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Cap Talk and moves you would like to see
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:05 am
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:05 am
As of today Spotrac says 162m is the Luxury Tax threshold for 2023-24 NBA Season
We are currently sitting at 157m
Needs:
Rim Protecting Center that can run
Sharpshooting 3pt Guard
Maybe another Guard who can put the ball on the floor
Without making any trades we have roughly 5m in money.
A quick fix for Center would ideally be Naz Reid who is a UFA and made 1.532m last year. We could technically use the Bi Annual Exception of up to 4.448m to sign him and would easily be one of the best backup 5's in the league for what we do.
The quite obvious change currently would be essentially overpaying for Myles Turner if IND would take JV + Kira or Dyson + however many picks for a 2 year rental to maybe extension?
From a CAP perspective the above trade would net us roughly 500k in cap space along with a player who is 3 years younger than our exiting player.
If we executed both above this would cover only 1 of the bigger problems with the team.
There is also a Non-Taxpayer MLE worth about 11.368m that we could use to hunt for a 3pt shooter but I wonder what a Herb or Trey extension starts to look like this year and next and we would probably more than likely use this for a player for either a one year rental or 2 years max.
Unfortunately from the guard perspective in the UFA/RFA dustbin that fits those parameters the only person that comes to my eye is Coby White, however if we switch to wing players as well Donte DiVincenzo sticks out like a sore thumb or even the crowd favorite Dillon Brooks
The more interesting scenarios start to play out next next offseason though as BI is technically a FA and what do we do with a 35 year old Expiring CJ McCullom.
Edit: I would also like to point out the either EJ Liddel or Karlo Matkovic becoming a core member would help our cap situation out TREMENDOUSLY.
This post was edited on 4/20/23 at 11:07 am
11
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:20 am to 50_Tiger
Naz Reid is a rotational big that can give you minutes at the 4 and 5. But he's isn't a defensive presence or rim protector. He's going to get a bag so the only way to get him is probably through a sign and trade.
EJ Liddell can stay on his 2 way and still contribute in 50 games. No need to sign him to the roster just yet.
The more I think about it, the best way to get rim protection is through the draft. I don't see very many viable options in free agency. If they feel Lively or Bona can give them minutes as a rookie, they shouldn't hesitate to draft one.
A shooter should not break the bank to sign or trade for. The Nets have several to trade for since they can't and won't try to keep all those role players.
At the end of the day, Richardson, Hayes, and Hernangomez needs to be off the roster and be replaced with guys who address the weaknesses of the roster.
EJ Liddell can stay on his 2 way and still contribute in 50 games. No need to sign him to the roster just yet.
The more I think about it, the best way to get rim protection is through the draft. I don't see very many viable options in free agency. If they feel Lively or Bona can give them minutes as a rookie, they shouldn't hesitate to draft one.
A shooter should not break the bank to sign or trade for. The Nets have several to trade for since they can't and won't try to keep all those role players.
At the end of the day, Richardson, Hayes, and Hernangomez needs to be off the roster and be replaced with guys who address the weaknesses of the roster.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:26 am to 50_Tiger
Seems we're very severely limited in what we can acquire unless we're doing so via trade
I would question the financial part of it after next season. We know we're just not going to be an annual tax team. We may get 1 shot, and it would probably be going slightly over, so I don't know how that could work with Turner's salary after year 1.
And another wrench in that is if we do the thing like a lot of teams do to do right by Herb and turn down his team option to let him become a RFA and give him his bag. If we do that, I assume that means we're salary cutting and not adding anyone of note at that point.
But I do see a path where he's healthy next season(well, he wears a Pels uniform so maybe not but I digress) and has a fantastic season, at which point we may not want to trade him til the following offseason.
quote:I never know the sign and trade rules, but that would seem like the only feasible way to land a Naz Reid I'd guess.
A quick fix for Center would ideally be Naz Reid who is a UFA and made 1.532m last year. We could technically use the Bi Annual Exception of up to 4.448m to sign him and would easily be one of the best backup 5's in the league for what we do.
quote:I'm not against this. I don't think it's the slam dunk people think it is in an obvious overall upgrade, but I'd be willing to take that chance. We'd be a pretty rough rebounding team if we swapped Val for Turner, but it may be worth it and net us a better defense as we were dead last in the league at opp FG% at the rim.
The quite obvious change currently would be essentially overpaying for Myles Turner if IND would take JV + Kira or Dyson + however many picks for a 2 year rental to maybe extension?
From a CAP perspective the above trade would net us roughly 500k in cap space along with a player who is 3 years younger than our exiting player.
If we executed both above this would cover only 1 of the bigger problems with the team.
I would question the financial part of it after next season. We know we're just not going to be an annual tax team. We may get 1 shot, and it would probably be going slightly over, so I don't know how that could work with Turner's salary after year 1.
And another wrench in that is if we do the thing like a lot of teams do to do right by Herb and turn down his team option to let him become a RFA and give him his bag. If we do that, I assume that means we're salary cutting and not adding anyone of note at that point.
quote:I think by next offseason, we likely will start looking to trade CJ, as his extension IMO was basically done to have a high salary to use as filler to trade for the next $30mil dude.
The more interesting scenarios start to play out next next offseason though as BI is technically a FA and what do we do with a 35 year old Expiring CJ McCullom.
But I do see a path where he's healthy next season(well, he wears a Pels uniform so maybe not but I digress) and has a fantastic season, at which point we may not want to trade him til the following offseason.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:28 am to supe12sta12z
quote:It'll just be tough to actually upgrade being up against the tax, unless this is the 1 year we go into the tax, but I don't see it.
At the end of the day, Richardson, Hayes, and Hernangomez needs to be off the roster and be replaced with guys who address the weaknesses of the roster.
I'm assuming we have to show success with a good regular season and maybe 2nd round playoff showing or something like that, then Gayle may say the following season is the all in season. But I just don't see us going into the tax before we have success, and without going into the tax, we just seem severely limited in our options to upgrade with roster additions.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:29 am to 50_Tiger
I thought Garrett was a team option, if so that is a easy decision.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:33 am to armsdealer
quote:I don't know exact details but it says it's non guaranteed and becomes fully guaranteed on 6/30/2023.
I thought Garrett was a team option, if so that is a easy decision.
I assume that means we can waive him and save a % of that salary? If so, how much?
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:40 am to shel311
Pretty sure Temple is fully non guaranteed, if it was partial it would often say. So you can wipe that salary right off and add it to the available room.
But then of course add the salary of the 14th pick if we were to keep it. So you’re maybe more like $7 million in space, with contracts like JV, Kira and Billy maybe the most likely available, and Dyson in a bigger deal. Nance not completely off the table, I’m just not sure you improve very easily by dealing a quality backup big from a team that needs help in that exact area.
But then of course add the salary of the 14th pick if we were to keep it. So you’re maybe more like $7 million in space, with contracts like JV, Kira and Billy maybe the most likely available, and Dyson in a bigger deal. Nance not completely off the table, I’m just not sure you improve very easily by dealing a quality backup big from a team that needs help in that exact area.
This post was edited on 4/20/23 at 11:41 am
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:46 am to shel311
I think we need to have a serious discussion about Herb’s pay and the emergence of Murphy. I love Herb, and want to pay Herb. But does he start next year? And obviously we will need to pay Trey. This is going to be a really really difficult puzzle to solve.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:50 am to PELsu
We can almost assurely bandaid at least 2 of our bad parts for the upcoming season.
I just feel real good about the Turner/Reid + Lidell/Matkovic front court. Assuming Zion and Larry are not hurt as much
The Pelican Front Court would be:
Turner/Reid/Matkovic
Zion/Larry/Liddell
If anything, it makes Willy expendable salary for a bandaid shooting guard/wing
If we went this route we would have to prayge that Jose/Herb/Trey keep ascending and also convince BI to shoot more 3's.
I just feel real good about the Turner/Reid + Lidell/Matkovic front court. Assuming Zion and Larry are not hurt as much
The Pelican Front Court would be:
Turner/Reid/Matkovic
Zion/Larry/Liddell
If anything, it makes Willy expendable salary for a bandaid shooting guard/wing
If we went this route we would have to prayge that Jose/Herb/Trey keep ascending and also convince BI to shoot more 3's.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:51 am to PELsu
quote:
I think we need to have a serious discussion about Herb’s pay and the emergence of Murphy. I love Herb, and want to pay Herb. But does he start next year? And obviously we will need to pay Trey. This is going to be a really really difficult puzzle to solve.
In my eyes the core 6 we should build around are:
Zion
BI
Herb
Trey
Jose
Dyson
I'm willing to give up one of Dyson/Jose if it gets us a better center when packaged with Jonas. But it has to be a significant upgrade.
Salary wise, I think if we could get off of CJ now, even this summer for an expiring I would do it.
I appreciate him playing through injury. But he's not going to get healthier and he doesn't fit imo.
Team would probably take a step back, but I care more about keeping Herb/Trey long term than CJ.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:56 am to PELsu
quote:
I think we need to have a serious discussion about Herb’s pay and the emergence of Murphy. I love Herb, and want to pay Herb. But does he start next year? And obviously we will need to pay Trey. This is going to be a really really difficult puzzle to solve.
I think the real discussion is CJ to the bench but I dont think were ready to have that one as an organization.
Schematically it would be great for him as a Player. He gets to pick on lesser talent, play with Larry, and always have at least one of Zion or BI on the court (or even Trey).
If we were actually serious about growth and championships
Turner (or some rim big) / Reid / Matkovic
Zion / Larry / EJ
BI / Naji or Dyson/Kira (maybe even EJ here)
Trey / CJ
Herb / Jose
Edit: Man I really like DiVincenzo backup behind BI if we could make that happen.
This post was edited on 4/20/23 at 11:58 am
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:57 am to PELsu
quote:If that's the case, what is the difference, if anything, between a team option and a fully non guaranteed year?
Pretty sure Temple is fully non guaranteed, if it was partial it would often say. So you can wipe that salary right off and add it to the available room.
I'm still surprised we picked up Kira's option for next year. I have to think that is done as trade filler.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 11:59 am to PELsu
quote:It's an issue overall.
I think we need to have a serious discussion about Herb’s pay and the emergence of Murphy. I love Herb, and want to pay Herb. But does he start next year? And obviously we will need to pay Trey. This is going to be a really really difficult puzzle to solve.
I think you have to pay Herb in that $16-18 mil, he's worth it.
Paying Herb isn't the issue, but the loss of flexibility will hurt us for paying Herb. But I don't know how we upgrade the team in a better way by letting Herb go/trading him, so I think paying him is the way to go.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 12:01 pm to ghost2most
quote:How are you then upgrading the team by giving away your 3rd best player for an expiring? We're not getting a player as good as CJ to come here via free agency, I just don't see it, and also not sure we'd have teh space for it any way.
Salary wise, I think if we could get off of CJ now, even this summer for an expiring I would do it.
quote:He's not going to get healthier than torn thumb ligaments for the bulk of the season? Why not?
But he's not going to get healthier and he doesn't fit imo.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 12:03 pm to shel311
dude just played 75 games.This post was edited on 4/20/23 at 12:03 pm
Posted on 4/20/23 at 12:09 pm to supe12sta12z
quote:With torn thumb ligaments on his shooting hand for probably half of them.
dude just played 75 games.
He chose not to get surgery to play through it, so he definitely did not have what I'd say was a "healthy season"
I'll put it this way, I'd MUCH prefer 65 healthy games from than the 75 we got with the thumb injury.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 12:41 pm to shel311
quote:
How are you then upgrading the team by giving away your 3rd best player for an expiring? We're not getting a player as good as CJ to come here via free agency, I just don't see it, and also not sure we'd have teh space for it any way.
They obviously arent going to get rid of him this offseason but next offseason becomes a real conversation. Especially if Trey continues to develop. Trey is already looking at 25m/yr for an extension. Another leap next year and he could be a max candidate. We cant be paying 4 guys +30m/yr. Problem is CJ is not exactly a hot commodity with his contract, you might have to pay in picks if you want to totally dump it
Posted on 4/20/23 at 12:44 pm to 50_Tiger
Honestly, I do not see Turner as a realistic option. The draft may be a way to fill one of the spots (if we keep the pick). Shooter - Sensabaugh or Rim Protector - Lively. Another option could be a true PG who can defense in Cason Wallace.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 12:48 pm to 50_Tiger
GT's $5.4M and Kira's $5.7M won't be on the roster next year, and likely Billy's $2.6M
Liddell's $1.8M and 1st round picks $3.3M will be on the roster.
So that $157M is more like $148.7 Without Billy/GT/Kira, and we'd have 12 roster spots filled, and $13.3M to fill the remaining 2 or 3 spots.
I assume some kind of trade or trades will be made sending Kira/Billy out.
Roster outlook after that:
PG: CJ/Jose/Dyson
SG: Herb/Naji
SF: BI/Trey
PF: lazy fatass/Liddell
C: JV/Larry
My suggestions:
Draft the best guard available. Jalen Hood-Schifino, Cason Wallace, Keyonte George, Nick Smith Jr, Brice Sensabaugh, Jordan Hawkins
Send Billy to Toronto for Christian Koloko ($1.7M). Played sparingly as a 2nd round rookie, but when he did he was great defensively and a great rim protector, but Nurse doesn't seem to like him, or want to play him much. Could be good reason for that, i don't know, but when he has played he and the Raptors have done well.
Send Kira to the Nets in a S&T for Yuta Watanabe, who we should be able to sign for maybe $4M/yr at most. Underrated defender, hustles his arse off at all times, and is the best corner 3 point shooter in the nba.
That would still leave us almost $8M and 1 more roster spot, and i would look to get Eubanks or Mo Wagner with that MLE space.
PG: CJ/Jose/Dyson
SG: Herb/14th pick/Naji
SF: BI/Trey/Watanabe
PF: Zion/Larry/Liddell
C: JV/Eubanks/Koloko
I'd prefer at that point to stay put, and assess how the season goes and make moves at the trade deadline.
if Dyson doesn't come around, and the the pick isn't showing promise, then we need another playmaker at the 2 position b/c i'm not going to use Naji as that playmaker/scorer off the bench. Naji shouldn't play much at all if everyone is healthy and progressing like we hope they are. At that point i would determine which one, JV or Larry is going to be used to make a trade for that person, and with that i'm assuming one of Koloko or Liddell is showing promise, and/or Eubanks can start.
Liddell's $1.8M and 1st round picks $3.3M will be on the roster.
So that $157M is more like $148.7 Without Billy/GT/Kira, and we'd have 12 roster spots filled, and $13.3M to fill the remaining 2 or 3 spots.
I assume some kind of trade or trades will be made sending Kira/Billy out.
Roster outlook after that:
PG: CJ/Jose/Dyson
SG: Herb/Naji
SF: BI/Trey
PF: lazy fatass/Liddell
C: JV/Larry
My suggestions:
Draft the best guard available. Jalen Hood-Schifino, Cason Wallace, Keyonte George, Nick Smith Jr, Brice Sensabaugh, Jordan Hawkins
Send Billy to Toronto for Christian Koloko ($1.7M). Played sparingly as a 2nd round rookie, but when he did he was great defensively and a great rim protector, but Nurse doesn't seem to like him, or want to play him much. Could be good reason for that, i don't know, but when he has played he and the Raptors have done well.
quote:
Per Cleaning the Glass, the Raptors allow 10.4 fewer points per 100 possessions when Koloko is on the floor (which ranks in the 98th percentile among big men). Opponents shoot 5.9% worse from the field in terms of their eFG%, a number matched only by Jaren Jackson Jr. among bigs with 600 minutes on the floor.
Send Kira to the Nets in a S&T for Yuta Watanabe, who we should be able to sign for maybe $4M/yr at most. Underrated defender, hustles his arse off at all times, and is the best corner 3 point shooter in the nba.
That would still leave us almost $8M and 1 more roster spot, and i would look to get Eubanks or Mo Wagner with that MLE space.
PG: CJ/Jose/Dyson
SG: Herb/14th pick/Naji
SF: BI/Trey/Watanabe
PF: Zion/Larry/Liddell
C: JV/Eubanks/Koloko
I'd prefer at that point to stay put, and assess how the season goes and make moves at the trade deadline.
if Dyson doesn't come around, and the the pick isn't showing promise, then we need another playmaker at the 2 position b/c i'm not going to use Naji as that playmaker/scorer off the bench. Naji shouldn't play much at all if everyone is healthy and progressing like we hope they are. At that point i would determine which one, JV or Larry is going to be used to make a trade for that person, and with that i'm assuming one of Koloko or Liddell is showing promise, and/or Eubanks can start.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 12:51 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
GT's $5.4M and Kira's $5.7M won't be on the roster next year, and likely Billy's $2.6M
I think kira will be just to use as salary for a trade.
Jax, temple, billy, JR, and naji are most likely gone.
Liddell will be signed and maybe matkovic too
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