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re: .
Posted on 4/21/17 at 7:45 am to Draconian Sanctions
Posted on 4/21/17 at 7:45 am to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
Your rambling nonsense has no basis in reality and you have no idea what you're talking about
all you've had for 3 pages are lame insults. You'd think that you know something. Conan bombed. guess whose fault that is? a shitty lead in didn't lose him half the audience. He just wasn't any goodThis post was edited on 4/21/17 at 7:51 am
2
Posted on 4/21/17 at 8:04 am to DelU249
It's not an insult, it's a fact. You're speaking from ignorance. Read the book I linked you and then got back to me.
Posted on 4/21/17 at 8:47 am to DelU249
IMO, if the landscape of television 10 years ago was like it is today, I think Conan might've done better on The Tonight Show. The blue-hairs had a little more ratings pull back then, but the way things are now, the younger crowd could've elevated Conan's status, not unlike what they're doing for Fallon and his online content. Conan's my favorite late-night host, but back then, him hosting the Tonight Show was like sticking a square peg in a round hole.
You could also argue that a stronger show than that POS Leno hosted at 10PM could've helped Conan's ratings too. People were leaving NBC in droves before the 11PM news even started, never to return. After that fiasco, Conan absolutely deserved more time to build an audience, which you can lay squarely on NBC's shoulders.
Posted on 4/21/17 at 8:57 am to Draconian Sanctions
I don't need to read the story version of everything that was highly publicized
leno lost a quarter of the local affiliates audience. Conan lost half of his own
If you bomb as badly as he did you beat some responsibility and he's the one who took less money for a guarantee they'd push Leno (#1) out
leno lost a quarter of the local affiliates audience. Conan lost half of his own
If you bomb as badly as he did you beat some responsibility and he's the one who took less money for a guarantee they'd push Leno (#1) out
Posted on 4/21/17 at 8:58 am to vandelay industries
I think Fallon has a lot more appeal for the older crowd than Conan did. Part of Fallon's success is because he appeals to an older crowd as well as a younger audience.
Posted on 4/21/17 at 9:00 am to DelU249
quote:
Fox would've done it but they wouldn't have paid too much, but that's the risk.
Fox was entangled in syndication contracts from 11pm to midnight and could only show Conan on a portion of their affiliates because of those issues. No way Conan would take that deal, especially if he just wanted to spite NBC.
Fox wanted to get him on FX but TBS got the deal first.
quote:
I don't think Conan did anything wrong but he bombed and certainly the circumstances didn't help him
Conan is a natural writer, not a performer. He's a good interviewer in that he keeps things lighthearted and the guests laughing. I thought his Tonight Show was taking on a much more "mature" approach than when he was at Late Night, which I think would've caught on over time. But yeah, he just never got the chance with Leno's show screwing things up before him.
Ironically, throughout that whole fiasco with Leno, Conan's Tonight Show was probably the best couple of weeks of late night television in many years. His staff just didn't give a shite anymore, and people loved how he was directly bashing NBC. Pretty sure his ratings shot up big time throughout that whole ordeal.
This post was edited on 4/21/17 at 9:03 am
Posted on 4/21/17 at 9:09 am to DelU249
quote:
I don't need to read the story version of everything that was highly publicized
Obviously you do
Posted on 4/21/17 at 9:12 am to randybobandy
quote:
his is the correct answer!!!!! Most people thought Leno was 10X funnier.
Conan >>>>> Leno
Posted on 4/21/17 at 11:32 am to Draconian Sanctions
No I don't. I don't deny Conan had a lot working against him or that he got a raw deal, but when you tank like he did, you don't need to be worried about your lead in. You can talk about what you think Leno should have done and I can talk about how badly NBC fricked things up. There's blame to spread, but when you demand the tonight show from a guy who is #1 a shifty lead in isn't going to excuse you losing that many people. Simple as that.
You're good when the people say you're good.
You're good when the people say you're good.
Posted on 4/21/17 at 12:51 pm to DelU249
quote:
Do most people agree nbc fricked up by making leno relinquish the show in the first place.
Yes. But, NBC also fricked up by not giving The Tonight Show to Letterman in the first place. Now, Jay ended up making them a bunch of money and that supposedly makes it alright, but Dave did what was asked of him building the late show brand, appeared to have paid his dues and even had the tacit approval of Johnny.
And they doubled down on that trying to force Jay out for Conan.
(And Jimmy Fallon is fricking terrible...)
Posted on 4/21/17 at 1:09 pm to Ace Midnight
Well that's another tale
and yeah when you're #1 that does justify everything but no doubt the difference between Leno and letterman in the ratings was the brand name "tonight show" and NBC's murderer's row of sitcoms in the mid to late 90s.
Between letterman and leno you can discuss lead ins and all that stuff but Conan was handed an existing audience and flat out had them turning off the tv not even going to cbs or abc.
Now if Conan wanted to do some really good tv he'd book leno and letterman on the same night Or at least try to make it happen. Or maybe just leno.
ETA: say what you will about Oprah. That lady does great tv when there's something like this in the news and gives a good interview
and yeah when you're #1 that does justify everything but no doubt the difference between Leno and letterman in the ratings was the brand name "tonight show" and NBC's murderer's row of sitcoms in the mid to late 90s.
Between letterman and leno you can discuss lead ins and all that stuff but Conan was handed an existing audience and flat out had them turning off the tv not even going to cbs or abc.
Now if Conan wanted to do some really good tv he'd book leno and letterman on the same night Or at least try to make it happen. Or maybe just leno.
ETA: say what you will about Oprah. That lady does great tv when there's something like this in the news and gives a good interview
This post was edited on 4/21/17 at 1:23 pm
Posted on 4/21/17 at 1:18 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:
Yes. But, NBC also fricked up by not giving The Tonight Show to Letterman in the first place
I don't think Letterman was cut out for the 11:30 timeslot either, at least not Letterman in his prime.
Creatively bankrupt, stale, depressed, and bored to death Letterman from the last 10 years would have been perfect hence why he regained the top spot when Conan was hosting the Tonight Show.
This post was edited on 4/21/17 at 1:19 pm
Posted on 4/21/17 at 1:21 pm to BulldogXero
Letterman didn't grow his numbers and beat Conan though. Conan just bombed
that's about the best way of putting it I've ever heard. When the clock struck midnight on y2k late night got boring or I got older.
quote:
Creatively bankrupt, stale, depressed, and bored to death
that's about the best way of putting it I've ever heard. When the clock struck midnight on y2k late night got boring or I got older. 
Posted on 4/21/17 at 1:57 pm to DelU249
quote:
i get not liking something that happens to be massively appealing to people, but that sounds unreasonable. surely you're kind of joking.
this would be DS normal saying of "if you don't agree with me, you're stupid."
it's pretty well documented.
Posted on 4/21/17 at 2:12 pm to BulldogXero
quote:
I don't think Letterman was cut out for the 11:30 timeslot either, at least not Letterman in his prime.
Maybe not - but, like I said, he'd clearly put in the work - for NBC. He literally built the 12:30 slot up from nothing and created the "late night" brand as a natural complement to the "older crowd" Tonight Show.
So, when you have a guy who has done this work - is 45 when the vacancy comes open and you don't even give him a shot? Hell, they could have tried it for 6 months and had guests cover the Late Night slot so he could slide back there if it didn't work.
Now - in hindsight, Leno was the right call. But, NBC didn't have that benefit then - it seemed petty at the time to go with Leno. (And I like and respect Leno.)
Posted on 4/21/17 at 2:16 pm to 3nOut
quote:
if you don't agree with me, you're stupid
which is the mark of extreme stupidity. I really go out of my way to not call anyone stupid, retarded, etc. unless they just say something profoundly stupid.
I try and specify the validity of things I don't agree with because unless something is really unreasonable or factually wrong (like the sky is blue), it's valid
Posted on 4/21/17 at 2:23 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:I think he was. leno beat him consistently but it's not like he was lapping the field.
Maybe not
the tonight show brand
network programming
OT,
I know it may not be your jam, but "watch what happens live" is some god damn good late night. discussion amongst people is more interesting. if andy cohen did that show without the constant real housewives plug guests (because he's friends with every big star) he may really have something good for network. it would be niche but you wouldn't be competing for the same audience as Colbert, fallon and kimmel. still blows my mind fox or hbo hasn't tried to lure him from nbc. you'd have to pay him, but not like you have to pay these other guys.
Posted on 4/21/17 at 2:36 pm to DelU249
quote:my perception (which is reality for me) is that Conan's Late Show contract was coming up. So was Jay's Tonight Show contract . Conan said to "either give me the Tonight Show or I walk". If NBC wanted JL , they should have let CO walk to ABC and re-up with JL. Instead , they gave CO TTS and re-up'd JL contract and came up with a stupid prime time show. They kept one too many roosters in the hen house.
conan gave them the tonight show ultimatum?
I would have re-up'd JL and let CO walk to whatever network he wanted to go to.
Posted on 4/21/17 at 2:59 pm to crazycubes
quote:still mind blowing. conan would've gone to fox though, right?
they should have let CO walk to ABC and re-up with JL
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