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Started By
Message
re: Question RE GT
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:40 am to RiseUpATL
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:40 am to RiseUpATL
quote:
But since our 2014 season, I have seen recruiting dip to devoid levels.
It's never been great due to STRONG academic standards.
quote:
We have zero talented on DL or LB. we have decent DBs. Our OL can’t block a fart.
Hard to recruit with STRONG academic standards.
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My personal opinion is that PJs offense is killing this program
It has kept the program relevant despite trying to be an IVY league school in FBS football.
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Kids don’t want to play in it offensively
Which kids? The ones who can't handle the academic workload.
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kids don’t want to practice against it defensively
Means no one wants to play against it either.
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PJ is terrible with the media
He's not full of BS like half of the new breed of coaches. He's actually honest behind a mic.
It seems that our yearly opponents have learned to adapt to playing against us and we no longer catch folks by surprise.
Ditto just about every coach who stays at a program for as long as he has.
quote:
I get GT has tough academic standards but I don’t buy it. Stanford, Notre Dame etc. also have tough standards
Stanford and Notre Dame don't play in the ACC. What would their record be every year if they did?
quote:
GT is in Atlanta in a recruiting hotbed
How are the public schools? How many of the hotbed recruits can even get into GT?
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Other GT fans that went to the school say that the academic restrictions need to be relaxed and there needs to be new major introduced that don’t require calculus and other tougher classes that other schools don’t require.
Truth.
quote:
But surely, there are plenty of talented kids that can handle intro to calculus.
You ever heard half of the top recruits speak in public? They can barely handle English.
Georgia Tech hasn't been in the top echelon of college football since integration. The one year they "won" a national championship was one of the weakest years in the history of Division I football, and if they had played Colorado head-to-head it would have been a bloodbath.
As long as Georgia Tech is a premier academic institution they will never be a premier athletic institution, because great athletes typically don't want to be great students.
What you should do is marvel that they have been hovering around the .500 mark for the last half century instead of being the doormat like Vanderbilt has been.
How many Orange Bowls has Georgia Tech played in since Bobby Dodd? How many of those were coached by Paul Johnson?
If you want to back a winner, find a school where half the roster is made up of 4th year "undecided" majors.
If you want to root for the good guys, root for Georgia Tech.
4
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:48 am to NikolaiJakov
quote:
How many of the hotbed recruits can even get into GT?
It's less getting into Tech and more keeping them eligible.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:49 am to RiseUpATL
quote:
I get GT has tough academic standards but I don’t buy it. Stanford, Notre Dame etc. also have tough standards
With GT being a technical institution there are less subjective majors. Traditionally, it's harder to pass classes where there is only one right answer as opposed to good grades for making a strong argument.
Also hard to recruit premiere athletes to run the triple option.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:01 am to Riggle
For all the reasons discussed, GT will only be able to recruit 2 and 3*s. So, if they try and run a pro style offense it is almost guaranteed that they will lose to other programs.
When PJ was hired, the theory was that GT could run the triple option and this could offense could help bridge the talent gap.
Since he was hired, the spread has become all the rage. It accomplishes the same thing as the triple option BUT kids love playing in that offense. So GT needs to hire a Texas gunslinger for a coach and reboot their recruiting.
When PJ was hired, the theory was that GT could run the triple option and this could offense could help bridge the talent gap.
Since he was hired, the spread has become all the rage. It accomplishes the same thing as the triple option BUT kids love playing in that offense. So GT needs to hire a Texas gunslinger for a coach and reboot their recruiting.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:05 am to RiseUpATL
quote:
My question to the other fanbases that frequent this board is what do you see as wrong with GT?
what a question.
It's been said and it's obvious to anyone with eyes that PJ's system is the biggest issue currently. That works at GA Southern or navy where you aren't playing against much competition, and on occasion in the big leagues it can be an equalizer against teams with better talent. But PJ is facing some really talented teams which his offense sucks against, but they're also losing to mediocre teams. He's been there 10 years, his offense isn't new or unique anymore and people have 9 years of film on it. In addition to it being easier now to scheme against, as you mentioned they are woefully devoid of talent. Bad combo. To make matters even worse if tha'ts possible...tech is in a crappy situation because you're looking at AT LEAST a 2-3 year total rebuild from the ground up when PJ leaves or gets fired. The new coach will have to rebuild the entire roster entirely from scratch, they will probably win 2-4 games per season until he starts getting his guys in. Really bad situation for htem.
Now, let's go back to before PJ. O'leary and somewhat gailey proved that you can do alright at tech if you can recruit. They weren't ever going to win a title but a 10 win season was absolutley in range bc they had some studs (it didn't hurt that UGA was down during this time). So first and foremost tech needs to recruit, which obviously isn't some huge revelation. But for whatever reason they've never really been lights out at recruiting.
After canning PJ, the first thing they need to do is completely overhaul their image. Now I'm not a marketing guy so I have no idea how to go about that, but they need to essentially disassociate from what they are now. Now when kids think tech they think "nerds, foreigners, in downtown, really hard classes, boring program". There's no reason an ACC team in downtown atlanta can't attract at least a handful of 4* every cycle. And academics isn't the major hurdle some people think, considering stephon marbury could get in and stay eligible. Keeping with the image change, they need to get a YOUNG energetic recruiter that will go more to a wide open passing attack. Again, copmletely distance yourself from the current model. Their last 2 coaches Johnson adn gailey are 2 old farts that remind you more of the uncle you see twice a year at holiday dinner instead of someone you want to commit to spending 4 years of your life being close to. Get someone with some charisma that can fire people up about coming to tech. They also need to sell people on passing. What sounds better, "come be the next Joe Hamilton or Calvin Johnson" or "come be the next taquon marshall or qua sercy"?
But at any rate, at the end of the day...they will always be the 5th best sports draw AT BEST in teh state behind UGA/braves/falcons/united. So they may be beyond saving.
This post was edited on 9/25/18 at 9:23 am
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:11 am to dlc83
quote:
So GT needs to hire a Texas gunslinger for a coach and reboot their recruiting.
Cause that's working so well at Arkansas.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:27 am to NikolaiJakov
quote:
Cause that's working so well at Arkansas.
1) he's in his first year, you have no idea if it will end up being a good hire
2) arkansas plays in an exponentially tougher league adn divsion than tech does
3) arkansas was in a position of being "kinda good" most years and wanted to go to the next level. Tech is in the cellar so pretty much any offensive change would be in their best interest.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:31 am to NikolaiJakov
quote:
As long as Georgia Tech is a premier academic institution they will never be a premier athletic institution, because great athletes typically don't want to be great students.
Then explain how GT experienced past success in basketball.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 10:27 am to WG_Dawg
Thank you for the well thought response. Sort of echos my sentiments.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 10:29 am to c on z
It doesn’t take many bodies to field a competitive basketball team. You get a stud or two damn good players, and you are good to go.
High academic standards never hurt Duke, Virginia, Stanford, Vanderbilt, etc from having good basketball teams.
High academic standards never hurt Duke, Virginia, Stanford, Vanderbilt, etc from having good basketball teams.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 10:39 am to RiseUpATL
quote:
My question to the other fanbases that frequent this board is what do you see as wrong with GT?
Being able to get top recruits. There was a big scandal about poor graduation rates at GT so the admin cut back on many of the academic exceptions (for admission to GT) that used to be in place for football and basketball.
So now all our athletes have to actually be able to get into GT and the product has suffered
quote:
I get GT has tough academic standards but I don’t buy it. Stanford, Notre Dame etc. also have tough standards.
Stanford and ND have fairly big liberal arts offerings. It's kind of easy to push athletes along when they are writing papers and you can have someone be lenient with grades. All majors at GT require calculus. If the answer is x^2/2 then it's x^2/2 there's no way to BS that.
This post was edited on 9/25/18 at 10:40 am
Posted on 9/25/18 at 10:44 am to PJinAtl
quote:
quote:
Other GT fans that went to the school say that the academic restrictions need to be relaxed and there needs to be new major introduced that don’t require calculus and other tougher classes that other schools don’t require.
Isn't this one of the reasons that GT opened their School of Business? Not that getting a BSBA is easy, it is certainly less difficult than getting an engineering degree.
The Business school there is ranked #28 in the country. By no means an easy option when compared to the education requirements of the teams we play.
quote:
The offense has to change. Was it the USF game where they had only attempted like 2 passes in one half? No way you can be successful in a P5 conference playing like that.
With these athletes and our recruiting limitations, we aren't going to win playing pro-style either. Everyone forgets the Chan Gailey days. I think at our peak the best Paul Johnson days are better thant he best Chan Gailey days (and Chan had Calvin Johnson to work with too)
Posted on 9/25/18 at 10:45 am to c on z
quote:
As long as Georgia Tech is a premier academic institution they will never be a premier athletic institution, because great athletes typically don't want to be great students.quote:
Then explain how GT experienced past success in basketball.
Previously the athletic admin had given more exceptions, but there was a big graduation rate scandal and those were cut back. But now since that rate has climbed back up, there's some movement to start allowing those again
Posted on 9/25/18 at 10:51 am to dlc83
I'm not sure that the triple option isn't just an easy scapegoat.
Right not, GT's biggest issue is that they directly compete with Georgia, Clemson, Alabama, Auburn, UF and FSU among others for talent. That is as competitive a recruiting state as there is and GT lacks the same tradition, facilities and has the academic barrier.
Johnson's issues have coincided with those other schools firing up their recruiting. I'm not really convinced a spread with inferior talent goes much better than triple option with inferior talent.
Right not, GT's biggest issue is that they directly compete with Georgia, Clemson, Alabama, Auburn, UF and FSU among others for talent. That is as competitive a recruiting state as there is and GT lacks the same tradition, facilities and has the academic barrier.
Johnson's issues have coincided with those other schools firing up their recruiting. I'm not really convinced a spread with inferior talent goes much better than triple option with inferior talent.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 10:58 am to Rep520
So basically GT is fricked in terms of ever being an annually ranked team? I see a hole that GT can’t climb out of and perhaps I need to find a big boy program to follow if I want that experience.
The way I see it, GT has given up on the fans so why shouldn’t I give up on them until the commitment is made. Just seems like GT grads are okay with the results as long as GT is “going it the right way” by graduating players and having a system that gives the middle finger to conventional offenses. As a simple sidewalk fan who couldn’t care less about their academics that’s tough for me to accept as a reason to continue in mediocrity. Even Duke is recruiting better and has consistently gotten a little better.
The way I see it, GT has given up on the fans so why shouldn’t I give up on them until the commitment is made. Just seems like GT grads are okay with the results as long as GT is “going it the right way” by graduating players and having a system that gives the middle finger to conventional offenses. As a simple sidewalk fan who couldn’t care less about their academics that’s tough for me to accept as a reason to continue in mediocrity. Even Duke is recruiting better and has consistently gotten a little better.
This post was edited on 9/25/18 at 11:05 am
Posted on 9/25/18 at 11:03 am to NikolaiJakov
quote:
Stanford and Notre Dame don't play in the ACC. What would their record be every year if they did?
They'd be the second and third best programs in the ACC behind Clemson
Posted on 9/25/18 at 11:05 am to VADawg
Correct. The ACC is dog crap this year outside of Clemson. Stanford and ND would rake in the ACC. Can’t believe that argument is even being made.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 11:08 am to ctalati32
quote:
With these athletes and our recruiting limitations, we aren't going to win playing pro-style either. Everyone forgets the Chan Gailey days.
Chan's problem was he hitched his wagon to a functional retard at QB who regressed every season. Those GT teams had really good defenses, solid running games, and the best WR in the country.
Reggie Ball accelerated Gailey's downfall.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 11:18 am to NikolaiJakov
quote:
As long as Georgia Tech is a premier academic institution they will never be a premier athletic institution, because great athletes typically don't want to be great students.
What you should do is marvel that they have been hovering around the .500 mark for the last half century instead of being the doormat like Vanderbilt has been.
How many Orange Bowls has Georgia Tech played in since Bobby Dodd? How many of those were coached by Paul Johnson?
If you want to back a winner, find a school where half the roster is made up of 4th year "undecided" majors.
If you want to root for the good guys, root for Georgia Tech
I don't understand why you academic-touting nutjobs act like there is some kind of honor in having a half arse football program. You should strive to be the best both in the classroom and on the field. I know that sounds like some NCAA propaganda bullshite, but there are good schools with tough academic requirements who manage to have successful athletic programs. If you're just shooting to get by why even have a Division 1 program?
Posted on 9/25/18 at 11:24 am to TulaneFan
This is I’m afraid where I am. I don’t give two shits about the academics and I don’t think GT and about 3/4 of the fanbase cares all that much about football. So there is a fundamental issue with a sidewalk fan being a fan of GT.
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