re: Crackpot ASOIAF Theories SPOILERS

Wait. Tywin was already dying when Tyrion showed up?

Man, I might just need to re-read the whole damn series. I clearly wasn't paying attention.

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Wait. Tywin was already dying when Tyrion showed up?

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I'm pretty sure the Red Viper had already poisoned Tywin prior to the crossbow.Pretty much everything that Ladytiger said, plus Oberyn gives thanks to Cersi for blaming Tyrion, “Who knows more of poison than the Red Viper of Dorne, after all?” Plus the Red Viper doesn't go to Tyrion until after he had a private supper with Tywin& Mace.



It didn't seem like Varys wanted him to go, but then pretty much the only weapon that Tyrion could have used just happened to be there. Not to mention Shae was also there.

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Im still not sure what varys motivation is

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He wants Tyrion to train Dany's dragons for her, as well as get the Westerlands on his side once he eliminates the other Lannisters.

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I could be on board with this, but it would have to lead to a uniting of the blood line with Aegon (Blackfyre) and Dany.

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Once Aegon marries Dany though, all Varys has to do is find a way to subtlety kill her.

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I don't see that happening, Dany is barren correct?

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I don't either, but it was in Varys' plan for the two to get married.

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Dany is barren correct?

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probably not, she was having her bleeding at the end of the last book.

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What I find confusing was when did Varys/Illyrio hatch this plan? Before she was married, before Viserys died, before he tried to have Dany murdered?

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I'm guessing either once Dany got her dragons or when she got the Unsullied.

He wanted Dany murdered but then notified Jorah to stop the assassin, right?

I think that Viserys and Dany were always his 'backup plan' and never a part of his Faegon plan; I think he just wanted the Dothraki horde with Dany and Viserys to go to Westeros during the war and *maybe* once Drogo died to get Dany to marry Faegon, but for her to never supersede him in power of course (plus Dany marrying Faegon would provide some legitimacy to his claim that he wasn't a fake)...and I think that Illyrio wanted Viserys to stay with him in Pentos and not go off with the Dothraki (where he died). Although, I think the only wrench it threw into the plans was how he was secretly betrothed to Arianne Martell.

But I'm curious to see if all these years of plans with Illyrio, Varys, and even Doran are going to play out to their liking. I think that Faegon would be a good "Summer King", but can he really handle the Long Night ahead?

I also support the Crackpot theory that Varys paid for Gendry's smith apprenticeship in case his backup plan with Faegon didn't work--legitimize him, say that he can relate to the commoners/peasants, he was an apprentice (educated in a trade/skill), and Ned and Jon Arryn saw that the boy was Robert reincarnate (and Brienne thought he was Renly's clone). Plus, I think Varys wanted Faegon to be well educated, but to also associate with commoners and have a humble upbringing; he wouldn't be entitled like the other Targs and would be loved. I think the same can be applied to Gendry: very humble beginnings, but he would know how to take care of the commonfolk in hard times.

Back to Gendry: Ned said "If the day comes when that boy decides to wield a sword instead of forge one, come find me." So Gendry would possibly have the same battle acumen as his father (it's in the blood/genes). Plus I've also thought that Robert saying "I have a son, you have a daughter, let's join our houses" is going to foreshadow either Sansa or Arya marrying Gendry.

Hence why I think Jon Snow would be an excellent king; Winter is coming and his is the song of ice and fire. Jon was a bastard, albeit well educated and raised within a Great House. However, he knows what it feels like to be an outsider, unlike his cousin Robb (who was to inherit Winterfell). Plus, I also think that fans think he's exactly like Ned, but that's only surface level. To me, Jon's maneuvering and political machinations and doing what he can to survive reflects his Targ heritage/similar to his Aunt Dany. I think Jon has a great set of skills to be a leader, and will do what is asked of him. He wanted no part in being Lord Commander, but his brothers (and with Sam's help) wanted him to be. He didn't want to exactly join the Wildlings, but Qhorin urged him to follow his orders and to do as he is ordered to to find out why they are all fleeing south from the true enemy. And I think that Jon really grew to understand the Wildlings (and their culture) and realize that he as a Northerner isn't all that much different from a Wildling (same religious beliefs, similar cultures, etc.). Plus he joined Alys Karstark to Sigorn Thenn, which I doubt is something that Ned or Robb would've done (Ned probably wouldn't have taken too kindly to a Wildling taking over Karhold). And to be honest, I seriously think that Jon 'stealing' Val (which has kind of inadvertently happened already) is going to come to frutition in TWoW. And if people ask him to head south (away from where he was betrayed), I think he'll do just that. Martin 'killing' Jon allows him to somewhat honorably leave the Watch and take care of matters.

Thanks glassman.

I don't think Arya is going to survive the series, but I could see Sansa potentially marrying him. With that being said, as of AFFC, Sansa/Alayne doesn't like the idea of being forced into marriages, and I think her story has been paralleling Lyanna's somewhat. She wasn't crazy about hearing that Harry has 2 Vale bastards, similar to how Lyanna told Ned that she wasn't crazy about Robert having a Vale bastard . Maybe she'll run away? Plus Sansa has come to learn that men like Joffrey and Harry, although physically attractive, aren't worthy husbands. Plus she's always thinking about the UnKiss .

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Pycelle mentions a poison called Widows Blood which slowly shuts down the bowels. Plus the description of Tywin during that scene...his face is green and had some nasty puss leaking out of his body . Oh and his corpse absolutely reaked and rotted faster; basically all the characters commented about the nasty stench

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So Tywin basically started rotting from within before Tyrion shot him in the gut with the crossbow. What a fitting way for him to die as he was a truly rotten person.

One of my favorite characters though. Original Gangsta.