- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: The LSU Tigers’ Inventive Running Game
Posted on 10/28/14 at 9:46 am to Rex
Posted on 10/28/14 at 9:46 am to Rex
quote:
Hill took the toss power for a few long runs.
quote:
Correct. It's a different play.
I would love to hear your explanation as to how the play described in that link is different than the toss power. Please explain specifically.
0
Posted on 10/28/14 at 9:50 am to Rex
You can't look at any particular play without the context of the entire offense.
To develop a good rushing attack, like we have, a team has to make the defense defend multiple lanes and looks. If we were only to toss when we went outside, then the linebackers would be able to sneak outside as soon as the QB started the pitch. So, you do the toss inside to keep the linebackers off balance, which includes putting the linebacker in a position where he is likely to be blocked by the QB.
Similar concepts are important to creating an effective passing game, and Jennings' limitations are hampering that.
Nevertheless, sometimes a play is designed to get the 3-5 yards it takes to keep the defense honest and open up the outside plays.
Regarding the last drive, maybe we could have run a play to the outside, but you risk having it extended and get run out of bounds. That gives GTHOM an extra time out, and we know how important them having used all of theirs ended up being.
I trust Miles and Cameron.
GEAUX TIGERS
To develop a good rushing attack, like we have, a team has to make the defense defend multiple lanes and looks. If we were only to toss when we went outside, then the linebackers would be able to sneak outside as soon as the QB started the pitch. So, you do the toss inside to keep the linebackers off balance, which includes putting the linebacker in a position where he is likely to be blocked by the QB.
Similar concepts are important to creating an effective passing game, and Jennings' limitations are hampering that.
Nevertheless, sometimes a play is designed to get the 3-5 yards it takes to keep the defense honest and open up the outside plays.
Regarding the last drive, maybe we could have run a play to the outside, but you risk having it extended and get run out of bounds. That gives GTHOM an extra time out, and we know how important them having used all of theirs ended up being.
I trust Miles and Cameron.
GEAUX TIGERS
Posted on 10/28/14 at 9:59 am to elprez00
We've been using the QB to cut the backside end on the toss for years. You can look back at some '10-'11 highlights and see Lee and Jefferson doing it.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 10:05 am to Cold Cous Cous
The broader point of the article is that our running game is significantly more complicated then the average td.com slapnut realizes. We do a ton of checks and presnap reads, we mix up zone and man blocking, we vary the fullback's assignments. There's more to it than take the ball and everyone push straight forward.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 10:10 am to elprez00
quote:LSU isn't asking the QB to do anything more than get in the way and delay backside pursuit. It's not like the coaches expect the QB to pancake the
Seriously, how many teams ask their QB to block LB's on running plays?
LB/DE. Just a little chip block is more than adequate.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 10:14 am to Cold Cous Cous
quote:
We've been using the QB to cut the backside end on the toss for years.
yeah it pretty much started in 2010 after we had so may problems running in 09, including on short yardage plays. I think it was the UGA game especially where we had a few 3rd and short type plays and their backside guys got in untouched and snuffed out some runs.
looking at some Hill highlights, I didn't realize how much we'd kinda blended the toss and the power (backside G pulling) the last few yrs. when we first started that quick toss, I don't remember seeing that at all. I saw a couple times where we were in 22 personnel and the backside TE was pulling around as well.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 10:14 am to Poodlebrain
I'm still waiting for Rex to explain how blocking down on the play side, pulling the backside guard, and kicking out the end with the fullback is not considered a power play.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 10:22 am to MOT
quote:
I'm still waiting for Rex to explain how blocking down on the play side, pulling the backside guard, and kicking out the end with the fullback is not considered a power play.
It's why I like the phrase "toss dive," because it's a good sign that the speaker has no clue what he's talking about. I guess it's possible that LSU has run a toss dive, on occasion, but 99% of the time they're running a power or an inside zone off that toss.
Really hoping that River Left makes another appearance next week.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 10:52 am to MastrShake
Article is spot on and well-written. Thanks for sharing.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 10:54 am to The Baker
looks like the girl in the gif is coming to eat the camera
Posted on 10/28/14 at 11:07 am to MOT
quote:
I'm still waiting for Rex to explain how blocking down on the play side, pulling the backside guard, and kicking out the end with the fullback is not considered a power play.
If you can't see that there are different running lanes between the center, guard, tackle, end then you really have no business typing in this thread. LSU's toss dive doesn't give any time for a pulling backside guard to make a positive impact.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 11:21 am to Rex
Still waiting for you to explain why the play in question is not a power play, I've already described why I think it is.
Or you can go ahead and admit you were just rambling and don't have any idea what you were talking about.
Or you can go ahead and admit you were just rambling and don't have any idea what you were talking about.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 11:25 am to Rex
quote:
LSU's toss dive doesn't give any time for a pulling backside guard to make a positive impact.
That's not the question. The question is whether the play is a power, which it clearly is. "Power play" is not just a nickname, it is an actual football play, which is defined by those 3 attributes that MOT listed - down blocking, pulling guard (or H-back in some sets), and fullback kick. It has nothing to do with running behind the center/guard/end or whatever gibberish you were typing.
read this
watch this (note how they outformation the D by going to an unbalanced line with two TEs on the same side, Miles loves doing something similar with Dillon Gordon essentially acting as an extra tackle)
Second, please look at the screencap below and reconsider whether 77 is having a "positive impact" on the play.
Posted on 10/28/14 at 11:27 am to Cold Cous Cous
quote:
It has nothing to do with running behind the center/guard/end or whatever gibberish you were typing.
I laughed
Posted on 10/28/14 at 11:35 am to Cold Cous Cous
Posted on 10/28/14 at 2:26 pm to Big EZ Tiger
quote:
Oh, we got us a bad-azz over here! Well, considering that most of the fans were calling for Beckwith many games before they finally decided to start him on D (and that has turned out very well), perhaps the fans aren't always dumb.
Still interested in knowing what Cam said when you told him that play was shite. Also interested in knowing your coaching credentials.
How did #52 look when inserted into the game at Auburn? Oh yeah - lost and confused.
The entire defense has turned it completely around since that game. You can't possibly take credit for that too can you?
Posted on 10/28/14 at 2:54 pm to Rex
quote:
Still waiting for you to explain why the play in question is not a power play
Posted on 10/28/14 at 3:30 pm to TigerRagAndrew
quote:
Still interested in knowing what Cam said when you told him that play was shite.
He told me to tell it to Miles. I didn't say it as bluntly as you said it though.
quote:
Also interested in knowing your coaching credentials.
I'm not allowed to have an opinion unless I'm a coach? I guess I'm not aware of the message board rules. I have coached though (3 sports) and won championships. Still, I guarantee that there are many people that haven't coached that know way more than I do.
quote:
How did #52 look when inserted into the game at Auburn? Oh yeah - lost and confused.
Auburn confuses a lot of teams. They run a fast offense that is one of the best in football. Beckwith didn't start that game and he still had 6 tackles and our only turnover with a fumble recovery. I say that's pretty good. I'm not picking on Welter (Beckwith says that Welter teaches him everything about the position and making calls), but he only had 1 assisted tackle and he was in there for a while.
quote:
The entire defense has turned it completely around since that game. You can't possibly take credit for that too can you?
Where have I tried to claim credit for anything? I gave a sarcastic answer to you about the fans sometimes having some decent insight (I realize this doesn't happen much, but it does happen at times).
Just chill man...I'm happy as can be that LSU won. The coaches did a great job. I'm just not that warm and fuzzy about "the toss" because the last time we ran it in the game we had an awkward pitch and Hilliard got stuffed for no gain after gaining 3 on a 1st down handoff trying to run the clock out.
Posted on 10/29/14 at 12:48 am to elprez00
quote:
Seriously, how many teams ask their QB to block LB's on running plays? I'm not criticizing, but thats kinda crazy if you think about it.
SUnshine doesn't think so
Posted on 10/29/14 at 5:27 am to Big EZ Tiger
quote:
LSU has been gaining more yards on basically every other type of run they have been running (hello toss sweep).
Lol. Toss sweep, eh? Its a pitch dive and you have no evidence, statistically to back up your claims. Come back when you've learned something about football.
Page 3 of 4
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News