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Started By
Message
SJW’s set their sights on DND
Posted on 7/6/20 at 7:01 am
Posted on 7/6/20 at 7:01 am
Now they’ve gone too far. This is absolutely ridiculous.
LINK
LINK
This post was edited on 7/6/20 at 7:02 am
Posted on 7/6/20 at 8:11 am to Master Guilbeau
It's pretty hilarious reading the comments and seeing these folks talk about how it's such a great idea that will help solve some of the world's ills.
It's pretty clear they don't think people are smart enough to run games with morally complex characters without strict rules to follow.
It also seems as though they assume the D&D community is filled with a bunch of bigots that need to be taught not to be bigots by changing game lore.
Guess I ought to buy a copy of Curse of Strahd before they put out the SJW reprint.
It's pretty clear they don't think people are smart enough to run games with morally complex characters without strict rules to follow.
It also seems as though they assume the D&D community is filled with a bunch of bigots that need to be taught not to be bigots by changing game lore.
Guess I ought to buy a copy of Curse of Strahd before they put out the SJW reprint.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 8:20 am to Sasquatch Smash
Yeah people are buying up every piece of older dnd material they can find. I love how they equated the drow being evil to their dark skin color saying that’s racist. Literally no one has ever made real life comparisons to dark skin people to drow.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 8:55 am to Master Guilbeau
quote:
“‘Human’ in D&D means everyone, not just fantasy versions of northern Europeans”
Since when DIDN'T it mean that? In the very earliest of years when the only people playing or writing the content were white?
Wizards can't even reliably put out FR-based novels any longer, if it weren't for Salvatore's over-whelming popularity they wouldn't have had any novels under that banner since October 2016.
Part of the appeal for such games is the fantasy of straight-forward good vs. evil. That black and white aspect is a welcomed break from the infinite shades of grey coloring most of our lives. It also makes for more interesting story-telling when one of these monolithic types breaks from tradition (see: Drizzt Do'Urden, for example). Remove that and you remove a certain dynamic for storytelling.
Another aspect on this is that many of these races are the way they are for a reason. Both Drow and Orcs are societies driven by their theology, that theology is based on a prime deity which is evil and evil deities are not only very controlling but they brook no disloyalty. The Orcs are physically portrayed as bestial as a visual queue to their behaviors and societies. Orcs were conceived to be the visual and societal opposites of the nobility found in the elves, hobbits and dwarves.
While Tolkien said LOTR (from which D&D is derived) was never an allegory to his time in WWI nor his sons' time in WW2, taking his writing and timing into account it would be far more accurate to theorize that the orcs represented Germany rather than blacks. To attempt to infer such a racial intent against blacks is only self-serving and has no basis in reality.
Drow were made black as a visual reference to differentiate them from other elves (moon elves who are bluish grey, high elves who are golden or white, wood elves who can be tan or green, etc) as part of their lore (see: The Sundering).
While someone could easily claim racism with only a casual glance, the reasons have no actual tie with race-relations. Any attempt to do so is done so out of some self-serving aspect, ignorance or both.
Oh well, looks like WotC is about to experience the meme "get woke, go broke". They better have one helluva saving throw.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 9:12 am to Master Guilbeau
There will be hell to pay if the try to come for my Dakimakura body pillow.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 9:52 am to brucevilanch
Shutup Bruce lol, this is real and seriously sad.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 10:11 am to Master Guilbeau
Gotta love how these people look at Orcs and think “yeah that’s black people” and then have gall to call others racist
Posted on 7/6/20 at 11:05 am to Master Guilbeau
That's so dumb. No one actually believed DND was racist.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 11:35 am to CarolinaGamecock99
Lol they’re even removing all racial bonus stats like dwarves +2 to strength and stuff so that all races and characters can be equal. Lol. How pathetic.
This post was edited on 7/6/20 at 11:36 am
Posted on 7/6/20 at 11:37 am to Master Guilbeau
The changes they are proposing will kill the current ruleset. No one will use it. Ogre's as complex? Get ready for Ogre Mage Tank/Nuke at the same time.
Sheesh. All you can do is laugh at how fast these companies bend the knee for people who don't ever buy their products.
Sheesh. All you can do is laugh at how fast these companies bend the knee for people who don't ever buy their products.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 11:38 am to Master Guilbeau
quote:
Lol they’re even removing all racial bonus stats like dwarves +2 to strength and stuff so that all races and characters can be equal. Lol. How pathetic.
I'm not the biggest dnd player but doesn't that kinda fundamentally change how it's played?
Posted on 7/6/20 at 12:11 pm to Master Guilbeau
quote:
Lol they’re even removing all racial bonus stats like dwarves +2 to strength and stuff so that all races and characters can be equal. Lol. How pathetic.
That's not what it said at all. What they said was they are changing the racial bonuses.
That's akin to different ability variations based on background.
For example, an Orc who grew up in a Warlock-based tribe would have increased Charisma instead of increased Strength.
Humans already have a trait where they either take +1 on all scores or +2 on one score plus 2 feats.
If Wizards goes too far, players will just ignore the new rules.
This post was edited on 7/6/20 at 12:13 pm
Posted on 7/6/20 at 12:49 pm to CGSC Lobotomy
quote:
Humans already have a trait where they either take +1 on all scores or +2 on one score plus 2 feats.
This is the key. It will have to be presented as an optional rule.
quote:
For example, an Orc who grew up in a Warlock-based tribe would have increased Charisma instead of increased Strength.
However, this to me does water down some of the potential complexity. Instead of having a brute go down a different path outside of their nature, you just have the potential for every race being the same flavor. But, I guess, that's the goal here.
Strength, in my opinion, is a genetic/phenotypic trait, whereas Charisma would be more a learned trait.
Nature vs. Nurture.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 1:34 pm to Sasquatch Smash
quote:
whereas Charisma would be more a learned trait.
In either 2nd or third edition, there was a 7th ability score called "Comeliness" which reflected physical beauty to differentiate from Charisma.
Charisma in D&D also includes physical attractiveness which isn't a learned trait.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 1:53 pm to CGSC Lobotomy
quote:
Charisma in D&D also includes physical attractiveness which isn't a learned trait.
Fair enough.
So, now we have pretty orcs, then? Haha.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 3:35 pm to Sasquatch Smash
quote:
So, now we have pretty orcs, then? Haha
Ever been "drawn" to someone without them saying a word? That's natural Charisma.
As far as pretty orcs, think Paula Patton from Warcraft.
This post was edited on 7/6/20 at 3:36 pm
Posted on 7/6/20 at 4:03 pm to Sasquatch Smash
quote:
have the potential for every race being the same flavor. But, I guess, that's the goal here.
Ding ding ding.
Loses all complexity when everyone can be good at everything rather than their choices having to reflect inherent bonuses/drawbacks.
All subtlety gone.
Posted on 7/6/20 at 4:20 pm to Master Guilbeau
Well, when it comes to the Drow, most of the time you encountered one it was a player as the "only" good Drow. If you counted up all the good aligned characters who are drow, then they'd probably outnumber the evil ones these days.
But just having the players face wave after wave of evil "race" is lazy storytelling anyway. Or encourages lazy behavior of the players.
DM: "You encounter some goblins, and..."
Player: "I kill 'em!"
DM: "They haven't done anything to you yet."
Player: "They're goblins, therefor they're always evil. Monster Manual says so. So, after I kill these, I track down their village and slaughter all of them, because Monster Manual."
Lazy.
But just having the players face wave after wave of evil "race" is lazy storytelling anyway. Or encourages lazy behavior of the players.
DM: "You encounter some goblins, and..."
Player: "I kill 'em!"
DM: "They haven't done anything to you yet."
Player: "They're goblins, therefor they're always evil. Monster Manual says so. So, after I kill these, I track down their village and slaughter all of them, because Monster Manual."
Lazy.
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