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re: Adding another return air vent

Posted on 6/10/20 at 9:06 am to
Posted by CrawDude
Baton Rouge
Member since Apr 2019
5285 posts
Posted on 6/10/20 at 9:06 am to
quote:

I have an air return in every room of our house. AC company says ours is the most “unique” set-up that they service...I don’t think he means that in an enduring way

And that’s actually the ideal way it should be set up. I’m sure your attic ductwork looks like an octopus on steroids but you can close every room in the house with that set up and not negatively affect HVAC performance.
Posted by fishfighter
RIP
Member since Apr 2008
40026 posts
Posted on 6/10/20 at 9:18 am to
quote:

I have a 4 ton unit in the attic with a 3.5 ton outside if that makes sense. I currently only have a 20x20 return air vent in the hallway. My master bedroom is in the back of the house and I feel like this room is the warmest. They suggested that I add a return air vent in my master bedroom which is the farthest point from my ac unit in the house (probably a good 40 feet). I have no idea of the size of the duct that they will use.



Had the same problem in my house. What I did was put a 12'x12" with a 10" flex duct. Fixed the problem. That run was well over 50' Total cost was around $150.

If you need some 10" flex duct, I have 3 rolls that are 25' each. Those cost around $70 each, but will sell them to you at half price. They were extra from my guest house build. You can buy the connecters, intake grill and tape at Colburns in Baton Rouge.

On a side note. The master bed room in my house is complete sound proof which was blocking free flow.
Posted by jflsufan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Mar 2013
4455 posts
Posted on 6/10/20 at 9:32 am to
quote:

If you need some 10" flex duct, I have 3 rolls that are 25' each. Those cost around $70 each, but will sell them to you at half price. They were extra from my guest house build. You can buy the connecters, intake grill and tape at Colburns in Baton Rouge.


I appreciate it but I will not be attempting to do this on my own. I will be paying an HVAC guy to do this for me.
This post was edited on 6/10/20 at 9:33 am
Posted by fishfighter
RIP
Member since Apr 2008
40026 posts
Posted on 6/10/20 at 9:36 am to
Hey, on a scale of 1-10 with 10 the hardest, I put this job at a 2. Hell, I was at 62 years old when I did it. Oh, took about two hours to do it by myself.
This post was edited on 6/10/20 at 9:37 am
Posted by CrawDude
Baton Rouge
Member since Apr 2019
5285 posts
Posted on 6/10/20 at 10:21 am to
I just came across this return air duct sizing chart which might be helpful on adding additional return air ducts to your house. LINK

This charts shows you’d need 16 inch flex duct to provide at least an additional 600 cfm or return air or 2, 12 inch flex ducts. I’d be interested in knowing what size return air ducts the HVAC firm is quoting you on.

I may just take fish’s advice and add my own extra return air duct - I’m about 400 cfm return air short on my 4 ton system. I need 1600 cfm but have a little short 1200 cfm of return air capacity on a 24 x 24 return air grill.
This post was edited on 6/10/20 at 12:28 pm
Posted by Gene Frenkle
Member since Feb 2016
347 posts
Posted on 6/10/20 at 11:00 am to
Had a 24x24 return installed along with my new unit for $650. Don't know if there was any kind of discount for already being at the house or for buying a new unit, but $1,300 sounds pretty damn high.
Posted by TeddyPadillac
Member since Dec 2010
25806 posts
Posted on 6/10/20 at 11:22 am to
quote:

Said it would cost $350 (not a tigerdroppings joke) regardless of if we did it while they were installing the new system or if we decided to add it in the future.


I find that hard to believe someone is going to come out and run duct work in your attic for $350. They must be talking about putting a return that's a couple of feet away from where it needs to go in the attic, and even then, that seems cheap.

$1295 seems a bit high, but $350 sounds way too low.

Be up front with them. Ask them how long is it going to take. They tell you maybe 2-3 hours, just assume half a day worth of labor. Then ask them how much they charge an hour. I have no idea what that is, but i'd have to guess it's got to be around $100/hr.

I had a plumber quote me almost $2K to run a 3/4" pipe to my stove. Only needed about 30 feet of pipe and 3 elbows, and the connection and valve was already available and easily accessible. He called me back not too long ago asking about the quote and i told him i looked up the price for the parts and it was well under $200, and you said this would take a half a day at most, so why the hell are you charging me $400/hr for your work? He tried to backtrack and say he had to charge for a full day and other excuses and i ended up hanging up on him for being a lying greedy sack of shite.
Posted by sparkinator
Lake Claiborne
Member since Dec 2007
4465 posts
Posted on 6/10/20 at 10:22 pm to
I just finished adding a return vent to my unit. Fortunately my unit is in a closet and borders the hall on one side and living room on an adjoining wall. My only return air vent was 20 x 20 and was in the hallway, and I cut a hole in the adjacent wall and added a 12 x 24 vent.

The unit is a lot quieter now. The return air vent would whistle as it struggled for air with the one vent.

Cost about 30 bucks for the vent and a couple of hours for the install. No additional ducting was needed.

Posted by go_tigres
Member since Sep 2013
5164 posts
Posted on 6/11/20 at 12:20 am to
I don’t get putting in a return air at the furthest part of your house. That doesn’t make sense to me. Logically you’d want it near the other return air or at close to the supply plenum. If it were me, assuming you have the room, I’d put another return air very close to the original then tie into the plenum. If you’ve relatively hand it would be a pretty quick job. Whoever put in your unit with only a 20x20 return air screwed up big time.
Posted by TheNolaClap
Jersey Shore (not fist pump)
Member since Jun 2012
1489 posts
Posted on 6/11/20 at 7:21 am to
quote:

I have an air return in every room of our house. AC company says ours is the most “unique” set-up that they service...I don’t think he means that in an enduring way


So that's the way a lot of the homes here in PA are set up. I have a small return in every room except the bathrooms. One main filter before the return duct goes into the furnance/AC coil. I never saw it until we moved up here a few months ago but man its a lot better than the one huge return grate I've always had down south.
Posted by footballdude
BR
Member since Sep 2010
1075 posts
Posted on 6/11/20 at 11:26 am to
(no message)
This post was edited on 1/11/21 at 1:15 pm
Posted by CrawDude
Baton Rouge
Member since Apr 2019
5285 posts
Posted on 6/11/20 at 1:15 pm to
quote:

don’t get putting in a return air at the furthest part of your house. That doesn’t make sense to me. Logically you’d want it near the other return air or at close to the supply plenum. If it were me, assuming you have the room, I’d put another return air very close to the original then tie into the plenum. If you’ve relatively hand it would be a pretty quick job. Whoever put in your unit with only a 20x20 return air screwed up big time.

In order for the HVAC system to function properly and effectively cool all areas of the house equally, air must be pulled from all areas of the house to the return plenum - sometimes that is difficult if the air return plenum is not centrally located in the house (which it is often not as people don’t want a return plenum grill located in a central living room, dining area, etc), or if hallway, bedroom, home office or utility room doors are kept closed. So more than one return air duct might be located in different areas of the house to more effectively pull return air from all areas of the home to the air handler to be cooled or heated.

Also, when supply registers provide cool air into a closed room without a return air register in the same room, the room is under + air pressure and some cool conditioned is forced outside - the leakier the building envelope the more cool air is forced outside. If a return register is placed in that same room, sized at an equal cfm to the supply register, the room is under neutral pressure and you don’t lose conditioned air to the outside or attic. And the opposite is true, a room with a return register, without a supply register, will be under negative air pressure and thus some non-conditioned air from outside or the attic will be drawn into the house. That is the reason some houses are built with with balanced (cfm) supply and return air ducting/registers in each conditioned room. That is the ideal scenario, but more costly, which is probably the main reason it’s not done more often.

But I’ll agree, if the existing return air supply is under-sized and insufficient return air is not being supplied to the HVAC it would better to add an additional return air register to the unit even if located right next to the exiting return register than to not add one at all.

And I’ll close by saying all this assumes that only the return air ducting is undersized and not the supply ducts. If the supply air ducting is also undersized for the HVAC tonnage, then adding additional return air ducting to the system may not make any difference. This is pretty easily checked by HVAC technicians by measuring static pressure of the system at the air handler on both the return and supply side, getting a total external static pressure and comparing the cfm air flow to the HVAC manufacturers air handler blower performance charts. I’ll bet dollars to donuts the OPs HVAC tech didn’t do this, but it’s one of the first things that that should be checked when a homeowner is experiencing an air flow related cooling/heating issue.
This post was edited on 6/11/20 at 6:03 pm
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