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Firing someone...
Posted on 8/8/11 at 7:18 pm
Posted on 8/8/11 at 7:18 pm
I've never really had to fire anyone before, but feeling like my first time is ahead. However, the person is actually quite good at the work, but they are just an absolute nuisance when it comes to gossiping, spreading false rumors, and just causing bad morale within the department.
Anyone ever fired someone when its not really performance related? What type of support am I going to need to provide to HR, or can I just "do it"?
Anyone ever fired someone when its not really performance related? What type of support am I going to need to provide to HR, or can I just "do it"?
Posted on 8/8/11 at 7:40 pm to Htown Tiger
I have fired people before that cause chaos in the office. That can be as destructive as not doing your work.
Posted on 8/8/11 at 7:49 pm to Htown Tiger
CYA Have you logged complaints and talked to this individual about their behavior?
Posted on 8/8/11 at 7:55 pm to Interception
quote:
Have you logged complaints and talked to this individual about their behavior?
Not really, to be honest. But others in the office can confirm the things this person has said. I guess thats part of my question- do I really need to CMY? I mean, since Texas is an "at will" state, why do I need the evidence?
Posted on 8/8/11 at 7:57 pm to Htown Tiger
If it was me I would have a sit-down talk with the individual if they are good at the work. Explain to them how their behaviors affecting the company and tell them if you don't see a turnaround you may be forced to let them go.
Posted on 8/8/11 at 8:11 pm to TheFreeAgent
If it was me I would have a sit-down talk with the individual if they are good at the work. Explain to them how their behaviors affecting the company and tell them if you don't see a turnaround you may be forced to let them go.
THIS....but if it continues,pull the trigger...and it will send a message to everyone else
THIS....but if it continues,pull the trigger...and it will send a message to everyone else
Posted on 8/8/11 at 8:44 pm to Htown Tiger
Been there....firing someone sucks. The first person I had to let go was a single mom and the child had a disability. She was not cut out for the job in any form, shape or fashion.....really sweet, but just horrible at the job. It was REALLY tough to do regardless. Didn't sleep for nights.
Where I live it is NOT a "right to work" state.
If you are not in a "right to work" state, I don't believe any documentation of deficiency is required. You can simply say, "I'm sorry, but this isn't working out." To my knowledge nothing else is required other than paying a small bump in your unemployment rate. You can probably find yourself in more trouble trying to explain your reasoning than if you just cut ties without a specific reason.
Where I live it is NOT a "right to work" state.
If you are not in a "right to work" state, I don't believe any documentation of deficiency is required. You can simply say, "I'm sorry, but this isn't working out." To my knowledge nothing else is required other than paying a small bump in your unemployment rate. You can probably find yourself in more trouble trying to explain your reasoning than if you just cut ties without a specific reason.
Posted on 8/8/11 at 8:49 pm to Htown Tiger
How to handle a gossip:
Gossip: Hey youre not gonna believe what Joe did last weekend!!!!
You: Hold on. (Pages Joe). Hey Joe, Gossip has a great story, and I want you to hear it.
Problem solved.
Gossip: Hey youre not gonna believe what Joe did last weekend!!!!
You: Hold on. (Pages Joe). Hey Joe, Gossip has a great story, and I want you to hear it.
Problem solved.
Posted on 8/8/11 at 8:54 pm to Htown Tiger
If you work at a large company, have a meeting and talk to the person, and document the meeting with HR. If it occurs again (and with these type of people it's a matter of time), you'll be covered when you can him/her.
Posted on 8/8/11 at 9:02 pm to LSU0358
My suggestion would be to keep an employee manual for every employee. Have them read it and sign it when hired. Then anytime you meet with the employee good or bad, make notes in said manual. Then you always have documentation if it's needed. Trust me from experience you want documentation if you ever end up in court, that is the only thing that will help in court.
Posted on 8/8/11 at 9:32 pm to TheFreeAgent
quote:
If it was me I would have a sit-down talk with the individual if they are good at the work. Explain to them how their behaviors affecting the company and tell them if you don't see a turnaround you may be forced to let them go.
This
Posted on 8/8/11 at 9:46 pm to luvmesumlsu
Okay, you need to look up your office policy manual that this fella/fellerette got when they signed on.
They more than likely signed off on the fact that they read & understood it.
Then, you need to realize that you're not going to be able to take care of it in one day. Do that & they will hit you up for unemployment, & more than likely use it against you in other ways, as well. More headache than its worth.
You will need to begin to document the issues in writing.
Step 1: Send him/her an e-mail scheduling a meeting regarding their policy manual.
Have the section regarding personal conduct & office behavior printed out with an extra copy for them, with the pertinent sections highlighted. Be firm, clear, & direct. Use your policy manual if you've got one, but make sure you tell them that as a result of this meeting, you'll be sending a follow up e-mail to reiterate-in writing-the results of the meeting.
That's your 1st step.
2nd step is to nail his or her arse to the wall in short order immediately after that happens with the most recent thing that occurred, and indicate that you "were not aware" of the incident until afterwards.
Again document in writing this issue, and reprimand them in writing, and send a read-receipt on it.
From there, put them on a Corrective Action Plan that's so tight you'd see a fart bubble down the back of their thigh if they were standing.
First offense, they're done, and you've got 3 separate incidents on paper, and you've shown where there's a habitual pattern that you've documented in several instances.
If your company doesn't have a policy manual, then its either too small and you should just 86 them out of hand and say screw you, or your company's HR department is pretty dumb and you should stop & think about that.
But, document the hell out of it, and you'll be in the clear when it comes to them filing for unemployment, or coming after you via other methods.
Read Receipt every single e-mail you send, and hit them with the first meeting without addressing the issue at hand, to make them accept it. Following up with a discussion about their behavior in the post-meeting e-mail seals their fate.
You may think its complicated, but you'll save yourself some money & some time if you insulate yourself via documentation & a good process.
They more than likely signed off on the fact that they read & understood it.
Then, you need to realize that you're not going to be able to take care of it in one day. Do that & they will hit you up for unemployment, & more than likely use it against you in other ways, as well. More headache than its worth.
You will need to begin to document the issues in writing.
Step 1: Send him/her an e-mail scheduling a meeting regarding their policy manual.
Have the section regarding personal conduct & office behavior printed out with an extra copy for them, with the pertinent sections highlighted. Be firm, clear, & direct. Use your policy manual if you've got one, but make sure you tell them that as a result of this meeting, you'll be sending a follow up e-mail to reiterate-in writing-the results of the meeting.
That's your 1st step.
2nd step is to nail his or her arse to the wall in short order immediately after that happens with the most recent thing that occurred, and indicate that you "were not aware" of the incident until afterwards.
Again document in writing this issue, and reprimand them in writing, and send a read-receipt on it.
From there, put them on a Corrective Action Plan that's so tight you'd see a fart bubble down the back of their thigh if they were standing.
First offense, they're done, and you've got 3 separate incidents on paper, and you've shown where there's a habitual pattern that you've documented in several instances.
If your company doesn't have a policy manual, then its either too small and you should just 86 them out of hand and say screw you, or your company's HR department is pretty dumb and you should stop & think about that.
But, document the hell out of it, and you'll be in the clear when it comes to them filing for unemployment, or coming after you via other methods.
Read Receipt every single e-mail you send, and hit them with the first meeting without addressing the issue at hand, to make them accept it. Following up with a discussion about their behavior in the post-meeting e-mail seals their fate.
You may think its complicated, but you'll save yourself some money & some time if you insulate yourself via documentation & a good process.
Posted on 8/8/11 at 9:46 pm to luvmesumlsu
quote:
If it was me I would have a sit-down talk with the individual if they are good at the work. Explain to them how their behaviors affecting the company and tell them if you don't see a turnaround you may be forced to let them go.
So I think my biggest issue with all of this is that because its not performance related, I have nothing to really pinpoint- all the gossip crap is nothing but he said/she said...its all intangible. We have tried to confront this person before and they deny and say all the right things to our face. But then we hire someone new, and within days, that new person is asking questions about stupid shite that we fixed months ago and can only be attributable to one person. This person is disgruntled, has applied for other jobs (I have connections and have been informed from colleagues), and is simply waiting for their "contract" to be up before leaving...so in the meantime, they just spread BS to anyone that will listen.
But again, its all intangible...their work is actually good. I just want to get rid of this cancer....and I really dont want to go to court over it.
Posted on 8/8/11 at 9:56 pm to Htown Tiger
quote:
Htown Tiger
I'm still a few years away from starting an HR Consultancy, but that's my future, I hope.
I'm not sure what the Texas Workforce Commission's interpretation is regarding creating a negative office environment, but I can tell you that TWC's adjudicators & their Administrative Law Judges are *extremely* business friendly, with the only caveat being that you need your documentation.
You absolutely can't just make it up as you go.
Best of luck.
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