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re: How pissed will the green lobby be when fusion gets going?
Posted on 5/20/14 at 10:41 am to antibarner
Posted on 5/20/14 at 10:41 am to antibarner
Fusion will be expensive if it ever happens. And we'll probably all be dead. It takes a decade to build a fission reactor, and we've been building those for 50 years. Heck it's going to take 20 years to build the UPF in Oak Ridge. It took 30 to put a giant hole in the ground in Nevada, and then government said screw it, and just left it there. Fusion...lol.
I'd love to give Fusion a serious look. It's really the only type of research government should be involved in. High risk, High reward, game changers. The stuff you shouldn't expect private industry to take up.
I'd love to give Fusion a serious look. It's really the only type of research government should be involved in. High risk, High reward, game changers. The stuff you shouldn't expect private industry to take up.
0
Posted on 5/20/14 at 10:54 am to CptBengal
quote:
yeah, who uses any of this...I agree cwill, out of business!:
You are a child, you know nothing about the industry. If O&G are replaced as an energy provider it will wipe out such a significant part of O&G demand that most O&G companies will go out of business...all that shite you listed isn't enough to support the industry as it exists today....there will be significant contraction. To tink otherwise is beyond foolish.
This post was edited on 5/20/14 at 11:00 am
Posted on 5/20/14 at 10:56 am to cwill
we have been hearing fusion is just around the corner for 20+ years. Where the frick is it?
I hope we can do it, it would potentially be what saves us from ourselves, but I wouldn't put money on it.
I hope we can do it, it would potentially be what saves us from ourselves, but I wouldn't put money on it.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 11:00 am to cwill
quote:
..all that shot you listed isn't enough to support the industry as it exists today....there will be significant contraction.
of course there will be contraction.
your comment, moron, was they would be out of business.
That comment, as pointed out....was wrong, as per usual for you.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 11:15 am to CptBengal
I said most would go out of business but for a few that would be there providing petroleum for non energy products idiot. And that is a fact. There are thousands of energy companies beyond the big 4 (or 5 if you include COP) and the state sponsored companies that would disappear if demand caused oil to drop to $60 or below. As for nat gas I could see a sub $2/mcf that would cause every nat gas independent to disappear. Entire plays would become uneconomic...it would crater the industry. So you see child, that's what would happen.
And as has often been the case when you aren't blatantly misrepresenting facts you show us that you know little about a lot.
And as has often been the case when you aren't blatantly misrepresenting facts you show us that you know little about a lot.
This post was edited on 5/20/14 at 11:18 am
Posted on 5/20/14 at 11:56 am to cwill
Fusion will also compete and probably put current fission reactors out of business. I do believe existing natural gas co-gen plants would remain online under the assumption that fusion reactors cannot be throttled like existing fission reactors cannot be throttled. Natural gas will play a role during peak demand because you can throttle turbines. Fusion will the provide the base load.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 11:59 am to GumboPot
Why can't you throttle fusion reactors? How do they throttle fission reactors? Add more rods?
Posted on 5/20/14 at 12:07 pm to CptBengal
Not pissed as they will just shift more to big Pharma big Agg big chemical and whale killers.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 12:17 pm to goatmilker
The obsession with "green" folk is fascinating. God forbid we quit abusing the planet, and look for other methods to fuel our greed. While lamenting all the soldiers killed in the Middle East, whilst raging over Benghazi, step back for one second and realize that they're all dead because of our country's lust for money, i.e., oil.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 12:24 pm to JuiceTerry
quote:
God forbid we quit abusing the planet
I had to buy an r34 recharge kit last week and spent almost $40. It cost me about $5 with r12. I love the outdoors and want a clean environment but every time you green folks come up with a new cause célèbre, I grab my wallet.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 12:33 pm to UncleFestersLegs
Does anyone think some green group would try to sabotage a fusion plant, thus 'proving' fusion is unsafe?
Posted on 5/20/14 at 12:37 pm to GumboPot
quote:
Because the green lobby's agenda is central command and control from Washington DC. Fusion plants on a footprint the size of a tractor trailer cuts into their grand plans. Statist hate diversity especially the kind of diversity that offers more freedom. And more energy choices gives people more freedom.
Without expending significant effort, I could not have said this better myself.
Bravo. Endorsed, upvoted and
Posted on 5/20/14 at 3:45 pm to Ace Midnight
It's fricking idiotic to believe that the green movement is about less choices for energy sources. How in the world has the alternative energy debate turned into less freedom? Some of these viewpoints are mind boggling.. You think people that brew up their own bio diesel are statist slaves? The green nutjobs have nothing on some of you guys.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 4:22 pm to JuiceTerry
Most green energy supporters do not support nuclear (fission). And right now, it's the only real base load "green" option (ignoring economics, which the green movement usually does).
I wouldn't be surprised if they turned against fusion too (yes, I know it's theoretically superior to fission in waste and safety).
I wouldn't be surprised if they turned against fusion too (yes, I know it's theoretically superior to fission in waste and safety).
Posted on 5/20/14 at 5:29 pm to GumboPot
quote:
Fusion will also compete and probably put current fission reactors out of business. I do believe existing natural gas co-gen plants would remain online under the assumption that fusion reactors cannot be throttled like existing fission reactors cannot be throttled. Natural gas will play a role during peak demand because you can throttle turbines. Fusion will the provide the base load.
The price of nat gas would probably get hit harder than oil under this hypo...most gas producers would go under and most of the shale plays would be rendered uneconomic. I think it's hilarious that some think this wouldn't be utterly disastrous for the O&G industry.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 5:32 pm to cwill
quote:
he price of nat gas would probably get hit harder than oil under this hypo...most gas producers would go under and most of the shale plays would be rendered uneconomic. I think it's hilarious that some think this wouldn't be utterly disastrous for the O&G industry.
Probably in the short term but there has been a big push to use NG in the automotive industry. They would quickly move to try to get cars running on NG which I think many people would be receptive to the idea.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 5:33 pm to NukemVol
Let's be clear, the "green movement" as mentioned by most posters here mirrors the right-wing nutjob faction in many ways.
Then there's the majority who believe in "science" and think that perhaps we should be exploring clean energy with more vigor. I believe most of this latter group would welcome fusion over fossil fuels.
Then there's the majority who believe in "science" and think that perhaps we should be exploring clean energy with more vigor. I believe most of this latter group would welcome fusion over fossil fuels.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 5:37 pm to TejasHorn
quote:
Then there's the majority who believe in "science" and think that perhaps we should be exploring clean energy with more vigor
I think everyone here isn't opposed to exploring clean energy but the way it has been done so far is really leaving a bad taste in the taxpayers' mouths.
Posted on 5/20/14 at 5:40 pm to JuiceTerry
quote:
You think people that brew up their own bio diesel are statist slaves?
No - individuals who do this are probably libertarian.
quote:
The green nutjobs have nothing on some of you guys.
They think human beings are the problem...energy production is just a byproduct of human activity to them. They'll want to tell us what size car to drive, even if they're fusion powered. They'll want to tell us how many cars we should have, how big a house, what to set the thermostat on (and, frighteningly, they almost have the power to do this now, with the "smart" grid.)
Just wait...
Posted on 5/20/14 at 7:15 pm to Ace Midnight
I think there is a difference between people who are environmentally conscious and politicians pushing wind farms so that they can cash in. But the above poster equating green minded folks with hating freedom is just absurd. Louisiana folks in particular are so invested that many would sacrifice their entire coastline in order to protect the oil and gas industry. There's absolutely nothing wrong with pursuing alternative energy, but I am not naive enough to believe political greed doesn't play a part. But that's America. If they aren't grifting that way, you can bet they are some other way.
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