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re: I forgot how much I hate USC
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:24 pm to Geaux Tahel
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:24 pm to Geaux Tahel
quote:
the trophy awarded to the BCS national Champ
Yep.
quote:
THE METHOD used in determining the N.C. as voted for by colleges themselves.
Nope, not all the colleges.
quote:
not a single sole is telling you that you can't consider AP relevant. You do you.
quote:
Why don't you consider LSU champs in 1908?
Go look in LSU's trophy case and see if there's a trophy for 1908. If there is, count it. But how can you count something if it isn't there?
quote:
If we are going to count all "non-official" polls/rankings
I mean, I guess y'all can make up whatever foolishness you want. I'm talking about counting trophies. Some a school chooses to acknowledge by displaying in the trophy case, some they don't. What they generally don't do is count things that aren't even there.
1
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:26 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
The NCAA acknowledges it:
"2003 LSU, Southern California BCS, AP, FWAA"
The NCAA acknowledges USC so lets count it.
quote:
It's also why LSU won't acknowledge a championship for 1908, because none was actually awarded to LSU after the season. You can't count trophies you don't have. Which is why USC can count their 2003 trophy- they actually have it.
The NCAA acknowledges LSU so we aren't going to count it?
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:28 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
Nope, not all the colleges.
The huge majority... including USC which Pete openly regretted.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:33 pm to Geaux Tahel
quote:
The NCAA acknowledges LSU so we aren't going to count it?
Count what, exactly?
Do you even understand what counting trophies means? I'm talking about counting actual things that you can see and hold (if they let you).
I think you're confusing "counting" with "mattering".
I'm using this definition of "count":
verb
1. determine the total number of (a collection of items).
You seem to be using this definition:
3. be significant.
"it did not matter what the audience thought—it was the critics that counted"
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:34 pm to Geaux Tahel
quote:
Despite a mandate to vote for the BCS title game-winner No. 1 in the final poll, three coaches (Oregon's Mike Bellotti, Illinois' Ron Turner and South Carolina's Lou Holtz) broke the contractual agreement and cast their No. 1 ballots for USC.
I forgot about these clownsPosted on 11/23/22 at 12:42 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
Do you even understand what counting trophies means? I'm talking about counting actual things that you can see and hold
So you are only counting championships if they have a physical trophy in some physical trophy case? Seriously?
OK, OK, I'll play along. What happens if someone steals a trophy and it disappears forever? Or what if there is a fire? Or vandals destroy a trophy? Does that school all of a sudden become UNchampions?
That's f'in ridiculous. We're done here. Thanks for the civil discussion though. Cheers!
ETA: Guess I wasn't actually champion of my Fantasy Football league multiple times since I never got a physical trophy.
This post was edited on 11/23/22 at 12:50 pm
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:43 pm to sta4ever
Bubbled up those 2003 feels really quick
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:51 pm to Geaux Tahel
Regarding 2003:
So LSU beat 4 teams vs USC's 2 in the final AP Poll yet they were ranked behind USC What a clown show.
The BCS was supposed to clarify the national championship picture, not allow things to continue the same way they had been going for years with split/shared national titles and all that nonsense.
quote:
wins vs. Power 5 teams with winning records
USC — 4
LSU — 6
quote:
Wins vs. teams ranked in FINAL AP Top 25
USC — 2
LSU — 4
So LSU beat 4 teams vs USC's 2 in the final AP Poll yet they were ranked behind USC
What a clown show. The BCS was supposed to clarify the national championship picture, not allow things to continue the same way they had been going for years with split/shared national titles and all that nonsense.
This post was edited on 11/23/22 at 12:59 pm
Posted on 11/23/22 at 12:59 pm to Geaux Tahel
quote:
So you are only counting championships if they have a physical trophy in some physical trophy case? Seriously?
Yes, that is exactly what I'm talking about. That's pretty much how it's done. Some one gives you a trophy, and if you respect them, you put it in your case and count it. If not, you use it as a door stop somewhere and don't count it. It's not rocket science.
A lot organizations awarded championships retroactively. There are no trophies for these, and so schools simply don't count them.
Fans, on the other hand, seem to think they can just look over historical results and claim whatever the frick they want. That's not how reputable schools like LSU do things.
quote:
What happens if someone steals a trophy and it disappears forever? Or what if there is a fire? Or vandals destroy a trophy? Does that school all of a sudden become UNchampions?
Like when Alabama's 2011 BCS trophy was shattered? Yep, that one doesn't count anymore.
Actually, they just got a replacement.
quote:
We're done here
No kidding. I'm simply trying to explain to you how it works. While you seem to think it's ridiculous, you haven't yet provided any alternative. Maybe one day you'll understand why LSU doesn't acknowledge 1908 as a championship season.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 1:35 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
Bryant Trophy (1957–1965), retired by Alabama in 1965, upon winning their third AP title in five years.
So Alabama has the trophy we won in 1958. Prior to today, I actually thought I couldn't hate them more. My God!
Posted on 11/23/22 at 1:46 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
The BCS era ended split championships.
You wouldn’t recognize a differing AP #1 as champion under the CFP system so logically you shouldn’t under the BCS system.
That’s why we started the BCS in the first place. Some of you are so daft when it comes to this.
The only reason anyone gave the AP poll any credence in 2003 was because the AP poll was the benchmark for many years up until just 5 years prior to 2003, so people were so used to the AP poll being relevant. Now that we’ve been under the BCS and CFP system for so many years people have gotten over that.
You wouldn’t recognize a differing AP #1 as champion under the CFP system so logically you shouldn’t under the BCS system.
That’s why we started the BCS in the first place. Some of you are so daft when it comes to this.
The only reason anyone gave the AP poll any credence in 2003 was because the AP poll was the benchmark for many years up until just 5 years prior to 2003, so people were so used to the AP poll being relevant. Now that we’ve been under the BCS and CFP system for so many years people have gotten over that.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 2:13 pm to Undertow
quote:Not everyone thinks logically. But regardless of which poll this which poll that, bottom line; LSU won the Poll/Ranking system that the vast majority of schools (including USC) voted for to determine the National Champ. This is irrefutable.
You wouldn’t recognize a differing AP #1 as champion under the CFP system so logically you shouldn’t under the BCS system.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 3:33 pm to Undertow
quote:
The BCS era ended split championships.
No it didn't, USC has the AP trophy for that year and counts it as a NC. They are not alone in recognizing that fact.
quote:
You wouldn’t recognize a differing AP #1 as champion under the CFP system
I think that depends on the circumstances. If the CFP committee clearly showed obvious bias against LSU, and the AP awarded the trophy to the Tigers, yeah, I'd recognize it.
As long as the CFP participants depend on an invite from some committee of nobodies, the system is vulnerable to monkey business.
quote:
That’s why we started the BCS in the first place.
I'm certain you had absolutely nothing to do with it. Talk about daft. quote:
The only reason anyone gave the AP poll any credence in 2003 was because the AP poll was the benchmark for many years up until just 5 years prior to 2003, so people were so used to the AP poll being relevant. Now that we’ve been under the BCS and CFP system for so many years people have gotten over that.
That's very nice and all, but as soon as there's controversy, it'll be 2003 all over again. The reason it seems like it's settled is that there hasn't really been any controversy.
That's the weakness with using opinion polls to determine champions, it makes it terribly subjective.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 3:39 pm to EasterEgg
quote:
So Alabama has the trophy we won in 1958. Prior to today, I actually thought I couldn't hate them more. My God!
Posted on 11/23/22 at 4:09 pm to sta4ever
why hate USC. We've hardly played them over the years.
Personally, I like USC. Lots of tradition, cool fight song, and killer white-sweatered Song Girls.
And now they have a prolific offense.
Now sure, the PAC-12 is weak, but hell, I'm glad USC is relevant again.
Too many on this board don't appreciate the entirety of college football, and think it all begins and ends at the Louisiana border. It doesn't.
I appreciate other teams' traditions and successes. It makes the entire game stronger and more meaningful.
Personally, I like USC. Lots of tradition, cool fight song, and killer white-sweatered Song Girls.
And now they have a prolific offense.
Now sure, the PAC-12 is weak, but hell, I'm glad USC is relevant again.
Too many on this board don't appreciate the entirety of college football, and think it all begins and ends at the Louisiana border. It doesn't.
I appreciate other teams' traditions and successes. It makes the entire game stronger and more meaningful.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 4:38 pm to sta4ever
I still harbor hate since the 1979 game.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 4:47 pm to TexasTiger89
Agreed. Respect for their program's tradition. Especially their 3-peat in the early 2000's, but truly can't stand them.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 4:47 pm to TexasTiger89
quote:no need for hate. That was one of the greatest games in Tiger Stadium history.
still harbor hate since the 1979 game.
No need to hate USC for that.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 4:58 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
I'm certain you had absolutely nothing to do with it. Talk about daft.
You obviously know I’m using “we” in the collective sense. The fact that you are citing that shows you are grasping at straws. You’ve been talking yourself in circles this whole thread.
Posted on 11/23/22 at 5:04 pm to sta4ever
Many of the sports commentators at the time considered USC to be a more legitimate champion largely because they thought that offense would just be completely unstoppable if they played LSU. The funny thing is, after Saban won so many at Alabama, it actually kind of bolstered the credibility of that BCS win. With every new trophy Saban won, it became less and less "obvious" that even a Pete Carroll USC with Reggie Bush would be guaranteed to beat a Nick Saban defense good enough to win a BCS.
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