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re: This is why the US currently can't compete with the world's best
Posted on 7/1/14 at 9:58 pm to Jimmydatiger
Posted on 7/1/14 at 9:58 pm to Jimmydatiger
quote:
Italy Spain and England failed to advance out of the groups. US despite limited ball control ability and tactical awareness did advance apparently due to raw athletic ability and perhaps pure grit.
Ehhhh, I don't think that's why they didn't advance. England is just England. They don't play well together as a team. Italy and Spain certainly have the talent but they just shite the bed and didn't play anywhere close to their potential.
1
Posted on 7/1/14 at 10:02 pm to cwil177
Now I will give you the real reason, not what you are repeating from Ballack.
We don't start trianing our soccer players at 5 and 6 like we do our football and baseball players.
By the time most european kids are 16 to 18 they have the same skiills as our 25 to 27 year old players, who are now to old to use them.
Our soccer kids play to have fun, their soccer players are taught the game at early ages, like our football kids.
We have to set up academies all over or we will never catch up.
And poor kids must be paid for by the academies.
We don't start trianing our soccer players at 5 and 6 like we do our football and baseball players.
By the time most european kids are 16 to 18 they have the same skiills as our 25 to 27 year old players, who are now to old to use them.
Our soccer kids play to have fun, their soccer players are taught the game at early ages, like our football kids.
We have to set up academies all over or we will never catch up.
And poor kids must be paid for by the academies.
Posted on 7/1/14 at 10:03 pm to SUB
we did "grit" it out to a degree, but portugal is a top ten squad in the world and they played like shite the entire tourney as well.
US soccer is on the rise in my opinion.
US soccer is on the rise in my opinion.
Posted on 7/1/14 at 10:16 pm to S.E.C. Crazy
quote:
We don't start trianing our soccer players at 5 and 6 like we do our football and baseball players.
In which universe is the United States systematically training its football players in an academy setting? Most people can't even play football until middle school at the earliest. A lot of elite NFL players didn't start playing until they're in high school and don't receive any kind of real coaching until they reach college. Tim Tebow was a first-round draft pick at QB without even being taught how to properly throw a football or take a snap from under center. Football players are selected largely on athletic ability and toughness.
Posted on 7/1/14 at 10:30 pm to OFWHAP
american football is a different animal.
no one else in the world even plays the fricking game so inherently it doesn't matter how we train them. There is only one training/development path in the world and its what we do nationwide. There is no other country doing it a different way to measure by.
I would imagine if you sent 50 nfl coaches to russia for 10 years and they were given half a billion dollars to create a youth league where they had the whole country to pull from and the kids were pulled from their normal lives and put into academies at the age of 8 until they were 18-19, and then they played together for 5-6 years until they physically matured at 24 or so, you would probably end up a pretty badass team that would be able to compete with an NFL team.
Maybe a better way of saying it is how much better would even our best players be if they had been allowed to do just that since they were 8? They'd all have the tactical ability/situational awareness of Peyton Manning.
That's essentially what these countries have done in soccer.
Hell England created the damn sport and even they've revamped their youth system to try to catch back up to the Brazil, Argentina, Spain, Italys of the world stage.
no one else in the world even plays the fricking game so inherently it doesn't matter how we train them. There is only one training/development path in the world and its what we do nationwide. There is no other country doing it a different way to measure by.
I would imagine if you sent 50 nfl coaches to russia for 10 years and they were given half a billion dollars to create a youth league where they had the whole country to pull from and the kids were pulled from their normal lives and put into academies at the age of 8 until they were 18-19, and then they played together for 5-6 years until they physically matured at 24 or so, you would probably end up a pretty badass team that would be able to compete with an NFL team.
Maybe a better way of saying it is how much better would even our best players be if they had been allowed to do just that since they were 8? They'd all have the tactical ability/situational awareness of Peyton Manning.
That's essentially what these countries have done in soccer.
Hell England created the damn sport and even they've revamped their youth system to try to catch back up to the Brazil, Argentina, Spain, Italys of the world stage.
This post was edited on 7/1/14 at 10:31 pm
Posted on 7/1/14 at 11:00 pm to S.E.C. Crazy
quote:
Now I will give you the real reason, not what you are repeating from Ballack.
**proceeds to add nothing to the conversation**
Posted on 7/1/14 at 11:14 pm to LukeSidewalker
quote:
he problem is an organization like FIFA is run by people that cater to Europe and South American teams. The olympics have teams from all confederations that have won medals and at least 4 of 6 have won a gold. No team outside of Europe or South America has ever played for the world cup.
Africa usually does well in the young player events because they cheat like hell by fudging ages.
Posted on 7/1/14 at 11:50 pm to cwil177
It looked like Belgium had an Adrian Peterson on the field for them today. Origi was bigger, stronger and faster than anyone the U.S. had on the field. Belgium had players coming off the bench who appeared to be better athletes than the U.S. players. The U.S. didn't lose today because Belgium had better technical skills. We lost because Belgium had better athletes. That wouldn't be the case if Adrian Peterson, and other American elite athletes, had chosen to play soccer.
Posted on 7/1/14 at 11:52 pm to Poodlebrain
quote:
The U.S. didn't lose today because Belgium had better technical skills.
Um, that's exactly why the US lost. Belgium was so much more creative and had more quality possessions.
Posted on 7/1/14 at 11:54 pm to Poodlebrain
quote:
Poodlebrain
Posted on 7/1/14 at 11:58 pm to Poodlebrain
Guess you missed De Bruyne out there.
Posted on 7/2/14 at 12:04 am to Poodlebrain
quote:
Origi was bigger, stronger and faster than anyone the U.S. had on the field. Belgium had players coming off the bench who appeared to be better athletes than the U.S. players.
1. Origi didn't score.
2. Belgium combines great athletes with amazing technical ability.
3. We didn't lose because of their athletic skill, we lost because of their technical skill.
4. You should probably watch more soccer. Google Santi Cazorla if you want an idea of someone who can be an incredible player but look not so athletic.
Posted on 7/2/14 at 12:12 am to kilo
quote:
Its also not a coincidence that the US, England, Russia, China, Australia, Norway, Sweeden, Canada and on and on dont have a rich international history and success.
What's the connection here that you are trying to make? You've lost me.
Posted on 7/2/14 at 12:18 am to cwil177
One only needs to look at players like Messi, Xavi, Iniesta, and others to see that physical ability doesn't automatically translate into technical skill. That's why Ronaldo is so special. He is the epitome of both, and that makes him so rare.
Posted on 7/2/14 at 12:31 am to SabiDojo
quote:The opportunities for Belgium that I saw came from superior athletes getting separation from their U.S. defenders and receiving ordinary passes. There were no Pete Maravich type creative passes being made, just routine passes to open people.
Um, that's exactly why the US lost. Belgium was so much more creative and had more quality possessions.
I guess I should have added the qualifier that Belgium is the most athletic team I have seen in the World Cup. I contrast today's match with the match against Portugal. The Portuguese had a similar advantage in ball skills over the U.S. players, but I think the U.S. had an edge in athleticism, with the exception of Ronaldo. Portugal did not create near the number or quality of scoring opportunities that Belgium did. And the biggest difference I saw was athleticism.
Posted on 7/2/14 at 12:42 am to Poodlebrain
quote:
I guess I should have added the qualifier that Belgium is the most athletic team I have seen in the World Cup.
They are extremely athletic, which is usually what the US's advantage is. They are also really big, which mitigates our other advantage. We probably had the fastest players on the field in our fullbacks, but the speed differential between their strikers and our centerbacks just highlighted how slow our CB's are. Also Origi and Lukaku, their two strikers, are rare in the soccer world in that they are big, fast, and have technical skills. It's really rare that you have two of them on the same team. Belgium actually have three, but their best is injured.
The reality is that the Belgian FA redesigned their youth system so they could get the most out of their athletes. They completely overhauled it. France, Germany and other nations have done the same in the last 20 years. It's time the US follows suit and takes advantage of the consider athleticism of the populace.
This post was edited on 7/2/14 at 12:43 am
Posted on 7/2/14 at 12:48 am to crazy4lsu
quote:
The reality is that the Belgian FA redesigned their youth system so they could get the most out of their athletes. They completely overhauled it. France, Germany and other nations have done the same in the last 20 years. It's time the US follows suit and takes advantage of the consider athleticism of the populace.
It looks as if Belgium are cherry picking talent from their former colonial holdings in the Congo and molding them into players.
Posted on 7/2/14 at 12:52 am to thesoccerfanjax
quote:
Hey what if latin guys from the ghetto played soccer?
FIFY
Posted on 7/2/14 at 12:57 am to OFWHAP
In Alabama we have pur kids training and learnig yhe TECHNICAL ASPECTS of football from day one.
Louisiana might ne different.
In soccer we send them out to have fun.
The Euro kids don't all ho to academies, they have many more technically gifted teachers, and all the players are taught properly, only the gifted move on to academies
The reason we have to set up academies is MOST OF OUR COACHES DON'T KNOW SHYT ABOUT SOCCER.
Could you see your average German teaching American Football tactics? LOL.
THAT'S MY POINT IN REVERSE
For Germans to learn American football they would have to open up academies with people that could teach the game properly, or they wouldn't be worth a crap.
Louisiana might ne different.
In soccer we send them out to have fun.
The Euro kids don't all ho to academies, they have many more technically gifted teachers, and all the players are taught properly, only the gifted move on to academies
The reason we have to set up academies is MOST OF OUR COACHES DON'T KNOW SHYT ABOUT SOCCER.
Could you see your average German teaching American Football tactics? LOL.
THAT'S MY POINT IN REVERSE
For Germans to learn American football they would have to open up academies with people that could teach the game properly, or they wouldn't be worth a crap.
Posted on 7/2/14 at 1:11 am to cwil177
Population, wealth, and growing popularity, it isn't going to make better soccer players.
The US' issues with soccer run far deeper than simply focusing on technique. The fact you have people claiming that athletes like LeBron and company not playing soccer is our issue then people really have no idea why the US is mediocre at the sport.
Remind me again how guys like Messi and Hazard are such amazing physical specimens? They aren't, but their skills are what separate them. Their focus on the sport is unrivaled. You don't have to be 6'+ tall, weigh a ton, and run a 4.3 second 40 to be good at soccer. It takes a ton more to be good at the sport, but people think it is so simple for us to win.
In the end, the US can only improve by focusing on bettering the players they have. They have a lot of heart, but realistically, they aren't a top level team and won't be even with Klinsmann at the helm.
The US' issues with soccer run far deeper than simply focusing on technique. The fact you have people claiming that athletes like LeBron and company not playing soccer is our issue then people really have no idea why the US is mediocre at the sport.
Remind me again how guys like Messi and Hazard are such amazing physical specimens? They aren't, but their skills are what separate them. Their focus on the sport is unrivaled. You don't have to be 6'+ tall, weigh a ton, and run a 4.3 second 40 to be good at soccer. It takes a ton more to be good at the sport, but people think it is so simple for us to win.
In the end, the US can only improve by focusing on bettering the players they have. They have a lot of heart, but realistically, they aren't a top level team and won't be even with Klinsmann at the helm.
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