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EvrybodysAllAmerican
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Member since Apr 2013
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Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
Any of you real estate tycoons know how this works?

My understanding is if you want to develop wetlands, you have to pay into a wetlands bank that will purchase other land to be set aside as wetlands. So if you have 20 acres of wetlands, and just want to build 1 house on it, (but would clear the whole 20 acres of forest), would you have to pay into the wetlands account for the whole 20 acres? or just the space where you are actually building? And how is the cost determined?

thanks


Bear Is Dead
LSU Fan
Monroe
Member since Nov 2007
4565 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
Its credit based. From my understanding, you just purchase so many credits based on what the potentially developed land is worth to the environment. I believe there are proximity restrictions, meaning that the credits to be used have to arise from property in mitigation bank somewhat near the subject development. There are plenty of experts on this as it was a real hot venture up my way several years ago.


EvrybodysAllAmerican
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Member since Apr 2013
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re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
Thanks, i guess what im mostly interested in finding out is whether there is a (wetlands cost)difference between somebody coming in and developing a whole neighborhood on the 20 acres vs. someone wanting to build just one house, and keep the acreage vacant (but still cut most of the trees).

edit: I reread your post, i guess you're saying the credit might be different depending on what you are doing to the property? Any idea how to go about finding out the cost?
This post was edited on 9/16 at 1:43 pm


poule deau
Member since Jan 2009
1316 posts
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re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
See here.

My understanding is that, for the last couple of years, mitigation has been very difficult, if not impossible, for wetlands in south La.


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BZ853
Navy Fan
Member since Aug 2013
1857 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
Talk to the Army Corps of Engineers. It is based off of how much trees you clear and how much surface you make impervious.

Im a civil engineer in Auburn and we have to set aside 2 sq. ft to not be touched for every 1 sq. ft. of disturbed wetland.


Bear Is Dead
LSU Fan
Monroe
Member since Nov 2007
4565 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
quote:

Any idea how to go about finding out the cost?

I think the credits are just sold on the open market. So its depends on whatever they are selling for in your area.


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EvrybodysAllAmerican
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Member since Apr 2013
6004 posts
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re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
quote:

Im a civil engineer in Auburn and we have to set aside 2 sq. ft to not be touched for every 1 sq. ft. of disturbed wetland.


Sounds expensive!


BZ853
Navy Fan
Member since Aug 2013
1857 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
Granted ours has to be on site. So it really only affects what we can squeeze on site. We try to avoid at all costs.


eng08
LSU Fan
Member since Jan 2013
3470 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
What kind of wetlands?

Cypress tupelo swamp? Saltwater marsh?

Cost can range from $40k-$60k+ per acre depending on type.

If you are only looking at building a single house then the footprint may not be too bad or expensive.

You should probably consult an engineer that specializes in this. Paying him a little bit to get a good realistic cost estimate would be a wise step.

Also, with the new "wetlands determination rules" if you live in the southern half of LA, your property could be classified as a wetland. The more recent regulations on how they count the identifiers were loosened up. I don't like it or agree with it at all.


EvrybodysAllAmerican
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Member since Apr 2013
6004 posts
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re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
Its just a hypothetical at this point. I dont own the property. Im not sure what type of wetlands, its in Livingston Parish.
There's some property nearby that sold a while back,but the sale fell through when the wetlands cost was too expensive. I think the prospective buyer was wanting to develop it into commercial or a neighborhood. I was curious if the wetlands cost would be cheaper if a buyer wanted to only build 1 house instead of developing a whole neighborhood. Sounds like it might be too expensive to even pursue.

thanks eveybody for the input.
This post was edited on 9/16 at 3:22 pm


TrueTiger
LSU Fan
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
34214 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
quote:

its in Livingston Parish.


the corps is watching that Parish after the hurricane work debacle


EvrybodysAllAmerican
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Member since Apr 2013
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re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
Is that good or bad for wetlands prices?


TrueTiger
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Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
34214 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
quote:

Is that good or bad for wetlands prices?



I don't know about the effect on price, it just means they are looking harder for violations in that area.

It seems that they had problems in the past that LP ignored. LP kept violating so now the corps is a bit miffed.

Non-mechanized clearing is not really a violation. You can handsaw and use mules but no machines.

Another big problem is the fill. You can't bring in dirt or gravel to build up the land.


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kingbob
LSU Fan
Sorrento, LA
Member since Nov 2010
45604 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
actually (though I could be mistaken),I believe any land over a half acre requires you to mitigate 2 to 1 (i.e. pay for 2 acres for every 1 acre disturbed) and over 1 (or maybe 5?) acre(s) you have to mitigate 3 to 1.


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TigerTatorTots
New Orleans Pelicans Fan
The Safeshore
Member since Jul 2009
74626 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
quote:

Im a civil engineer in Auburn and we have to set aside 2 sq. ft to not be touched for every 1 sq. ft. of disturbed wetland.
I was told it is a 3/1 ratio here in SE LA


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BParishLSU
LSU Fan
Sulphur
Member since Oct 2006
131 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
I have been dealing with this exact situation in SW LA. The process is tedious and very slow. I purchased my property in early January and actually just got my permit from the Corps today. I bought 7 acres and it was determined that 22% was wet but that it was intermingled throughout the whole property so technically I didn't have any dry land according to them. Your first step is to file an application with the Corps and then it is a back and forth process that they will walk you through. Your offset is purchased through a mitigation bank depending on the type of wetland your property is...mine was bottom land hardwoods. The cost was around $18k/acre, but they sell partial acreage.
The corps has their own formula for offset, but basically you would figure the area that you would impact (driveway, house including usable yard) and multiply it by the wetland percentage of the area that you are using. I would get a square footage total and divide it by the square footage in an acre to get the percentage of acreage that I needed to offset. Based on the type construction you are doing, the Corps will set a multiplier to it....it could by 1 to 1, 1.5 to 1, 2 to 1, or even higher. That is how much offset you would pay.


EvrybodysAllAmerican
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Member since Apr 2013
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re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
Good info, thanks


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islandtiger
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2012
1670 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
I am pretty deeply involved in the mitigation business. You typically only have to mitigate for the actual footprint of the damage, plus any collateral damage your development might create. As others have indicated, the requisite mitigation is based on a comparison of the quality of the site being developed vs. the restoration potential of the bank (i.e., you will need to purchase different number of credits from different banks).

Cutting trees from a forested wetland is exempt from 404 permitting IF the activity is part of "normal silvicultural practices." If you clearcut with no intention of replanting, you expose yourself to possible Corps of Engineers enforcement action. Why would you want to clear 20 acres around your homesite if you have no plans to develop?

Mitigation is available for most any wetland proposed for development in LA but be prepared to pay some serious cash.


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islandtiger
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2012
1670 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
2:1 is actually pretty good these days. As for cost, in LA wetland mitigation runs from a low of $10,000 - $15,000 per acre to $40,000 or more per acre...cheap by some state standards. As others have said, the price is set in the marketplace...the more competition in a given watershed, the better. Feel free to negotiate and be sure to get bids from as many banks as possible.


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Porker Face
Arkansas Fan
Taylor Swift's 1989 Tour; Backstage
Member since Feb 2012
11610 posts

re: Question regarding property that is considered wetlands?
As any engineer can attest, dealing with USACE is a several month long process btw


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