re: What's LeBron's legacy if Ray Allen doesn't bail him out with the 3-pointer?

quote:

---

MJ was a great defender but LeBron is the most verstatile defender in NBA history.

---

I think that's more impressive than it is useful. So LeBron can guard 5 positions and Jordan could only guard 3, is there really a need to be so versatile? And if this were the 90s, LeBron really could only be effective guarding 4 positions. Let's say Jordan could guard 4 positions also, does that mean you replace Rodman with a more offensive minded player that just takes shots from Jordan? What's the point of that? Better to let Rodman do the dirty work on defense and let Jordan carry the offensive load.

If there were no salary cap and the Heat could afford a decent center you'd be an idiot to want LeBron wasting energy and fouls banging with the bigs on defense. The game is won by scoring more points than the opponent. LeBron is capable of scoring or creating as well as anyone in the league, yet his Usage Rate declines in the playoffs, and Assists are part of the Usage Rate stat, so that means he's basically letting others control the game. That is why he's not the GOAT. He may have all the physical tools to be the GOAT, but he doesn't use them like the GOAT.

quote:

---

Jordan Reg Usg 33.3% Playoffs Usg 35.6%
LeBron Reg Usg 31.7% Playoffs Usg 31.4%

When the games matter most, Jordan controls the game even more than normal. That's why Jordan gets so much credit despite getting help from role players. Because Jordan played a larger role than LeBron in winning not 1, not 2, not 3...

There's nothing wrong with being in the conversation for 2nd GOAT.

---

This is kind of stupid. Why does the GOAT have to dominate scoring? Usage rate is FGA+FTA+TOs. Why are you working under the assumption that you can't "control the game even more" by gathering assists?

Magic Johnson was widely considered the GOAT by many, and, if he had played the type of defense Jordan was capable of, he might still be. Usage rate just seems like a weird distinction to make for who can be the GOAT. You can control the game in more ways than scoring.

quote:

---

Dispute one fact in the linked text. I will individually go to espn and post the box score links if you would like. Or would you rather just deflect?

---

Go ahead...

I'm waiting

quote:

---

with the semi-zone D teams play now you can't just iso wings out and let them take 40 shots every night like teams did in the 90s

---

Last game the refs definitely swallowed their whistle's, but the way stars get calls in this league it seems like LeBron forcing things would still be pretty effective on offense.

quote:

---

Are they? I'm seeing different ways in which usage rate is determined.

---

I've seen it both ways too, but the stats I pulled were from basketball-reference.com and this is how they define Usage Rate:

quote:

---

Usg% Usage Percentage (available since the 1977-78 season in the NBA); the formula is 100 * ((FGA + 0.44 * FTA + TOV) * (Tm MP / 5)) / (MP * (Tm FGA + 0.44 * Tm FTA + Tm TOV)). Usage percentage is an estimate of the percentage of team plays used by a player while he was on the floor.

---

So I guess assists aren't considered which does make it less of an indicator than I thought. Thanks for the catch.

What fact are u disputing troll?

quote:

---

then wade comes in and it got all fricked up. it is frustrating as a lebron fan. but i don't know how much is coaching/wade and how much is lebron. we may never really know

---

It isn't Wade's fault Lebron isn't as good when he is in the game. They both are at their best when driving to the basket. So having both on the floor at the same time creates a clusterfrick a lot of the time. I created a thread the other night because I think it is time for Wade to evolve his jump shooting into the strength of his offense. The Heat would be much better off if he did and his career would be prolonged.

5/19