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Started By
Message
re: Brianna Kupfer murder suspect with lengthy rap sheet was out on bail
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:36 am to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:36 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
The POS guys force discussions on policy in criminal justice settings, unfortunately. Most case law, resulting in rulings on both sides of the issues, involve...unsavory characters. But the rules that apply to these people apply to everyone. That disassociation is the part people have a problem with. They just assume that they're different from "those people" until they face the LEO monster. And yes, innocent people have to face the machine sometimes. Again, we literally just had the Kyle Rittenhouse situation unfold in front of all of us.
“That’s not what this thread is about. Make your own thread if you want to talk about that,”
0
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:37 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
But the rules that apply to these people apply to everyone.
Which is my issue.
Thug criminals everywhere, rejoice at the low bails being put forth.
Unless, of course, you are named Rittenhouse.
The system is a colossal failure.
That is without even taking into account those released due to Covid.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:39 am to SlowFlowPro
Your system is broken and useless.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:39 am to jimmy the leg
quote:
You are basically saying that you have no problem with the pedo baby-sitting your children because he hasn’t attacked them.
That's a terrible analogy
quote:
I’m saying common sense and logic suggests that you are making an extremely poor decision.
So "common sense and logic" means the J6 protesters who have been detained months for what are likely misdemeanors or light felonies are OK, too? Kyle Rittenhouse's insane bond due to a purely political prosecution of an innocent person was OK? But-for modern fundraising that kid would have sat in jail for like a year before his trial.
quote:
$1000 bail for someone that could give two fricks about the legal system is a poor decision.
$1000 is low for sure, but the posters in this thread want him in jail without a conviction. Their preferred bail will be $1 more than he can afford to get out, so the actual number is a moving target.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:39 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:You think this guy was going to show up because of the bail he was given?
You do realize bail is just a way to ensure a defendant shows up for its court dates, right?
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:40 am to Proximo
quote:
Oh JFC you can’t even come up with a modicum of a substantive base for your argument
For which? The excessive bail argument is a constitutional one.
quote:
Please continue white knighting for this “innocent” murderer
Not doing that at all.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:41 am to SlowFlowPro
Does everyone need protections? Of course, but odds are folks doing the right thing will never need it
Now, things are changing and there are no limits Dems and the feds will go to so they ensure every person that speaks negatively of their leaders or their racist policies on a list to target them (weaponized IRS etc)
Now, things are changing and there are no limits Dems and the feds will go to so they ensure every person that speaks negatively of their leaders or their racist policies on a list to target them (weaponized IRS etc)
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:42 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
That's a terrible analogy
It’s a perfect analogy that completely disproved the shitty point you are failing at making, and you have no response to it besides calling it terrible.
quote:
So "common sense and logic" means the J6 protesters who have been detained months for what are likely misdemeanors or light felonies are OK, too? Kyle Rittenhouse's insane bond due to a purely political prosecution of an innocent person was OK? But-for modern fundraising that kid would have sat in jail for like a year before his trial.
“That’s not what this thread is about. Make your own thread if you want to talk about that.”
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:45 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
so the actual number is a moving target
That target, due to influence from leftist groups, is down to a Coke and a Moon Pie in some instances. Liberal judges are mor than willing to put the public in danger again and again and again, all in an effort to be re-elected.
The system is broken. I’m not sure why you can’t concede that $1000 was laughably inadequate, especially given his prior history.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:45 am to jimmy the leg
quote:
Thug criminals everywhere, rejoice at the low bails being put forth.
Unless, of course, you are named Rittenhouse.
The system is a colossal failure.
I agree the system needs a complete overhauling. That's the whole point.
The state doesn't give a shite who you are (outside of a VERY select chosen few centered around DC). If you get in their sites, they will grind you down as hard as they can.
It doesn't even have to be on purpose. Even if LEO fricks up, they'll still prosecute you. Remember Andrew Coffee IV? He was the guy in Florida who was just found innocent of felony murder and attempted murder for shooting at LEO who did a bad no knock warrant at his house. That guy was held on almost a $100k bond even though he was innocent.
The system is screwed beyond belief.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:47 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
I agree the system needs a complete overhauling. That's the whole point. The state doesn't give a shite who you are (outside of a VERY select chosen few centered around DC). If you get in their sites, they will grind you down as hard as they can. It doesn't even have to be on purpose. Even if LEO fricks up, they'll still prosecute you. Remember Andrew Coffee IV? He was the guy in Florida who was just found innocent of felony murder and attempted murder for shooting at LEO who did a bad no knock warrant at his house. That guy was held on almost a $100k bond even though he was innocent. The system is screwed beyond belief.
“That’s not what this thread is about. Make your own thread if you want to talk about that.”
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:50 am to jimmy the leg
quote:
I’m not sure why you can’t concede that $1000 was laughably inadequate
I already said it was low.
That's irrelevant to the larger point of bail being weaponized.
I can put it in another way. If bail wasn't weaponized, as a general policy, then cases like this guy would be permitted more scrutiny because there would be more trust in the system. The system has basically drowned all of that out by being overzealous, which has led to an irrational swing back.
If they just accepted basic reforms, situations like this one would be less likely because a higher bail for this guy on his previous charge would be scrutinized less. But there is no trust in the system because of decades of authoritarianism, so when radicals seize the moment to "fix" it, they don't do it well, either.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:50 am to tiggerthetooth
quote:
Smith is also currently free on a $50,000 bond in Charleston, South Carolina in relation to a November 2019 arrest on suspicion of firing a weapon into an occupied vehicle, court records show.
quote:
Smith's prior charges on the East Coast include assault with a deadly weapon, carrying a concealed weapon, assault on a police officer, trespassing, possession of a stolen vehicle, and misdemeanors for larceny and possession of stolen goods. The outcomes of those cases weren't immediately clear.
He has a history of failing to appear in court, and has been repeatedly arrested on bench warrants. In one case in Charleston, he was convicted in abstentia after skipping court, and does not appear to have served the sentence, which is sealed in court records.
Black privilege is the new white privilege.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:56 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
I already said it was low. That's irrelevant to the larger point of bail being weaponized.
I would imagine that that victim’s family has a different view than you do. The point with my analogy earlier (that seemed to elude you).
quote:
But there is no trust in the system because of decades of authoritarianism, so when radicals seize the moment to "fix" it, they don't do it well, either.
If by “fix” you mean to Jake criminality perfectly acceptable, then yes, their goal is to “fix” things.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 6:57 am to Geekboy
Democrats are fricking idiots.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 7:04 am to jimmy the leg
quote:
I would imagine that that victim’s family has a different view than you do.
Outlier events shouldn't dictate major policy.
It's terrible what happened and he's a legit POS, but using this example to form a policy covering large populations is emotional thinking.
quote:
If by “fix” you mean to Jake criminality perfectly acceptable, then yes, their goal is to “fix” things.
It is backfiring on them. It just takes time.
The solution is a rational approach, not an emotional (from either side) one. There are studies that simply sending out text reminders to defendants about court massively increases the likelihood they show up. That's a cheap, proactive measure that's often fought irrationally. There are also monitoring programs that are more expensive than texting, but cheaper than jail, which also have shown success in decreasing missed court.
As a society, we should promote systems that decrease the time spent in jail prior to conviction. Detention should only be relied on for the most dangerous guys (like this POS, most likely) or the biggest threats to leave (major felonies).
Posted on 1/19/22 at 7:07 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
You do realize bail is just a way to ensure a defendant shows up for its court dates, right?
It's not supposed to be punitive and the person is presumed innocent at that point in the process.
Ensuring a defendant appears at court is the purpose of bail. But how much the bail is set at is supposed to be determined by various factors which these new progs don’t want to consider.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 7:10 am to biglego
quote:
But how much the bail is set at is supposed to be determined by various factors which these new progs don’t want to consider.
Because they have been abused for decades.
That's how you get insane, 6-figure bonds for drug offenses.
Posted on 1/19/22 at 7:21 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:Really? More like occasionally. For all of those decades there have been people out on low bail commiting criminal acts as well.
Because they have been abused for decades
Posted on 1/19/22 at 7:26 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Detention should only be relied on for the most dangerous guys (like this POS, most likely) or the biggest threats to leave (major felonies).
Youve failed at arguing multiple times in this thread that these guys are presumed innocent and should not be punitively punished for their alleged actions, even to the point of ignoring their past previous history.
Now neither of those things should apply to “the most dangerous guys” or “the biggest threats to leave” because you say so. As if you are the arbiter of good for society as a whole.
Why are those guys not presumed innocent? Why shouldn’t their alleged crimes be looked at in a vacuum with no context provided by their prior history?
Again, how much more of a fricking failure can a supposed “lawyer” be?
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