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re: USWNT files federal discrimination suit against US Soccer, demand equal pay
Posted on 3/31/16 at 10:55 am to LNCHBOX
Posted on 3/31/16 at 10:55 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
And what exactly does this have to do with anything? This suit has nothing to do with endorsement money.
I'm not talking about the suit. I'm talking about the general perception of the men's and women's games.
3
Posted on 3/31/16 at 10:57 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
women's soccer is
There are 26.7 million Americans who watched the WWC final last year who disagree. More than watched the NBA finals.
And I get that patriotism and 2014 energy carryover played into that.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 10:57 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
I'm talking about the general perception of the men's and women's games.
They're not equal. And you're still not even bothering to try to address the points I've made.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:00 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
I'm not talking about the suit. I'm talking about the general perception of the men's and women's games.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:00 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
There are 26.7 million Americans who watched the WWC final last year who disagree. More than watched the NBA finals.
quote:
This number has been, and will continue to be, misrepresented in the media as a grand sign that women’s soccer, and soccer in general, is a big-time sport in the country. If it does better than America’s past time, how can it not?
But here are a few other numbers for you: 30.4 million, 24.4 million, 31.1 million, 21.4 million. Those are the average viewership numbers for the last four Olympics (2008 Beijing, 2010 Vancouver, 2012 London, 2014 Sochi), the latter two of which featured every major primetime telecast showing recorded sports. And those aren’t one two-hour program on a holiday weekend with a captive audience, like Sunday night’s win. That’s the average of 15 days of coverage lasting approximately 3 hours and 30 minutes each. There’s no comparison. Does that mean swimming, track, figure skating, hockey and bobsled were growing in the United States? Of course not. It means that we, as a country, like to wrap ourselves in the flag while watching sporting events.
It has been this way and it will continue to be this way. Women’s soccer is an accepted, crossover sport that America now enjoys rather than tolerates. But that’s all. Expect ratings 50-75% higher than the Women’s World Cup next summer during the entire fortnight of the Rio Olympics, which will be aired mostly live on NBC. Those ratings will be huge, NBC will be pleased, but it won’t mean anything outside those two weeks, the same as the WWC numbers. Even when Michael Phelps won eight gold medals — the greatest sports achievement of the century — swimming barely made a blip after the Olympic cauldron was snuffed.
Girls will still continue to play soccer in grade school, middle school and high school. A few might be more inclined to play the sport after watching their countrywomen bring home another title. But just like with swimming and track and figure skating, interest in a one-off, patriotic event shouldn’t be confused with a revolution. In a few days, the heroes of this summer — Carli Lloyd, Alex Morgan, Megan Rapinoe — will go back to playing in the National Women’s Soccer League and very few of those 25 million viewers will care. They, like other stars of secondary American sports, are like eclipses, shining brightly once every few years before receding back out of the spotlight.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:03 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
They're not equal. And you're still not even bothering to try to address the points I've made.
I don't see any points that you made. Only critiques of my points, which I'm addressing.
The only point that I was trying to make in this entire thread is that while women's soccer players should not be paid the exact same as men's until the market demands that (which may never happen)), the market is titled in favor of the men's game due to institutional sexism established by FIFA under Blatter and the trickle down that's had on the rest of the sport.
This lawsuit, hopefully, will level the playing field, or at least start the conversation. But the adversarial/ad hom rhetoric that's already come my way for taking that marginally progressive stance is evidence enough that there's a long way to go.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:04 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
I'm talking about the general perception of the men's and women's games.
You show me a chick who can score a goal with the athleticism and skill that this one took and I'll start to believe you.
This post was edited on 3/31/16 at 11:05 am
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:04 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
the market is titled in favor of the men's game due to institutional sexism established by FIFA under Blatter and the trickle down that's had on the rest of the sport.
Or maybe it's because the women's game doesn't garner near the viewership that the men's side does. So explain to me the point of you bringing up Serena's net worth again. OR are you just going to pretend it didn't happen because I dropped a nuke on it?
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:05 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
This number has been, and will continue to be, misrepresented in the media as a grand sign that women’s soccer, and soccer in general, is a big-time sport in the country. If it does better than America’s past time, how can it not?
While I don't disagree with all that you quoted, this same argument has been leveled at MLS, and many on this board have rebuffed it.
quote:
It means that we, as a country, like to wrap ourselves in the flag while watching sporting events.
I acknowledged that and understand it plays a huge part.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:06 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
this same argument has been leveled at MLS, and many on this board have rebuffed it.
The MLS has nothing to do with comparing the overall ratings of the men's and women's game. You really should just stop now.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:08 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
So explain to me the point of you bringing up Serena's net worth again
He said "male athletes will always make more than female athletes."
I pointed out that Serena Williams, a female athlete, makes a lot more than many male athletes.
It was a specific criticism of an general (and incorrect) premise.
quote:
maybe it's because the women's game doesn't garner near the viewership that the men's side does.
Again, I'm not saying that investment/pay/money should be equal. It should be proportional.
And if you don't agree that Sepp is sexist then we're not going to make in progress in this exchange.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:08 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
the market is titled in favor of the men's game due to institutional sexism established by FIFA under Blatter and the trickle down that's had on the rest of the sport.
Blatter fricking sucks, but to say that the finances are tilted towards the men because of institutional sexism is just ridiculous.
The men's game is just purely more entertaining to watch and is more impressive. You see athletic feats that a large percent of the population are unable to do, while the current women's world cup champions have been beaten by boy U-15's.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:08 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
Proportional pay/investment would be a start. Not equal. Proportional
Proportional to what?
What is the purpose of the national teams?
It's not to make Abby Wambach wealthy.
The model now seems to be to pay them as much as we need to pay them in order to maximize results on the field.
Is there another model that you would rather?
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:09 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
I pointed out that Serena Williams, a female athlete, makes a lot more than many male athletes.
But not as much as the top men, so your point is stupid.
quote:
It was a specific criticism of an general (and incorrect) premise.
Really, the highest paid athletes aren't men? link?
quote:
And if you don't agree that Sepp is sexist then we're not going to make in progress in this exchange.
We're not going to make progress when you can't make a coherent point that isn't completely wrong.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:09 am to McCaigBro69
quote:
You show me a chick who can score a goal with the athleticism and skill that this one took and I'll start to believe you.
I would never argue that women's soccer and men's soccer are aesthetic equals. Particularly when it comes to traits like speed, power, and strength.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:13 am to uway
quote:
Proportional to what?
Of the $1 billion FIFA spends on development, $13 million is earmarked for women's soccer. That's 1.3 percent.
(Yes, I know this is tangential to the lawsuit.)
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:15 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
Of the $1 billion FIFA spends on development, $13 million is earmarked for women's soccer. That's 1.3 percent.
Do they need more? Outside of WC year, they make less money, and they're already more developed than all their competition.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:16 am to McCaigBro69
quote:
the finances are tilted towards the men because of institutional sexism is just ridiculous
Not talking revenues or pay. Talking strictly developmental investment. See the 1.3 percent figure I just mentioned.
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:17 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
Of the $1 billion FIFA spends on development, $13 million is earmarked for women's soccer. That's 1.3 percent.
Why is that wrong? Is it supposed to be self-evidently wrong?
Where does FIFA get its funding? Is there demand for a separate federation for women?
Posted on 3/31/16 at 11:17 am to Stewie Griffin
quote:
There are 26.7 million Americans who watched the WWC final last year who disagree. More than watched the NBA finals.
And I get that patriotism and 2014 energy carryover played into that.
and the "every 4 years" angle
a lot of my soccer-loving friends irl were upset with me when they asked me where i was watching the game and was like "i'm not"
i get it and i'm not criticizing them
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