on your team, a guy making 12-15 million, when he should be making 7 or 8 kills you. Since you have so little cap space left over, any dollar wasted is magnified.
Like AD's supermax gets paid out like a supermax, but in terms of the salary cap, it's the same cap hit any other team would take on if they signed him in FA. You'd have to average it over the years. For example, AD's supermax would average out to 46/year for 5 years. But what if you paid him 46, but the cap hit was only say 36 (approximately what he'd be paid on a 4 year FA max). Basically you get the big benefits roster wise of a "hometown" discount without the player having to sacrifice actual dollars.
The problem with the Supermax is that there's only one or two guys who are truly truly worth it. AND you have to be borderline perfect in every other facet of roster construction because you have so much money tied up in one guy. If you have a supermax player on your team, a guy making 12-15 million, when he should be making 7 or 8 kills you. Since you have so little cap space left over, any dollar wasted is magnified.
This post was edited on 12/20/18 at 4:39 pm
Posted on 12/20/18 at 4:44 pm to JohnnyKilroy
NBA needs a hard cap with the player earning the most not counting.
Would spread out the talent.
Would spread out the talent.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 4:51 pm to JabarkusRussell
They should allow every team to have one player not count against the cap so you can pay them whatever you want. Every other player can be kept within a cap.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 5:20 pm to JabarkusRussell
quote:
Davis would lose more than $70 million because of the tax rates in California compared to Louisiana.
Good thing he's coming to Dallas to play with Luka.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 6:33 pm to JabarkusRussell
If the NBA wanted parity, and they damn well should, look at the success it brought the NFL, they could easily make it easier for teams to keep their drafted players.
Also, the talent is pretty spread out right now outside of GSW, which was a perfect storm of so many things. Those teams which caused terrible ratings in the Finals Are becoming a relic of the past with the new influx of talent in the league.
These super teams are not good for long term growtH. They will slowly decay all the markets that aren’t the major ones if every season starts with “these guys are so stacked, they’d need to get hurt for anyone else to have a shot.” Like I’ve said before, these other dynasties in the past that drew these ratings got pushed by other teams. Lebrons Heat lost two finals. The Lakers fell apart after the 3 peat but almost lost series to the Blazers and Kings. The bulls got pushed by a few teams during their reign. The Lakers and Celtics went back and forth and even had Detroit step in for a couple years.
The league doesn’t need a team we expect to go 16-1 or 16-2 in the playoffs healthy at the beginning of each season. People are already getting tired of the crap.
The fun and draw in dynasties is for everyone else who isn’t on the bandwagon to have a good time rooting for them to lose. Everyone has a vested interest. I loved rooting against the Heat and the Kobe/Shaq Lakers. I have no interest in the postseason now. The Rockets made it fun last year for a series unexpectedly, but the Finals were a joke.
Also, the talent is pretty spread out right now outside of GSW, which was a perfect storm of so many things. Those teams which caused terrible ratings in the Finals Are becoming a relic of the past with the new influx of talent in the league.
These super teams are not good for long term growtH. They will slowly decay all the markets that aren’t the major ones if every season starts with “these guys are so stacked, they’d need to get hurt for anyone else to have a shot.” Like I’ve said before, these other dynasties in the past that drew these ratings got pushed by other teams. Lebrons Heat lost two finals. The Lakers fell apart after the 3 peat but almost lost series to the Blazers and Kings. The bulls got pushed by a few teams during their reign. The Lakers and Celtics went back and forth and even had Detroit step in for a couple years.
The league doesn’t need a team we expect to go 16-1 or 16-2 in the playoffs healthy at the beginning of each season. People are already getting tired of the crap.
The fun and draw in dynasties is for everyone else who isn’t on the bandwagon to have a good time rooting for them to lose. Everyone has a vested interest. I loved rooting against the Heat and the Kobe/Shaq Lakers. I have no interest in the postseason now. The Rockets made it fun last year for a series unexpectedly, but the Finals were a joke.
Posted on 12/20/18 at 8:39 pm to JabarkusRussell
Chris Paul is stealing from the Rockets
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