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Poor Oline play is not entirely because of recruiting
Posted on 11/8/16 at 10:46 am
Posted on 11/8/16 at 10:46 am
It is coaching. Our defense under Aranda and Jenkins is night and day better than it was last year with predominately the same players. Most or our defensive players are 4 star players out of high school. Our offensive line is also made up of 4 star players. The techniques that they are taught, the blocking schemes that they are using, and the plays that are being called are all on coaching decisions and preparation. Our 4 star offensive linemen were playing like 2-3 star linemen against bama due to coaching. Our predominately 4 star defensive players playing like bamas 5 star players are due to great coaching (ie Duke Riley playing much better this year). You get an offensive coordinator and offensive line coach the caliber of Aranda and Jenkins and we won't have players getting knocked on their butts like we saw Saturday. Yes we need some 5 star players on offensive line, but we need better coaching more.
8
Posted on 11/8/16 at 10:56 am to Spankem
No when u recruit a bunch of guards to maul for a run first concept u get what we have
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:00 am to Spankem
Just seems like there is something our existing line can do when playing superior talent.
We tried to overpower them and it didn't work. Same as last year.
We tried to overpower them and it didn't work. Same as last year.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:01 am to Spankem
I agree coaching is a huge piece of it. I mean just look at navy. how many 4 and 5 stars are on that OL. Yet They compete and beat ND and other teams with 4 and 5 star talent. I would say coaching is maybe just below talent. LSU o-lines have not been good under grimes. i'm sorry against good DLines we get whipped. You dont need 5 star talent to compete against the big boys you just need proper fundmentals and looks like LSU is not getting that.
This post was edited on 11/8/16 at 11:04 am
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:02 am to FLObserver
Grimes has recruiting pretty good talent at OL and not coached them up at all.
Not sure if it's his zone scheme or his technique he is teaching, but they continually under perform to their talent levels.
Not sure if it's his zone scheme or his technique he is teaching, but they continually under perform to their talent levels.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:03 am to Spankem
The POS Former Head Coach and OC never practiced or emphasized playcalling balance or an offensive system that put any weight on pass protection. We never repped it in practice and by comparison to balanced offenses we face we are poor at it. With a renewed focus on balance we will practice and emphasize a scheme that lets us rep it in practice and get game reps to improve it.
But Rome wasn't built in a day or 4 weeks.
Orgeron has had 2+ years with his guys and the old guys to improve technique and teach the same style and technique and scheme, consistently. The OL has had a month.
We already know Grimes felt like he couldn't sub under Miles. From Orgeron's mouth we heard he couldn't manage his own position group. Word around the campfire is that Miles meddled so much so that he couldn't run OL drills at practice or even at a damn football camp without Miles intervening Grimes and forcing him to teach a different way.
Yet this is somehow supposed to be cured in 4 weeks?
Comparing the improvement of the DL to the OL when the length of time, the previous regime's draconian meddling in the lineup and teaching all the way up to the recruiting emphasis and practice reps and playcalling emphasis are totally different? At best the OP lacks the proper amount of context behind his opinion.
At worst, he does ave it and just doesn't care, which makes him ignorant. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt here. But still. This is weak sauce.
But Rome wasn't built in a day or 4 weeks.
Orgeron has had 2+ years with his guys and the old guys to improve technique and teach the same style and technique and scheme, consistently. The OL has had a month.
We already know Grimes felt like he couldn't sub under Miles. From Orgeron's mouth we heard he couldn't manage his own position group. Word around the campfire is that Miles meddled so much so that he couldn't run OL drills at practice or even at a damn football camp without Miles intervening Grimes and forcing him to teach a different way.
Yet this is somehow supposed to be cured in 4 weeks?
Comparing the improvement of the DL to the OL when the length of time, the previous regime's draconian meddling in the lineup and teaching all the way up to the recruiting emphasis and practice reps and playcalling emphasis are totally different? At best the OP lacks the proper amount of context behind his opinion.
At worst, he does ave it and just doesn't care, which makes him ignorant. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt here. But still. This is weak sauce.
This post was edited on 11/8/16 at 11:06 am
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:04 am to TigerFanNKaty
quote:
No when u recruit a bunch of guards to maul for a run first concept u get what we have
Ah so you agree that it's the coaching too? What I am reading here is that the scheme that the offensive coaches are using is not fitting the abilities of four star 300 pound plus linemen?
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:06 am to GFunk
When was the last time LSU had a truly dominant tackle?
I'm not talking about a guy like Collins who was clearly an NFL quality G with a bit of versatility.
I'm talking about a guy like Tunsil (who actually has played well at both G and T this year as a rookie).
We move Guards to Tackle whereas the trend in the NFL is to move Tackles to Guard. We do the opposite of what a pass oriented team would do.
I'm not talking about a guy like Collins who was clearly an NFL quality G with a bit of versatility.
I'm talking about a guy like Tunsil (who actually has played well at both G and T this year as a rookie).
We move Guards to Tackle whereas the trend in the NFL is to move Tackles to Guard. We do the opposite of what a pass oriented team would do.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:12 am to GFunk
quote:
Comparing the improvement of the DL to the OL when the length of time, the previous regime's draconian meddling in the lineup and teaching all the way up to the recruiting emphasis and practice reps and playcalling emphasis are totally different? At best the OP lacks the proper amount of context behind his opinion.
My point was that better coaching would improve the o-line more than better players would. Are you not reading the OP that way? It seems that you are backing up exactly what I was saying in the OP then say that I am lacking proper context? I do not currently think that the OC and Oline coaches are going to fix where the offensive linemen are skill set wise. They need to be upgraded just like the defensive side was upgraded. I agree, that this will take an offseason just as the defense needed an offseason to be installed and taught.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:14 am to TigerBait1127
quote:
When was the last time LSU had a truly dominant tackle?
Andrew Whitworth. Class of 2006
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:14 am to TigerBait1127
quote:
Guards to Tackle
I think LSU has a decent tackle that lines up a center.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 11:19 am to Spankem
quote:
Andrew Whitworth. Class of 2006
Should have been collins as well
.Posted on 11/8/16 at 12:00 pm to Spankem
gotta recruit better.....
Posted on 11/8/16 at 12:08 pm to Spankem
quote:
Poor Oline play is not entirely because of recruiting
It is not until you face a DL filled with NFL players. LSU has NFL ready players on defense.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 12:16 pm to AtlantaLSUfan
quote:
We tried to overpower them and it didn't work. Same as last year.
And it will be the same year next year and the next and the next and....................
Here is an unpleasant fact of life. A well coached 3 or 4 star lineman will get beat up by a well coached 5 star lineman most of the time.
Expecting lesser talent and/or strength player to be "coached up" to beat an opponent with greater talent/strength on coaching alone is a foolish wish especially when the better guy is also well coached.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 12:27 pm to CalTiger53
At this point we have to dance with who brung us. Can't expect radical changes after you fire a coach four games into the season. If the leash was that short, it should have happened last December. The scary part is that the SAME people who dropped the ball in December are the same people who are going to hire the new coach. That bothers me more than anything honestly.
This post was edited on 11/8/16 at 12:28 pm
Posted on 11/8/16 at 12:37 pm to Spankem
Both but u starting a undersized tackle who is a 3 star and the rest with the exception of Pocic are guards. So I blame Miles (coaching) and what he recruited for.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 12:40 pm to TigerBait1127
Don't forget moving Pocic back and forth between center and tackle and back to center.
Posted on 11/8/16 at 12:49 pm to TigerBait1127
quote:
When was the last time LSU had a truly dominant tackle?
I'm not talking about a guy like Collins who was clearly an NFL quality G with a bit of versatility.
Collins his Junior and Senior Year was an elite OT at the college level. WTF were you watching?
Posted on 11/8/16 at 12:50 pm to Spankem
Yeah a 3 star OT from a private school will definitely hold his own against Bama...
Recruiting could be better on the OL
Recruiting could be better on the OL
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