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Message
Official WiFi Thermostat thread
Posted on 11/15/14 at 10:32 am
Posted on 11/15/14 at 10:32 am
I am installing the 2 touchscreen Honeywell thermostats I bought today so I'll document the process including pics.
I had a challenging install due to lack of a c wire so I'll also show you how resolve that easily.
My total cost was $180 for both thermostats and the c wire kit! Well under the cost of a single nest unit plus this Honeywell is the darling of the diy forums. Check out the review below and I'll be back later with a full write up!
Bonus that WINK just confirmed this unit works in their ecosystem so if that's important to you, you're future proofed with this unit.
Honeywell 8580 vs NEST
STEP 1 PURCHASING.
You can get this unit for $150 from HOME DEPOT or $70 from Amazon Warehouse deals. The top seller listed here (MS WORLD 3 LLC) is the vendor I used and the units arrived nearly perfectly. Total was $141 for 2 units ( I need downstairs & upstairs both)
$68 Touchscreen Honeywell WiFi Unit
Next I thought I was going to need a venstar add-a-wire but it turns out I had hidden c-wires already that were disconnected. IMPORTANT - You need to check this out yourself prior to install so you know if you need to buy a kit or not.
$22 "Add a Wire" C-wire adapter kit
Next, you need to understand a bit about how HVAC works. Most conventional units have a fan, furnace and air compressor. This is your typical "4 wire" setup, that looks like this:
W wire (usually white) - HEAT
Y wire (usually yellow) - AC Compressor
G wire (usually green) - Fan
R wire (usually red) - 24 VAC (24v power)
C wire (usually blue) - 24 VAC common.** **required by honeywell but might not exist or not be connected depending on the age of your HVAC.
Ok, with me so far? For old mercury-based thermostats, those are all the wires you'd need.
The magical C wire or 24 VAC Common is simply an extra powered wire so you don't have to install a mercury-based switch but can instead use a power thermostat instead.
FYI Heat pumps require additional wiring and I won't go into that but read here to your heart's content for more detail:
What are all those wires used by my HVAC?
STEP 2 INSTALL THERMOSTAT SIDE
I have 2 units; upstairs & down. The downstairs unit is 'all in one' (furnace and compressor) located in that big rectangular box.
The upstairs unit has the furnace in the attic, and the compressor outside.
***PRIOR TO INSTALL*** you need to make sure you've turned all the power off!! The outside fusebox I had has one for each..but it did not turn off the furnace for my upstairs unit..only the compressor. Make sure you've killed power to both before starting.
Ok, first thing is I pulled the old unit off the wall & discovered there was actually a hidden c-wire. This made the job a little easier. See the hidden c-wire below?? Its actually wrapped around the wire insulation so I didn't realize I had one. LOOK FOR THIS FIRST BECAUSE IT WILL SAVE TIME & MONEY!
Now you just need to remove the old plate, make SURE the wires are labelled if not already (Honeywell includes labels in the kit) and simply line 'em up. RWYCG..with the "C" being the blue wire you just unwound from the wiring bundle.
STEP 3 - HOOK UP THE C-WIRE on HVAC
My access plate for my Bryant/Carrier clone is the right most front panel. Takes about 30 seconds to unscrew it. Here's what it looked like:
Ok, so first thing I realized is my unit isn't using SCREW DOWNS but the thermostat wires (the tiny wires) are spliced into the HVAC wires via electrical caps (see red box)
So the next step is to find the other end of the C blue wire (it was wrapped around the cable at this end as well) and connect it up. The "C" wire on the HVAC is brown. I've pointed out where it connects to the circuit board with the black arrow in this pic.
Make sense? Now all you have to do is wire the brown to the blue and you have common (below)
That's it! Once that's done, turn the power back on and go plug in the front of your thermostat plate if you haven't already.
Now, for the UPSTAIRS unit, its a little different. I had to locate the wiring patch panel in my furnace in the attic, and locate the common there as well. It was actually using the screw downs so it was easier to locate.
I did not touch the existing wiring, I just unscrewed the COMMON screw, stripped the blue wire and screwed it back in and turned the power back on (both at the compressor outside and at the attic unit)
STEP 4 - Program your unit
You will need 2 IDs, both located on the back of the thermostat that plugs into the wall (see below) or on a piece of paper with the unit. IF THE PAPER IS MISSING, TAKE A PIC OF THIS BEFORE YOU INSTALL IT!
Now plug it in and set the date/time
Honeywell doesn't tell you this, but because my units had been tested out before (open box) they both had the little 'watch battery' in them.
VERY IMPORTANT -- REMOVE THE BATTERY FOR 60+ SECONDS PRIOR TO INSTALL!! YOU WILL NEVER GET YOUR WIFI TO WORK IF NOT!
I pulled my hair out until I figured this out. Once I pulled the battery and let them 'forget' themselves, the WiFi connection process went smoothly.
The first thing that happens after you're connected (just follow their little step-by-step) is it will spend the next 30 seconds connecting..then the next 5-10 minutes updating the software. Yes, the thermostats automatically get new firmware when you install them the first time.
That's pretty much it! Just register on their website and download the iOS or Android app and you're good to go!
My next update will be about the "WINK APP" compatibility since my wife is getting me the "WINK Starter kit" as a gift. You don't need to hook this into WINK to use it though.
I had a challenging install due to lack of a c wire so I'll also show you how resolve that easily.
My total cost was $180 for both thermostats and the c wire kit! Well under the cost of a single nest unit plus this Honeywell is the darling of the diy forums. Check out the review below and I'll be back later with a full write up!
Bonus that WINK just confirmed this unit works in their ecosystem so if that's important to you, you're future proofed with this unit.
Honeywell 8580 vs NEST
STEP 1 PURCHASING.
You can get this unit for $150 from HOME DEPOT or $70 from Amazon Warehouse deals. The top seller listed here (MS WORLD 3 LLC) is the vendor I used and the units arrived nearly perfectly. Total was $141 for 2 units ( I need downstairs & upstairs both)
$68 Touchscreen Honeywell WiFi Unit
Next I thought I was going to need a venstar add-a-wire but it turns out I had hidden c-wires already that were disconnected. IMPORTANT - You need to check this out yourself prior to install so you know if you need to buy a kit or not.
$22 "Add a Wire" C-wire adapter kit
Next, you need to understand a bit about how HVAC works. Most conventional units have a fan, furnace and air compressor. This is your typical "4 wire" setup, that looks like this:
W wire (usually white) - HEAT
Y wire (usually yellow) - AC Compressor
G wire (usually green) - Fan
R wire (usually red) - 24 VAC (24v power)
C wire (usually blue) - 24 VAC common.** **required by honeywell but might not exist or not be connected depending on the age of your HVAC.
Ok, with me so far? For old mercury-based thermostats, those are all the wires you'd need.
The magical C wire or 24 VAC Common is simply an extra powered wire so you don't have to install a mercury-based switch but can instead use a power thermostat instead.
FYI Heat pumps require additional wiring and I won't go into that but read here to your heart's content for more detail:
What are all those wires used by my HVAC?
STEP 2 INSTALL THERMOSTAT SIDE
I have 2 units; upstairs & down. The downstairs unit is 'all in one' (furnace and compressor) located in that big rectangular box.
The upstairs unit has the furnace in the attic, and the compressor outside.
***PRIOR TO INSTALL*** you need to make sure you've turned all the power off!! The outside fusebox I had has one for each..but it did not turn off the furnace for my upstairs unit..only the compressor. Make sure you've killed power to both before starting.
Ok, first thing is I pulled the old unit off the wall & discovered there was actually a hidden c-wire. This made the job a little easier. See the hidden c-wire below?? Its actually wrapped around the wire insulation so I didn't realize I had one. LOOK FOR THIS FIRST BECAUSE IT WILL SAVE TIME & MONEY!
Now you just need to remove the old plate, make SURE the wires are labelled if not already (Honeywell includes labels in the kit) and simply line 'em up. RWYCG..with the "C" being the blue wire you just unwound from the wiring bundle.
STEP 3 - HOOK UP THE C-WIRE on HVAC
My access plate for my Bryant/Carrier clone is the right most front panel. Takes about 30 seconds to unscrew it. Here's what it looked like:
Ok, so first thing I realized is my unit isn't using SCREW DOWNS but the thermostat wires (the tiny wires) are spliced into the HVAC wires via electrical caps (see red box)
So the next step is to find the other end of the C blue wire (it was wrapped around the cable at this end as well) and connect it up. The "C" wire on the HVAC is brown. I've pointed out where it connects to the circuit board with the black arrow in this pic.
Make sense? Now all you have to do is wire the brown to the blue and you have common (below)
That's it! Once that's done, turn the power back on and go plug in the front of your thermostat plate if you haven't already.
Now, for the UPSTAIRS unit, its a little different. I had to locate the wiring patch panel in my furnace in the attic, and locate the common there as well. It was actually using the screw downs so it was easier to locate.
I did not touch the existing wiring, I just unscrewed the COMMON screw, stripped the blue wire and screwed it back in and turned the power back on (both at the compressor outside and at the attic unit)
STEP 4 - Program your unit
You will need 2 IDs, both located on the back of the thermostat that plugs into the wall (see below) or on a piece of paper with the unit. IF THE PAPER IS MISSING, TAKE A PIC OF THIS BEFORE YOU INSTALL IT!
Now plug it in and set the date/time
Honeywell doesn't tell you this, but because my units had been tested out before (open box) they both had the little 'watch battery' in them.
VERY IMPORTANT -- REMOVE THE BATTERY FOR 60+ SECONDS PRIOR TO INSTALL!! YOU WILL NEVER GET YOUR WIFI TO WORK IF NOT!
I pulled my hair out until I figured this out. Once I pulled the battery and let them 'forget' themselves, the WiFi connection process went smoothly.
The first thing that happens after you're connected (just follow their little step-by-step) is it will spend the next 30 seconds connecting..then the next 5-10 minutes updating the software. Yes, the thermostats automatically get new firmware when you install them the first time.
That's pretty much it! Just register on their website and download the iOS or Android app and you're good to go!
My next update will be about the "WINK APP" compatibility since my wife is getting me the "WINK Starter kit" as a gift. You don't need to hook this into WINK to use it though.
This post was edited on 11/17/14 at 12:16 pm
Posted on 11/15/14 at 10:50 am to CAD703X
The reserved posts crack me up. I am a complete rookie at this type of stuff but I luckily had a C wire on my old thermostat that was unused. I just hooked it up to the stat and the board and it all worked.
I forgot to turn the heater down yesterday in the morning so I opened my phone app and turned it down from work. Gotta love that.
I have a Honeywell Model # RTH6580WF
I forgot to turn the heater down yesterday in the morning so I opened my phone app and turned it down from work. Gotta love that.
I have a Honeywell Model # RTH6580WF
This post was edited on 11/15/14 at 10:53 am
Posted on 11/15/14 at 11:25 am to SirPsychoSexy
How much the T-stay cost and from where? Been contemplating a wireless unit, but can't justify it over the 5/2 programmable.
This post was edited on 11/15/14 at 11:26 am
Posted on 11/15/14 at 11:41 am to LSUtigerME
I have a wifi one from the alarm company. I love it.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 12:02 pm to CAD703X
I'm moving next week and want to put in a Wifi thermostat. I'll be checking back.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 12:53 pm to CAD703X
I'm getting the rth9580 thermostats (need 2) for my house. Already checked and I already have a spare wire ran to use for a c wire. So should be easy. My friend works in the ac business and is suppose to be getting them for free for me. Hopefully he comes through.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 1:06 pm to CAD703X
Not trying to be a nattering nabob of negativity, but is there that much benefit over a programmble thermostat? The new ones have quite a few options.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 1:21 pm to VetteGuy
Forgetting while away from home and being lazy on the couch is all I've used it for differently
This post was edited on 11/15/14 at 1:22 pm
Posted on 11/15/14 at 2:22 pm to Hu_Flung_Pu
Yeah i really want one. When im coming back from vacation woild be nice to come back to a cool house. And laziness on sofa of course
Posted on 11/15/14 at 3:23 pm to VetteGuy
I think it depends on your schedule, how much you change your settings, and what type of control you want.
The nest does some interesting things that I don't think are worth it, but claims it'll save money. Like Turing just the fan on and not the compressor, and turning compressor off before the fan to use a little residual cooling, etc.
The wifi will allow you to monitor it from elsewhere and make adjustments. This is good if your schedule tends to change (shift work) since programmables are locked into that schedule. You can make adjustments on the way home and it'll be ready when you get there, especially if you make big swings on your settings.
The nest does some interesting things that I don't think are worth it, but claims it'll save money. Like Turing just the fan on and not the compressor, and turning compressor off before the fan to use a little residual cooling, etc.
The wifi will allow you to monitor it from elsewhere and make adjustments. This is good if your schedule tends to change (shift work) since programmables are locked into that schedule. You can make adjustments on the way home and it'll be ready when you get there, especially if you make big swings on your settings.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 4:49 pm to LSUtigerME
I almost bought an Ecobee during the summer and wired up a C-wire because of it. I decided to not do it because Google had just bought out Nest and I wanted to see where competition brought the market. There are a ton more smart/wifi thermostats out now. I will probably get a smart thermostat this winter because the wife and I are on a much more predictable schedule.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 4:51 pm to AutoYes_Clown
I have the Nest and my bill has gone from 135 per month down to 75-85 per month.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 5:12 pm to LSUtigerME
quote:
The nest does some interesting things that I don't think are worth it, but claims it'll save money. Like Turing just the fan on and not the compressor
Better just to use ceiling or floor fans if you have them for spot treatment. Running the A/C fan can draw air in from the outside and probably uses more power.
quote:
and turning compressor off before the fan to use a little residual cooling, etc.
That's pretty standard. My 8 y/o Honeywell TH8321, which looks identical to cad's photo aside from the wifi, does that.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 5:14 pm to CAD703X
How did you get both for 180? Amazon has them listed for 120+ for just one.
Also, I was looking for you the other day. Need a good mp3 download app. Music maniac and tunee no longer exist and all the playstore apps are shite.
Also, I was looking for you the other day. Need a good mp3 download app. Music maniac and tunee no longer exist and all the playstore apps are shite.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 6:30 pm to CAD703X
Where did you get that Honeywell thermostat for $90? Home Depot had it for $149. I was about to buy it then remembered this thread
Posted on 11/15/14 at 7:37 pm to aaronb023
Real quick.. Amazon warehouse has open box units fur $68 + shipping.. I'll post more about mine but don't remotely consider home depot.
Who cares about an open box when you're throwing it away anyway.
Who cares about an open box when you're throwing it away anyway.
Posted on 11/15/14 at 10:55 pm to CAD703X
quote:
Amazon warehouse has open box units fur $68 + shipping
Link? I don't see it. Cheapest I see on AW is 100 bucks.
Posted on 11/16/14 at 7:04 am to whodatfan
Right here. $69. Like new in distressed packaging.
amazon marketplace
Eta. Mine were brand new.. Only the box was chewed up a little.
amazon marketplace
Eta. Mine were brand new.. Only the box was chewed up a little.
This post was edited on 11/16/14 at 7:05 am
Posted on 11/16/14 at 9:12 am to CAD703X
Not sure if any one know why, but we turn on our heater, its stays on and never turns off. Not sure if this is more of a thermostat issue or the main board on the furnace. Thanks for any help.
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