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re: Expansion draft
Posted on 8/8/23 at 5:51 pm to Sheep
Posted on 8/8/23 at 5:51 pm to Sheep
quote:
The exercise is not "who are your best 8 players", it's "who are your 8 best contracts."
He's 31, at best at the top of his abilities (but likely declining) and makes $35m.
That is NOT a great contract.
The expansion team has a cap too so they're not collecting bad contracts. In the case of CJ, they'd have no reason to take a 31 yr old making 30 mil and we'd have to bring him back with the knowledge that we were trying to dump him.
3
Posted on 8/8/23 at 6:03 pm to saintsfan22
If you look at the last expansion draft from the Hornets, you'd see they came out with mostly scrubs. The best player they got was Gerald Wallace who was still a scrub when he was drafted and emerged in Charlotte. You're not going to see any high level players on that list unless it's an untradable contract on a significantly declining and/or injury riddled player.
Posted on 8/8/23 at 7:03 pm to saintsfan22
quote:I'd assume they'd also have a cap floor though. They'll have a bunch of meh and lots of cheap dudes, so I'd imagine they'll have room for a big contract or 2. Plus with it being next offseason, they'd get CJ as an expiring.
The expansion team has a cap too so they're not collecting bad contracts. In the case of CJ, they'd have no reason to take a 31 yr old making 30 mil and we'd have to bring him back with the knowledge that we were trying to dump him.
Seems there could be reasons to potentially want to draft him.
Posted on 8/8/23 at 7:45 pm to shel311
Yeah but they're more likely to get to that with a hail mary flier on someone young and overpaid like Ben Simmons or Lonzo
Posted on 8/8/23 at 7:45 pm to supe12sta12z
Does there have to be an expansion draft?
What if both teams would rather not do it?
Give them a couple of draft picks (middle of both rounds) and let them sign free agents. Teams will be throwing them additional picks to take on bad contracts. They aren't going to struggle to fill out the roster. Maybe it's not really necessary..
What if both teams would rather not do it?
Give them a couple of draft picks (middle of both rounds) and let them sign free agents. Teams will be throwing them additional picks to take on bad contracts. They aren't going to struggle to fill out the roster. Maybe it's not really necessary..
Posted on 8/8/23 at 8:00 pm to brmark70816
Don’t protect Nance or Val. We have already have a 5 on the roster that can stretch the floor, protect the rim, and has bulked up this summer to handle the beating down low
Posted on 8/8/23 at 8:52 pm to saintsfan22
quote:
The expansion team has a cap too so they're not collecting bad contracts. In the case of CJ, they'd have no reason to take a 31 yr old making 30 mil and we'd have to bring him back with the knowledge that we were trying to dump him.
Yeah. MAYBE we could work it out with him? Or the expansion team?
"We'll give you 2 seconds if you pick Zeller."
CJ's smart - he gets it.
Posted on 8/9/23 at 7:38 am to brmark70816
Zion
BI
Trey
Herb
Dyson
Jose
Hawkins
Val
1. Nance might end up back on the team even after he’s in the draft
2. This gives us a chance to get off CJs contract
3. Val is #8 because we have 0 future centers as of now
BI
Trey
Herb
Dyson
Jose
Hawkins
Val
1. Nance might end up back on the team even after he’s in the draft
2. This gives us a chance to get off CJs contract
3. Val is #8 because we have 0 future centers as of now
Posted on 8/9/23 at 9:21 am to Sheep
quote:It's a pretty standard contract for someone at that age.
He's 31, at best at the top of his abilities (but likely declining) and makes $35m.
It's easy to want that contract gone, but no one talks about how we'll replace it. In the 2 seasons CJ has been here, when he hasn't had the injury and brace in his shooting hand, he has basically averaged 24/5/5.
Who is replacing that? Dyson isn't, not in the short term. He's very young and obviously years away from being fully formed, but basically as different players sure, but nowhere nearly as good as CJ and won't be for multiple years.
We want to win now, I don't think the question is how to get rid of CJ's contract right now, the question is how do we do it and get better.
Posted on 8/9/23 at 12:17 pm to brmark70816
quote:
You wouldn't protect Daniels?
Nope. If he were to take a big leap this year i'd put him over Nance, but thats about it and i dont expect it
Posted on 8/9/23 at 12:22 pm to NannerB_EazyPellyBoi
quote:He was 19 last season and proved he is, at worst, pretty darn close to being as good defensively as Herb.
Nope. If he were to take a big leap this year i'd put him over Nance, but thats about it and i dont expect it
Also, he was 19.
Posted on 8/9/23 at 12:31 pm to shel311
Yes he is good at defense , but what else? we already have Herb too. so he'd be nice in instances where we need another plus defender, but you'd have to get rid of Nance likely who offers us plus defense at different positions of need, and our big defense is horrible without Nance. Its not that he can't get better but i don't like projects. Especially when we are trying to project them into something theyre not, like Dyson supposedly being a PG or even a SG. I don't think he will ever be a good one of those. To me he is a SF or could bulk up and be a good SF/PF tweener, but we are deep a SF already. I like a player who can get in where they fit in, too, and i don't see Dyson doing the little things or fitting into the big picture
Posted on 8/9/23 at 12:35 pm to NannerB_EazyPellyBoi
quote:Again, he was 19. Why are you assuming he won't get any better?
Yes he is good at defense , but what else?
Nance will have 1 year left on his deal next offseason, that's not worth protecting over Dyson Daniels.
I also don't view Dyson as a project. He has a near elite skill already which is defense and IMO is a rotation player right now on an NBA team.
This post was edited on 8/9/23 at 12:35 pm
Posted on 8/9/23 at 1:01 pm to shel311
quote:
don't view Dyson as a project
Even if he is, he should have good value as an asset. Just can't lose him for nothing..
Posted on 8/9/23 at 1:05 pm to brmark70816
quote:Great point.
Even if he is, he should have good value as an asset. Just can't lose him for nothing..
Dyson would 100% be traded for a 1st from quite a few other teams, so why would you not protect him for 1 year of Nance?
Or another way to put it, 1 year of Nance isn't worth losing out on a 1st round pick.
This post was edited on 8/9/23 at 1:06 pm
Posted on 8/9/23 at 1:05 pm to shel311
I didn't assume he won't get better, but i assume he won't take the steps necessary in the next few years to be a solid NBA guard. Do you see Dyson as a guard? Because the team does or at least those are the only minutes theyre willing to give him because we are already deep on the wing. I wouldn't play him over BI, Trey, Herb, or Hawkins, so where would i play him, PG? He isn't any good at that but those are the minutes for him, and thats my issue really, not his potential. A project as your 8th or 9th man? Why? you'll have to pay them and never have enough minutes to develop him properly and they'll be a liability in the playoffs
Posted on 8/10/23 at 6:33 am to NannerB_EazyPellyBoi
Dyson is easily more valuable than Hawkins, Nance, or any of the other contenders to potentially be unprotected
Posted on 8/10/23 at 7:13 am to NannerB_EazyPellyBoi
Dyson was 19 y/o and played just over 1,000 minutes last year. Do the math and that’s 21 total games through 48min.
Your issue is that “you don’t see him as a guard” and that “he isn’t good at PG”.
But you then said “that’s my issue not his potential”
Wtf does that mean. It’s not about his potential but you think he has very little potential after playing 20 games at 19y/o?
Take a seat
“It’s not about his potential, I just don’t think he has much potential”
Your issue is that “you don’t see him as a guard” and that “he isn’t good at PG”.
But you then said “that’s my issue not his potential”
Wtf does that mean. It’s not about his potential but you think he has very little potential after playing 20 games at 19y/o?
Take a seat
“It’s not about his potential, I just don’t think he has much potential”
This post was edited on 8/10/23 at 7:15 am
Posted on 8/10/23 at 9:19 am to Dantheman504
Why put words in my mouth? Youre puting a quote that wasn't said in quotes to imply i had. Being intentionally dense about understanding a sentiment being made is not a discussion. Then you want to be all dramatic like you said something. Do YOU think Dyson is PG? do you think that is where he is best suited? is that where his potential lies? Protecting him because he has value i understand, but if he has the value of a 1st round pick then i would trade him before i had to make the choice to let a contributor go in order to essentially have to re-commit an asset (protected roster spot) to someone who still needs a lot of development at the positions available to them, and who is essentially lagniappe to the other wings we have who are better and we have committed money to already. Yes i think Dyson can contribute now, on defense 2-4, and mainly at SF on offense. Yes he has potential, but personally im not the type to care if its just for paper valuation or would cost money or opportunity for a player i can count on and don't have to continually invest in. I can both think that he has value and potential AND that he has less value to us than what we can get for him (or could have had instead, but thats beside the point)
Posted on 8/10/23 at 10:00 am to NannerB_EazyPellyBoi
I...and I think the Pels...are very high on Dyson's future. He will be our 2nd best defender and we're not really loaded with defensive players. Extremely versatile & when playing with Herb...it will create quite a few problems for the opposing team. Dyson will make Herb an EVEN better defensive player...and will, himself, develope into a decent player on offense.
Dyson will end up being a key member of the Pels team...and I don't mean...coming off the bench with limited minutes.
Dyson will end up being a key member of the Pels team...and I don't mean...coming off the bench with limited minutes.
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