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Message
re: School safety: A few things to increase it
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:39 am to LSU316
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:39 am to LSU316
You guys act like schools are just one block style building. They aren't lol, and not even close. Most High schools are on something like 20-50 acres and have tons of buildings, multiple parking lots, etc.
My HS you could have 5 cops and 20 metal detectors, and it would still be easy as hell to drop 3 mags through an AK during class changes before a Cop got to you.
There's really not an answer that will work. We have a lot of guns in this country, and I own many myself.
My HS you could have 5 cops and 20 metal detectors, and it would still be easy as hell to drop 3 mags through an AK during class changes before a Cop got to you.
There's really not an answer that will work. We have a lot of guns in this country, and I own many myself.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:45 am to baldona
quote:
There's really not an answer that will work.
A single point of locked electronic entry will help.
Now sure a guy could shoot from outside the fence into the school.....but I'll take being shot at by a .223 from 50 yards versus 5 feet all day.
ETA
quote:
Most High schools are on something like 20-50 acres
I'm not sure but I don't think most high schools sit on 6 city blocks (at least most that I know of don't)...which is approximately 20 acres (best way to visualize it).
This post was edited on 2/15/18 at 10:49 am
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:47 am to magildachunks
don't understand why schools have to budget police.
Why can't we post on-duty cops at schools instead of having them trying to catch speeders and inspection sticker violaters?
So much this. More protect, less collect.
Why can't we post on-duty cops at schools instead of having them trying to catch speeders and inspection sticker violaters?
So much this. More protect, less collect.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:49 am to CharlesLSU
I’d rather budget for books than law enforcement at every school.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:50 am to LSU316
quote:
A single point of locked electronic entry will help.
How is this feasible? Ok so say you fence all 20-50 acres of most high schools. You still have a bunch of gates, there's absolutely no way you have one gate. Then you have someone manning every gate?
Most High schools are simply not designed for one entry. They may have multiple accesses for multiple athletic events, maybe a music building, cafeteria, etc.
Furthermore, so you have one entrance and some how you now have a shooter inside. That creates a dangerous arse situation too.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:50 am to Earthmover
quote:
Why can't we post on-duty cops at schools instead of having them trying to catch speeders and inspection sticker violaters?
That's a good question
But everywhere I've seen the school or school board has to come out of pocket for the officer....a lot of places it is like extra duty for the officers.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:51 am to baldona
quote:
How is this feasible? Ok so say you fence all 20-50 acres of most high schools. You still have a bunch of gates, there's absolutely no way you have one gate. Then you have someone manning every gate?
All gates are locked from the outside and not necessarily manned.
ETA
I'm not saying it won't take particular/precise design techniques to make this work....but it could be done....it is done pretty well at my daughter's school which doesn't sit on 20 acres....but it is probably 3-5.
quote:
Most High schools are simply not designed for one entry. They may have multiple accesses for multiple athletic events, maybe a music building, cafeteria, etc.
Athletic events usually occur after school hours....if they occur during school hours then you probably need a special plan which probably means bringing in more men for those rare events. Music building, cafeteria, etc have no need to be accessed by anyone from the outside that hasn't been vetted verbally and visually by office personnel.
This post was edited on 2/15/18 at 10:55 am
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:51 am to CharlesLSU
quote:
3 - Revisit school safety protocols (i.e. more metal detectors, school access procedures, etc.)
I don't think more metal detectors will do anything other than provide a false sense of security.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:52 am to LSU316
quote:
I'm not sure but I don't think most high schools sit on 6 city blocks (at least most that I know of don't)...which is approximately 20 acres (best way to visualize it)
Obviously it depends on the size of the school, but I just looked up my High School and it sits on 33 acres and is around 2400 students. That includes parking, multiple athletic fields and practice fields, etc. Some are on campus some are off.
I've definitely seen bigger schools on larger campuses too.
FWIW we have a school police officer, I thought this was standard OP.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:53 am to Earthmover
quote:
don't understand why schools have to budget police. Why can't we post on-duty cops at schools instead of having them trying to catch speeders and inspection sticker violaters? So much this. More protect, less collect.
Not every school is in a jurisdiction where you have 100s of officers. A rural parish may only have 2 or 3 deputies on a shift patrolling but have 5-6 schools in the parish. The department cant afford to pay the salary of 4-5 extra people to be at these schools. Why stop at schools. What about hospitals, daycares, etc. Its just not feasible.
Many school districts will pay half the salary of an officer but many time these officers are trained school resource officers. Most are required to have a degree and not only provide security but also teach DARE and will fill in as a sub when needed. Its more of a way to have a school employee armed and commissioned rather than having a security force.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 10:57 am to baldona
quote:
I just looked up my High School and it sits on 33 acres and is around 2400 students.
I'd say country wide that is probably outside of the norm. Obviously that school will have some issues but I still think that given the correct planning, construction design, and commitment that a single entry point could work....maybe the single entry point at this school would have to be manned by more people who knows....like I said it would be harder here but still not impossible.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 11:00 am to LSU316
quote:
Music building, cafeteria, etc have no need to be accessed by anyone from the outside that hasn't been vetted verbally and visually by office personnel.
If someone wants to do this, its not that hard to find a way. Guns can fit in music cases pretty easily. I could fit a gun in a box of paper towels or other supplies meant for the cafeteria or custodian.
I mean most of these shootings occur by students that attend the school, they are vetted already. Have student ID's, etc.
It would be almost impossible to go through every box, bag, etc.
I often had two bags, one with baseball, soccer, or football practice stuff and a school book bag. That's a lot of crap for any officer to sort through.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 11:07 am to LSU316
quote:
I'd say country wide that is probably outside of the norm.
I disagree. Rural schools have even more space to screw with, they can be on tons of acreage.
I just looked up my county. My HS was 33 acres, one HS was 39, one was 40, one was 25 but was next to an elementary that was on 20 and that's where their football and baseball stadium was located also. These are all 2000-3000 students.
The one smaller HS I don't know 500-1000 was 12 acres but it also had 3 additional parcels owned by the school district for 9 more acres around it. I'm not sure what all is on those. But its basically 20 acres too.
Public High Schools are bigger then most people realize.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 11:07 am to CharlesLSU
Please edit your thread To say Public School Safety
This doesn’t happen at private schools
This doesn’t happen at private schools
Posted on 2/15/18 at 11:11 am to Walt OReilly
That's a very insensitive comment. I'm requesting admin.
Posted on 2/15/18 at 11:14 am to GoldenBoy
quote:
That's a very insensitive comment. I'm requesting admin.
That's fine but he is right in a lot of ways....and you present the problem well. People in publics don't want to really talk about why private's are safer.
ETA Maybe my sarcasm meter is broken....but still the point about still is relevant.
This post was edited on 2/15/18 at 11:16 am
Posted on 2/15/18 at 11:21 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
This is already extremely infrequent. It's a horrible tragedy, but statistically, how much less can it even happen?
quote:
The number of such incidents in the US was only one less than in all the other 36 countries put together. In 13 of those countries there were no incidents at all, either actual or attempted.
In 2010, the US was home to a population of approximately 309 million. The populations of these other countries totaled 3.8 billion.
And this doesnt even factor in the fact the US had an extreme uptick in school shootings since 2011......
This post was edited on 2/15/18 at 11:22 am
Posted on 2/15/18 at 12:18 pm to LNCHBOX
quote:Considering how often it happens in the US vs the rest of the world?
This is already extremely infrequent. It's a horrible tragedy, but statistically, how much less can it even happen?
You asked how much less can it happen? Isn't it happening more now than say 20, 30 or 40 years ago?
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