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re: Liverpool FC 2013/2014 - Season Long Thread
Posted on 7/31/13 at 12:51 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
Posted on 7/31/13 at 12:51 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
quote:
I've read a bunch of shite that says Rodgers is taking him on loan with the intention to play as a winger. His defensive skills are apparently atrocious
+1
1
Posted on 7/31/13 at 1:00 pm to TheZaba
I'm definitely cool with him being played as a winger, but I don't want to see him anywhere near the back line
Posted on 7/31/13 at 2:00 pm to JLock
yeah, BR mentioned he wanted to bring a LB as competition for Enrique... not sure if this is the guy, but the logic (played LB last season/loan) points to him being the guy...
Give him some PT at LB against some lesser competition and see what he can do and if he progresses, possibly sign him on... The added bonus is he can play as a LW too
A lot of the South American LB/RBs started out as wingers with terrible defensive skills...
Hopefully we bring in a boss DM that can cover for any mistakes..
Give him some PT at LB against some lesser competition and see what he can do and if he progresses, possibly sign him on... The added bonus is he can play as a LW too
A lot of the South American LB/RBs started out as wingers with terrible defensive skills...
Hopefully we bring in a boss DM that can cover for any mistakes..
Posted on 7/31/13 at 2:30 pm to TFTC
Ehh not sure DM is a big priority for Rodgers. Frankly I don't think we necessarily need one if we bring in a solid CB. Most possession systems don't require a pure DM nowadays. Two holding mids with good positioning and tactical awareness is all we really need.
Posted on 7/31/13 at 3:21 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
Apparently the Sterling news was made up by twitter based on this tweet from Jack Sullivan. It was later rubbished by Ben Smith.
I think we should get a DM. Capoue was going for around 8 mn. I would take a punt on him so we have good cover for Lucas. Also according to Ben Smith we are actively pursuing an LB and an Attacker.
I think we should get a DM. Capoue was going for around 8 mn. I would take a punt on him so we have good cover for Lucas. Also according to Ben Smith we are actively pursuing an LB and an Attacker.
Posted on 7/31/13 at 3:53 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
But we dont really play with two holding mids and he likes to split those CBs wide (similar to Barca)... he may have faith in Lucas and maybe it's warranted, but I think we need an upgrade...
edit: Busquets is why they can do that and not worry too much about Alba and Alves up the field so much... granted, they need to bring in a new CB now..
edit: Busquets is why they can do that and not worry too much about Alba and Alves up the field so much... granted, they need to bring in a new CB now..
This post was edited on 7/31/13 at 3:55 pm
Posted on 7/31/13 at 4:16 pm to TFTC
My point exactly. Lucas while good, isn't good enough for playing the high line with split backs. If Capoue, Gonalons or Kondogbia is brought in to provide more competition for the position it might lift his game up. Even Barca have 3 A-grade players who can possibly play in the position:: Busquets, Song, Mascherano. Busquets being ideal but the other two can deputize. While we don't have one player of that level.
This post was edited on 7/31/13 at 4:17 pm
Posted on 7/31/13 at 4:23 pm to TFTC
We played with 2 holding mids quite a few times last season..
Mostly it was Gerrard and Lucas. But there was also Gerrard and Allen and Gerrard and Henderson (without Lucas).
Lucas isn't a DM in our 4-3-3 like he was in Dalglish's 4-4-2 or whatever formation he ran. But he isn't positionally aware enough to be relied upon to play next to Gerrard as effectively as we need him to be.
Mostly it was Gerrard and Lucas. But there was also Gerrard and Allen and Gerrard and Henderson (without Lucas).
Lucas isn't a DM in our 4-3-3 like he was in Dalglish's 4-4-2 or whatever formation he ran. But he isn't positionally aware enough to be relied upon to play next to Gerrard as effectively as we need him to be.
Posted on 7/31/13 at 4:25 pm to WeOnlyHateMancs
But we don't need a DM to succeed. Look at United, Chelsea or arsenal the past several seasons. It's a dying position.
Destroyers are obsolete in possession systems because they normally aren't tactically or technically astute enough to hold the ball. Rodgers wants skilled players in the midfield. We win the ball back through fantastic pressing and spacing; a DM isn't needed.
Destroyers are obsolete in possession systems because they normally aren't tactically or technically astute enough to hold the ball. Rodgers wants skilled players in the midfield. We win the ball back through fantastic pressing and spacing; a DM isn't needed.
This post was edited on 7/31/13 at 4:27 pm
Posted on 7/31/13 at 4:36 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
I guess we need to discuss the role of each player in our system.
When Gerrard and Lucas play together, I consider them 2 holding midfielders. Neither play box-to-box, and I wouldn't describe Lucas as a destroyer.
When Gerrard and Lucas play together, I consider them 2 holding midfielders. Neither play box-to-box, and I wouldn't describe Lucas as a destroyer.
Posted on 7/31/13 at 4:40 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
I think he had to adjust a little because we didn't have a good holding MF... Though I do consider Stevie more B2B, he doesn't just sit back and ping balls around. He may not get forward as much as he used to. I dont necessarily think we need a destroyer, but we need a better DM than Lucas IMO. Someone who can anticipate the play a little better and not always be as reactionary.
those teams dont play they same system as us either and when I read all three of their fan bases assess needs they all have been screaming for a proper DM..
edit: I dont always view a DM as a destroyer... some are better at reading and intercepting... Lucas seems to always be chasing..
those teams dont play they same system as us either and when I read all three of their fan bases assess needs they all have been screaming for a proper DM..
edit: I dont always view a DM as a destroyer... some are better at reading and intercepting... Lucas seems to always be chasing..
This post was edited on 7/31/13 at 4:43 pm
Posted on 7/31/13 at 4:46 pm to TFTC
Generally the two terms can be used somewhat synonymously.
I consider a DM to be a destroyer. I've read a lot of tactical books and that's what I've come away with. They are traditionally the most physically imposing players on the pitch (though not always) and possess little technical skills and a small passing range.
I don't consider Lucas to be a DM in that mold. He's a more defensive holding midfielder with a good passing range. I do think we need an upgrade over him, but it won't be a traditional DM like everyone seems to want. We just need someone who is more positionally aware because, like you said, Lucas is always chasing the play.
I consider a DM to be a destroyer. I've read a lot of tactical books and that's what I've come away with. They are traditionally the most physically imposing players on the pitch (though not always) and possess little technical skills and a small passing range.
I don't consider Lucas to be a DM in that mold. He's a more defensive holding midfielder with a good passing range. I do think we need an upgrade over him, but it won't be a traditional DM like everyone seems to want. We just need someone who is more positionally aware because, like you said, Lucas is always chasing the play.
This post was edited on 7/31/13 at 4:47 pm
Posted on 7/31/13 at 4:52 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
I agree they can be used interchangeably, but my best example of two holding MFers in a double pivot is... at least how I view it..
Mascherano - Defensive Midfielder
Alonso -Deep Lying Playmaker
the term destroyer, to me, is more of a style of defensive MFer... Tiote, De Jong, Fernando Reges, Medel, Masch (although his game has been refined some at Barca)
both roles vary between teams, etc..
IMO, our current version of LFC needs a Mascherano much more so than Alonso..
Mascherano - Defensive Midfielder
Alonso -Deep Lying Playmaker
the term destroyer, to me, is more of a style of defensive MFer... Tiote, De Jong, Fernando Reges, Medel, Masch (although his game has been refined some at Barca)
both roles vary between teams, etc..
IMO, our current version of LFC needs a Mascherano much more so than Alonso..
Posted on 7/31/13 at 4:56 pm to TFTC
Well there aren't many Mascheranos out there. He's a particularly skilled player for his position.
Posted on 7/31/13 at 5:05 pm to LSUSOBEAST1
France seems to have an abundance of them... the ones that could be possible gets are Capoue, Gonalons, M'Villa (may be too much trouble) and Kondogbia (though he may be on his way to Madrid)...
Even Schneiderlin may be worth a look
edit: will be a hard position to get into for their national team when you consider Toulalan, Matuidi and Pogba too... I'm sure I'm overlooking others..
Even Schneiderlin may be worth a look
edit: will be a hard position to get into for their national team when you consider Toulalan, Matuidi and Pogba too... I'm sure I'm overlooking others..
This post was edited on 7/31/13 at 5:10 pm
Posted on 7/31/13 at 5:50 pm to TFTC
What about Nemanja Matic?
Posted on 7/31/13 at 5:56 pm to McRebel42
He is another... looks like Chelsea let him go to soon... he's a big fella too... On all accounts, Benfica didnt miss Javi Garcia one bit with him stepping in..
Posted on 7/31/13 at 7:58 pm to TFTC
I read where the benfica staff said he was actually better
Posted on 7/31/13 at 9:24 pm to McRebel42
Yeah, he was part of the Luiz deal. He's even been linked back to Chelsea a few times.
Posted on 7/31/13 at 9:39 pm to TFTC
quote:
Hopefully we bring in a boss DM that can cover for any mistakes.
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