Page 1
Page 1
Started By
Message
locked post

Nico harrison's baseline mantra of "defense wins championships"

Posted on 4/16/25 at 10:46 pm
Posted by JamalMurry27
Tennessee Titans
Member since May 2023
7253 posts
Posted on 4/16/25 at 10:46 pm
Not talking trading luka or anything but is this even true in 2025 nba? I mean youd have to be full 04 pistons and still be able to score 115-120. I dont even know if his building block "saying" is even true anymore. Sure if you lock a team down in a big game thats great but
Posted by OhioLSUfan
Columbus, OH
Member since Oct 2007
1852 posts
Posted on 4/16/25 at 11:07 pm to
An average offense can beat a great defense, the hardest player to find has always been a scorer…Nico’s crazy

There were people this year that thought the NBA was pivoting towards teams needing 2 bigs to protect the rim, but I’m not seeing it. LeBron plays center now, shoot even the Mavs bench their center and play one big (AD)
Posted by RemouladeSawce
Uranus
Member since Sep 2008
16627 posts
Posted on 4/16/25 at 11:17 pm to
His resume doesn’t imply he has any idea what wins championships

Year 4 and bottom half in points allowed? You’d think that would be a priority

I don’t expect we’ll hear much from him anymore once the Mavs are knocked out
Posted by RebelTheBear
Saban's spare bedroom
Member since Aug 2016
5938 posts
Posted on 4/17/25 at 11:58 am to
He's not entirely misguided. I saw a stat recently that said that 22 of the last 25 NBA champions were top ten in defensive rating at the end of the regular season, so a semblance of good defense relative to their respective seasons does need to be played to win championships. Doesn't excuse a mostly bone-headed move to trade away a generational scorer in Luka that just helped your team to a NBA Finals appearance for an over thirty year-old AD who gets hurt all the time to pair with another over thirty year-old player in Kyrie who also gets hurt all the time and another over thirty year-old player in Klay who is washed
This post was edited on 4/17/25 at 12:00 pm
Posted by ShaneTheLegLechler
Member since Dec 2011
62964 posts
Posted on 4/17/25 at 12:05 pm to
A 6 foot 8 on ball creator and scorer the level of Luka is the hardest thing to find in the NBA. You can insulate a scorer like Luka with good 3 and D type wing defenders and lob catching rim protectors if he’s not a very good defender (he isn’t obviously) and still be very solid defensively as a team. Ironically he had started to do a pretty good job of this and then decided to deal him away
This post was edited on 4/17/25 at 12:06 pm
Posted by teke184
Zachary, LA
Member since Jan 2007
103076 posts
Posted on 4/17/25 at 12:14 pm to
If defense won championships, would Jokic have a ring?
Posted by RandySavage
9 Time Natty Winner
Member since May 2012
34592 posts
Posted on 4/17/25 at 2:20 pm to
How is Luka a generational scorer?
Posted by LSUtigaz020
Dallas
Member since Dec 2021
312 posts
Posted on 4/17/25 at 7:36 pm to
quote:

How is Luka a generational scorer?



He's been top 6 since he came into the league and has improved every season. He finished 2024 at 33.9PPG, 2nd highest was 30.4PPG. Even being hurt 1/2 of the year and sharing the ball with LeBron... hes averaging 28+PPG this year. Dude can score
Posted by RandySavage
9 Time Natty Winner
Member since May 2012
34592 posts
Posted on 4/17/25 at 8:52 pm to
Sure but nothing about that is generational
Posted by buckeye_vol
Member since Jul 2014
35370 posts
Posted on 4/18/25 at 1:56 am to
quote:

He's not entirely misguided. I saw a stat recently that said that 22 of the last 25 NBA champions were top ten in defensive rating at the end of the regular season,
I just had ChatGPT look this up, but it seems accurate. Anyways, of the last 25 NBA champions, 22 were in the top 10 one offense and 23 were in the top 10 on defense. 14 were in the top 5 on offense and 17 were in the top 10 on defense. And the average offensive ranking was 5.84 while the average defensive rating was 4.88.

So based on these, unsurprisingly NBA champions are great on both ends, and both are obviously extremely important. And these my support defense being MORE important slightly, but it’s clear that with rare exceptions like the 2004 pistons (18th offense, 2nd defense) and the 2022 Warriors (17th offense, 1st defense), it’s pretty clear the defense was carrying the team, but similarly you have the rare exceptions where it’s the offense, like the 2001 Lakers (2nd offense, 21st defense).

That said, I wonder if even the little discrepancy in the two is overstated because a couple years ago, I saw an NBA metrics account discuss the difference in them the variability between offensive ratings and defensive rating. And there are is much more variability in offensive ratings. So the difference between a top offense vs. an average offense is much higher than defense. His argument was that made offense more important. It sounds reasonable, but I could see the argument that means defense is more consistent/reliable, so that is important.

In addition, I wonder if there might be a little more discrepancy here because these are the top teams, who are more likely to protect big leads while their opponents are going to have to be more desperate on offense to comeback. So it’s possible that this results in lower offensive efficiency for both teams on average as the leading team tries to maximize position time at the expense of efficiency, while the trailing team is just taking more inefficient shots. Now this likely wouldn’t have a huge impact, but given it would help their defensive efficiency but just hurt their offensive efficiency, and there is a pretty small difference overall between the two, small changes especially in opposite directions might explain a lot of the small difference.

And if ChatGPT is correct, then while the overall correlation between the two across the league was about -0.1 (accounting for 1% of the variance, it was -0.3 (accounting for 9% of the variance) for the NBA champions that would lend support that some of the difference might be unique to being one of the better teams. Maybe I’ll have to look to see if this relationship gets stronger the further you get from the average.

Overall, the idea that defense is important to championships was obviously true and this supports that. But so is offense, and at best the difference is small, and good chance they’re nearly negligible. But based on what Nico did and what he’s arguing, he seems to have taken something that was true (defense is important) and took it to such an extreme that it’s quite a bit further from the truth than he thought, if not outright false if thought that building a great defense was worth it no matter how much it negatively impacted the offense.
Posted by Dire Wolf
bawcomville
Member since Sep 2008
39743 posts
Posted on 4/18/25 at 5:47 am to
quote:

That said, I wonder if even the little discrepancy in the two is overstated because a couple years ago, I saw an NBA metrics account discuss the difference in them the variability between offensive ratings and defensive rating. And there are is much more variability in offensive ratings. So the difference between a top offense vs. an average offense is much higher than defense. His argument was that made offense more important. It sounds reasonable, but I could see the argument that means defense is more consistent/reliable, so that is important.


Great now computers are sided with analytical nerds
Posted by GreenTiger12
Port City
Member since Oct 2016
79 posts
Posted on 4/18/25 at 8:35 am to
Luca is second in playoff points Per game behind only Michael Jordan. You can knock his defense, but you could not claim that he is not A generational offensive player
Posted by mattz1122
Member since Oct 2007
55324 posts
Posted on 4/18/25 at 9:24 am to
Celtics had the second best defensive rating last year
Posted by TheWalrus
Land of the Hogs
Member since Dec 2012
46135 posts
Posted on 4/18/25 at 12:27 pm to
Good defense in tandem with good offense wins championships. You can’t win an NBA championship these days as a good defensive team with a subpar offense like in the early 00s.
Posted by ConservativeBamaFan
Tuscaloosa Alabama
Member since Nov 2013
1405 posts
Posted on 4/18/25 at 2:45 pm to
It would seem like it would be easier to find a def stud vs a 30 pt scorer. Alot of guys 7fr that can stop easy shots in paint. But avg 30 and can hang 40 on a regular basis is definitely hard to find.Nico is dumb.
Posted by WillieD
Lafayette/BR
Member since Apr 2014
2947 posts
Posted on 4/18/25 at 3:01 pm to
Street Clothes could help with that
Posted by LSUtigaz020
Dallas
Member since Dec 2021
312 posts
Posted on 4/18/25 at 3:53 pm to
quote:

Sure but nothing about that is generational



Lol ok. He's averaged more PPG (28.6) through his first 7 seasons than Lebron (27.8)... who is one of the best scorers in NBA history. Stats don't lie
first pageprev pagePage 1 of 1Next pagelast page
refresh

Back to top
logoFollow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News
Follow us on X, Facebook and Instagram to get the latest updates on LSU Football and Recruiting.

FacebookXInstagram