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Message
Some non-Anti-O-Nega from a guy everyone knows is Nega when it comes to O
Posted on 11/4/18 at 11:54 am
Posted on 11/4/18 at 11:54 am
Look. I was WAY negative about the O hire. Everyone knows that. But, I think the meltdown after Saturday is immensely overwrought. First, yes, I still think Coach E is the wrong man for the job. Frankly, the entire season shows that. However, I honestly have to say that thus far, I feel like O has done better than I expected. But, let's talk Saturday.
1. The people comparing our scoring to other teams vs Bama this year are immediately recognizable as football ignorant. We are literally the first team whose defense showed ANY ability to keep Bama from scoring at will.
2. It may well be that we are the last team this season to do that also. It's annoying to admit it but here's reality regarding Bama.
A) They fricking won a national title 3 years ago with a damned Safety playing QB.
B) 2 years ago, they almost won a title with basically a TE playing QB.
C) Last year, the won a title with basically a TE playing QB for all but the last 5 minutes of the season.
Bama isn't just a little better than everyone else. They're a LOT better than everyone else. Sure. There's a reason that you still play the games. Every now and then, a less team sneaks up on someone. That doesn't change reality.
REALITY is this. We had ZERO offensive starters tonight that would have started for Bama. It's arguable that we had ZERO who would have been on their two deep.
On defense, it's slightly better, but, we had ZERO DL who would have even been in the Bama rotation. And, frankly, only D. White would have been in the LB rotation.
Coaching can do a lot of things. But, Nick Saban can't bring the Bama HS state champs to go play La. Tech and hope to win. Talent matters.
3)But bottom line, it's still a VERY real possibility that LSU goes 10-2 this year and frankly, I didn't consider that remotely possible this year given our talent problems on offense. And make no mistake, we have SUBSTANTIAL talent problems on offense.
1. The people comparing our scoring to other teams vs Bama this year are immediately recognizable as football ignorant. We are literally the first team whose defense showed ANY ability to keep Bama from scoring at will.
2. It may well be that we are the last team this season to do that also. It's annoying to admit it but here's reality regarding Bama.
A) They fricking won a national title 3 years ago with a damned Safety playing QB.
B) 2 years ago, they almost won a title with basically a TE playing QB.
C) Last year, the won a title with basically a TE playing QB for all but the last 5 minutes of the season.
Bama isn't just a little better than everyone else. They're a LOT better than everyone else. Sure. There's a reason that you still play the games. Every now and then, a less team sneaks up on someone. That doesn't change reality.
REALITY is this. We had ZERO offensive starters tonight that would have started for Bama. It's arguable that we had ZERO who would have been on their two deep.
On defense, it's slightly better, but, we had ZERO DL who would have even been in the Bama rotation. And, frankly, only D. White would have been in the LB rotation.
Coaching can do a lot of things. But, Nick Saban can't bring the Bama HS state champs to go play La. Tech and hope to win. Talent matters.
3)But bottom line, it's still a VERY real possibility that LSU goes 10-2 this year and frankly, I didn't consider that remotely possible this year given our talent problems on offense. And make no mistake, we have SUBSTANTIAL talent problems on offense.
This post was edited on 11/4/18 at 11:55 am
9
Posted on 11/4/18 at 11:57 am to ShortyRob
We have substantial schematic and talent problems on offense. Over 2 years into the O regime. With no signs of improvement.
Our defense and special teams are excellent. Elite. Kudos to O for not letting those relapse. But we've had excellent defenses and special teams consistently under Les. The problem was offense. Our new coach needed to fix offense. That simple. We have regressed on offense. Thus the hire has been a failure to this point
Our defense and special teams are excellent. Elite. Kudos to O for not letting those relapse. But we've had excellent defenses and special teams consistently under Les. The problem was offense. Our new coach needed to fix offense. That simple. We have regressed on offense. Thus the hire has been a failure to this point
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:00 pm to ShortyRob
You cannot talk about the 'talent gap' and accuse others of being football ignorant.
LSU recruits as well as Ohio State, Clemson and Georgia: teams that beat Alabama or at least take them down to the wire.
LSU recruits elite offensive talent and then squanders them. That's not on the 'talent gap' -- that's on the coaches failing to improve or develop the elite talent they have.
LSU recruits as well as Ohio State, Clemson and Georgia: teams that beat Alabama or at least take them down to the wire.
LSU recruits elite offensive talent and then squanders them. That's not on the 'talent gap' -- that's on the coaches failing to improve or develop the elite talent they have.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:02 pm to ShortyRob
There you go with rationality.
Rantards don't deal in rationality.
Rantards don't deal in rationality.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:03 pm to RuLSU
Why not both. Don’t need to be mutually exclusive explanations.
This post was edited on 11/4/18 at 12:04 pm
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:03 pm to tigerfan88
quote:I think people just VASTLY underestimate how potential QBs were absolutely repelled by Miles.
We have substantial schematic and talent problems on offense. Over 2 years into the O regime. With no signs of improvement.
I was saying that a couple of years ago and people were saying "But Brennan and Narcisse committed to him".
Pahleez. One of them is a guy who was rated high but EVERYONE was scared of. I guarantee you that teams were luke warm on LN. And MB is built like a 13 year old.
That's what happens in recruiting when it falls off. You may land some "on paper" decent guys, but the reality is, you're forced to take the dudes other coaches see thru.
Frankly, our WR corps is also in that boat. I enjoy Jefferson's moxie...........but he wouldn't be a top 5 receiver on Bama's team. And after him, the drop off is awfully noticeable.
So yeah. I am anti Coach E.........better scheme would help. But, we are thin as frick on that side of the ball
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:05 pm to RuLSU
quote:WTF are you talking about? Our offense has a HUGE gap.
You cannot talk about the 'talent gap' and accuse others of being football ignorant.
quote:Oh for goddamned crying out loud. Our QB is a the guy who did NOT win the OSU starting job. Neither of our RBs would sniff the field for OSU, Clemson or UGA. And our WR corp probably doesn't have a guy who could start for any of them either.
LSU recruits as well as Ohio State, Clemson and Georgia: teams that beat Alabama or at least take them down to the wire.
Do you people pay attention to shite at all?
quote:This is just a delusional statement this year.
LSU recruits elite offensive talent and then squanders them.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:06 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
we are thin as frick on that side of the ball
Even w Leonard and Guice we were thin relative to Bama, particularly when you factor in player development. Paper ratings eventually have to translate into on-field product. It really does seem like there are developmental issues on the offensive side of the ball that run deeper than just these last two years.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:08 pm to doctatigah
quote:Yep. Put it this way.
Even w Leonard and Guice we were thin relative to Bama, particularly when you factor in player development. Paper ratings eventually have to translate into on-field product. It really does seem like there are developmental issues on the offensive side of the ball that run deeper than just these last two years.
With LF and DG, we still were fielding a QB who would have been 3rd string on Bama's team. None of our WRs during that time would have started for Bama. MAYBE 1 or 2 of our OL would have started or been on the two deep.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:09 pm to ShortyRob
So was sacrificing "talent" in last year's class and the whole Line shakesups that occurred a good thing or bad thing? Your argument is talent, but we've recruited significantly worse since O was hired.
That was a pretty big point of contention, and it was usually couched as "O knows what he is doing. We need depth." But why does that depth matter if we make the assumption that a 3-star has no place on the field with a 5-star, which is what this post basically says.
That getting a 3-star OLine to add depth over a 4-5 star skill position was probably a bad move.
(And I'm just trying to find the consistency, I like the rational approach, but maybe the answer still is "O doesn't know how to run a program," as he took incorrect risks if we were to assume the talent is the big problem.)
And I'll say here, I actually agree, but that's because the expectations were extremely low. Yes he's surprised, but he's also shown no signs he can lead LSU to a championship. He was woefully underprepared yesterday.
That was a pretty big point of contention, and it was usually couched as "O knows what he is doing. We need depth." But why does that depth matter if we make the assumption that a 3-star has no place on the field with a 5-star, which is what this post basically says.
That getting a 3-star OLine to add depth over a 4-5 star skill position was probably a bad move.
(And I'm just trying to find the consistency, I like the rational approach, but maybe the answer still is "O doesn't know how to run a program," as he took incorrect risks if we were to assume the talent is the big problem.)
quote:
However, I honestly have to say that thus far, I feel like O has done better than I expected.
And I'll say here, I actually agree, but that's because the expectations were extremely low. Yes he's surprised, but he's also shown no signs he can lead LSU to a championship. He was woefully underprepared yesterday.
This post was edited on 11/4/18 at 12:10 pm
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:11 pm to ShortyRob
In 8 quarters of E's play calling, we haven't scored a point.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:15 pm to Freauxzen
quote:Well. I would say that I give basically all coaches a slight pass on year 1 recruiting because recruits are skittish as frick in that situation.
So was sacrificing "talent" in last year's class and the whole Line shakesups that occurred a good thing or bad thing? Your argument is talent, but we've recruited significantly worse since O was hired.
On the offensive side of the ball, the bottom line reality is that LSU has a fricking godawful reputation among 18 year old kids. If you are an 18 year old kid, you flat out can't remember LSU having a decent offense. That's a drag on recruiting. On that I hope we can incrementally overcome. One that I'm not sure O can overcome but, if he can't, it will be his undoing.
quote:Honestly, I disagree. We can't even field a fricking two deep OL! We've got to reach a point where that's not the case.
That getting a 3-star OLine to add depth over a 4-5 star skill position was probably a bad move.
quote:I'm not SOLD on Coach O. I'm simply acknowledging that this season has gone better than I would have expected and I'm not letting the fact that a team that is beating the frick out of everybody beat us Saturday change that.
(And I'm just trying to find the consistency, I like the rational approach, but maybe the answer still is "O doesn't know how to run a program," as he took incorrect risks if we were to assume the talent is the big problem.)
quote:Truth. But, whether we like to admit it not. Even with a great OC........our offense would be better..........but still HIGHLY suspect.
And I'll say here, I actually agree, but that's because the expectations were extremely low
Being 7-2 at this point with the train wreck we're fielding on the offensive side of the ball in terms of talent is a goddamned miracle.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:16 pm to husslemane
quote:Hiring Coach E was fricktarded and hopefully.............it gets rectified
In 8 quarters of E's play calling, we haven't scored a point.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:19 pm to ShortyRob
Right. I’ve been banging the drum that these are not mutually exclusive: better OC, better depth, better instruction. That’s the recipe.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:21 pm to doctatigah
quote:
Right. I’ve been banging the drum that these are not mutually exclusive: better OC, better depth, better instruction. That’s the recipe.
The #1 problem with hiring Coach E isn't even his coaching directly speaking.
It's that to overcome our negative reputation, we need some ambitions QB to take a flier on us. Same for other offensive positions.
NOTHING about Coach E says to a kid, "I think I'll risk it"
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:22 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
This is just a delusional statement this year.
Ed Orgeron is 0-3 against Alabama.
LSU is 0 for their last 8.
Let's keep this in perspective. If O isn't directly improving the situation, he's contributing to its lingering existence.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:22 pm to ShortyRob
Is recruiting guards to transfer to tackle the norm or is that something LSU does? The guy's look slow as hell to me
This post was edited on 11/4/18 at 12:38 pm
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:25 pm to RuLSU
quote:It's just very hard to tell though.
Let's keep this in perspective. If O isn't directly improving the situation, he's contributing to its lingering existence.
I've been saying all year that this Bama team would beat ALL of Saban's prior Bama teams.
Meanwhile, we were so fricking godawful at the QB position that we had to take a kid from OSU who turns out is just kinda meh.........and he won the job after seeing the offense for a month!
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:26 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
It's that to overcome our negative reputation, we need some ambitions QB to take a flier on us. Same for other offensive positions.
It's really just QB and the OL. Engsminger can't scheme to hide our weaknesses either.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:35 pm to ShortyRob
i hoped we could give bama a run for their money but the sad fact is we give them more help at wearing out our defense with the hurry up then they did. i saw a few series we "maybe" took 30-40 seconds off the clock before punting it back to bama, most surprisingly late in the first half when there was still hope devins return could provide some spark if we just run out the clock and make it to half time only down 16. 
im no nega-tiger or cheer-e-O so i was not expecting to win but hoping they surprise me.
the sad fact is we just have no line blocking but far beyond that, we had no plan to slow the game down to rest our defense, which was the only chance we had was for them to be well rested to give bama fits and keep the scoring low.
poor play calling and very strange, even stupid at times strategy cost us a lot more then being physically outmatched last night. its like they had a thought of how to "maybe" catch bama off guard at times and tried to make it their whole strategy with no thought at all to what that would do to our defense.
in the end, had we employed a regular normal game plan, i still think we lose but our defense holds then to 16-19 points. its clear we were boys trying to play against men and coaching and all that was just a secondary condition to add to it
im no nega-tiger or cheer-e-O so i was not expecting to win but hoping they surprise me.
the sad fact is we just have no line blocking but far beyond that, we had no plan to slow the game down to rest our defense, which was the only chance we had was for them to be well rested to give bama fits and keep the scoring low.
poor play calling and very strange, even stupid at times strategy cost us a lot more then being physically outmatched last night. its like they had a thought of how to "maybe" catch bama off guard at times and tried to make it their whole strategy with no thought at all to what that would do to our defense.
in the end, had we employed a regular normal game plan, i still think we lose but our defense holds then to 16-19 points. its clear we were boys trying to play against men and coaching and all that was just a secondary condition to add to it
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