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Started By
Message
re: What do you think is causing the housing slump?
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:12 am to DeltaHog
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:12 am to DeltaHog
quote:
Of course. I would love to do that...my wife on the other hand. We found a house out in the country outside Nashville. It was somewhat cheaper but calculating the traffic to get into the city for work coupled with daycare just did not make much sense. Gas alone didn’t make it much worth it.
What was your major anyway??
0
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:15 am to ShortyRob
quote:
Well, I mean, why did you fall for it? Do you actually need to be a financial genius to know that 100K in debt while studying for a degree that has virtually no demand isn't a great idea?
I do not think it was a “fall for it” type of thing. I was on my way to becoming the first in my family to attend college from a tiny poor delta farm town in east Arkansas. Yeah, we believed the financial adviser that I could pay the loans back quickly. Also, I was going to school for political science in order to go to law school one day. I wasn’t applying for a dance degree.
Just to note, I ended up entering the workforce instead of finishing my degree. I felt like it was the right decision to make regarding what I actually wanted to do with my life. I grew up cooking and in kitchens and it was my passion. I ended my fafsa and college career in order to work. I don’t have a ton of student loan debt because of that decision but I do understand where people
Come from and how they could have been potentially tricked or misguided into taking out a ton of debt.
Once you get older you realize most colleges aren’t there to educate people, it’s a business just like any other. I didn’t think like that at 18 and I guess my old man didn’t either.
This post was edited on 6/5/19 at 10:23 am
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:18 am to DeltaHog
quote:
I do not think it was a “fall for it” type of thing. I was on my way to becoming the first in my family to attend college from a tiny poor delta farm town in east Arkansas. Yeah, we believed the financial adviser that I could pay the loans back quickly
This isn't helpful to me without knowing your major.
Did the financial adviser know your intended major?
quote:Well, Poli Sci on it's own isn't very marketable. I mean, yeah, it's not a dance degree, but still.
Also, I was going to school for political science in order to go to law school one day.
The point is, not all degrees are equal in value. It's a sliding scale.
If someone wants to go $100k in debt on their way to being a surgeon, it makes more sens than if they're on their way to being a teacher.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:21 am to DeltaHog
To add.
I really have no idea how this paradigm arrived where people talk about going in to debt to get "a degree" with no regard to WHAT degree.
I don't think I can find a single 20 year old who needed a car who would think, "I'll take deferred payment loans for almost any amount to get 'a car'".
They'd fricking want to know WHAT car. No one would think that if their buddy went $50K in deferred debt to get a BMW that it would make sense to go into the same $50K in deferred debt to get a Kia.
I really have no idea how this paradigm arrived where people talk about going in to debt to get "a degree" with no regard to WHAT degree.
I don't think I can find a single 20 year old who needed a car who would think, "I'll take deferred payment loans for almost any amount to get 'a car'".
They'd fricking want to know WHAT car. No one would think that if their buddy went $50K in deferred debt to get a BMW that it would make sense to go into the same $50K in deferred debt to get a Kia.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:28 am to trinidadtiger
quote:
trinidadtiger
What's causing the collapse in oil and gas prices???
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:30 am to ShortyRob
quote:
I really have no idea how this paradigm arrived where people talk about going in to debt to get "a degree" with no regard to WHAT degree.
Lower to lower middle class families who never attended/finished college saw college as a means of ensuring their children lived a better life without any real thought/insight into things like interships, degree, etc.
Even school teachers only ever really stressed "going to college" and not learning a marketable skill and spending summers working at internships to gain work experience that is valuable on your resume after you graduate. It's just much easier to say "go to college; get good job" than it is to stress the importance of finding something you're good at and/or enjoy, figuring out a way to make money off of that thing, learning what level of education is necessary, and taking every opportunity to obtain valuable work experience in that field.
Granted, I do feel like it was a lot easier in our parents generation to simple get a business degree and walk into a decent paying job with good retirement.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:30 am to ShortyRob
quote:
I really have no idea how this paradigm arrived where people talk about going in to debt to get "a degree" with no regard to WHAT degree.
My dad got a general studies degree from LSU and had a lucrative career. The same job today? You would need a masters degree in a specific study. As more people got degrees, companies could be more selective. It evolved over time. Plus, college got way more expensive. You could justify getting damn near any degree in 1975. So kids were being advised by parents who didn't understand the changes in some cases.
This post was edited on 6/5/19 at 10:32 am
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:33 am to pizzatiger
quote:I already addressed this.
My dad got a general studies degree from LSU and had a lucrative career. The same job today? You would need a masters degree in a specific field.
It's because we, for some dumb assed reason, decided to basically throw "free" money at people to get degrees which had the great effect of reducing the value of said degrees while increasing their cost!
But, this isn't exactly news. It's not like someone going to college TODAY is, or should be, somehow unaware that a GS degree isn't as valuable as it may have been 30 years ago.
quote:I'm aware. That's kinda my point. You have to assign value to what you plan to buy based on TODAY's value.
As more people got degrees, companies could be more selective. It evolved over time.
And, going in to debt to get a degree is "buying" a degree. So, buy wisely! You would with a car!
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:41 am to ShortyRob
quote:
I already addressed this. It's because we, for some dumb assed reason, decided to basically throw "free" money at people to get degrees which had the great effect of reducing the value of said degrees while increasing their cost! But, this isn't exactly news. It's not like someone going to college TODAY is, or should be, somehow unaware that a GS degree isn't as valuable as it may have been 30 years ago.
And what generation fostered this environment? Baby Boomers and older members of Gen X.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:45 am to trinidadtiger
Housing costs.
Economy does not pay union wages.
A lot of work is done by poor people in Asia, Phillipines, Brazil.
People work for very little doing work formerly performed at rates you could buy a house and have a stay at home wife and 2.5 kids and a collie.
Marx. Capital
Is, was and will always be accurate accessment of capital, labor.
Economy does not pay union wages.
A lot of work is done by poor people in Asia, Phillipines, Brazil.
People work for very little doing work formerly performed at rates you could buy a house and have a stay at home wife and 2.5 kids and a collie.
Marx. Capital
Is, was and will always be accurate accessment of capital, labor.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:56 am to ShortyRob
quote:
It's because we, for some dumb assed reason, decided to basically throw "free" money at people to get degrees which had the great effect of reducing the value of said degrees while increasing their cost!
I understand that it was financed by the government. College kids can't do anything about that.
quote:
But, this isn't exactly news. It's not like someone going to college TODAY is, or should be, somehow unaware that a GS degree isn't as valuable as it may have been 30 years ago.
Today it's much more well publicized. But 10 or 15 years ago, a lot of teachers and parents weren't telling kids about the dangers of student debt. Also, the value of a degree declined gradually over time. It wasn't some overnight phenomenon. Some people were just bound to be causalities of the rising cost of education, the declining value of a degree, and the more qualifications required to get employed.
It was just a bad mix of things that occurred gradually but simultaneously
If you want a comparison, prior generations were sold hard on home ownership. And look how that turned out.
This post was edited on 6/5/19 at 11:01 am
Posted on 6/5/19 at 10:57 am to CelticDog
quote:
Marx. Capital
Is, was and will always be accurate accessment of capital, labor.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 11:01 am to pizzatiger
quote:
Today it's much more well publicized. But 10 or 15 years ago, a lot of teachers and parents weren't telling kids about the dangers of student debt. Also, the value of a degree declined gradually over time. It wasn't some overnight phenomenon. Some people were just bound to be causalities of the rising cost of education, the declining value of a degree, and the more qualifications required to get employed.
I would like to just pause for a moment to point out that I have two friends. One is an older millennial and the other misses by like 2 years. Neither have a degree. Both make greater than $90K in Huntsville, AL which isn't exactly NYC cost of living.
Alas, they also both have, what one might consider a more unique background for their age.
BOTH had jobs and worked 30+ hours from the time they were 16 years old.
Make no mistake. I think the fact that middle class kids have made a near complete departure from this paradigm which was absolutely the NORM when I was in HS is not an insignificant factor albeit one that is hard to quanitify.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 11:06 am to DeltaHog
quote:
Now who’s fault is that?
I would think it would be the group that failed to do what every generation in America history has accomplished.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 11:07 am to trinidadtiger
Kids today:
Graduate later
Get hired to a "good" job later
Get married later (if at all)
You typically need all of these things before buying a house.
Plus, the housing "slump" is not everywhere, but only in some markets. They happen to be big markets, but they are not the entire country.
Graduate later
Get hired to a "good" job later
Get married later (if at all)
You typically need all of these things before buying a house.
Plus, the housing "slump" is not everywhere, but only in some markets. They happen to be big markets, but they are not the entire country.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 11:12 am to Loserman
quote:
Sure not EVERY one of you do that, but a large portion of you do.
You sure about that? Because I highly fricking doubt that that is the case.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 11:15 am to ShortyRob
quote:
Build a 1979 home today and it will NOT be 3x the price. Hell, built it with modern amenities but same floor plan, it won't be 3x the price.
Of course there are places in the US where this doesn't hold true. Usually they are in and around major cities on the coast.
The brand new starter home my wife and I bought in 1990 cost 70% more than the home I grew up in that was built in 1959
Same size house with an extra bathroom.
Nicer kitchen.
My parents owned that same home from 1959 until they died in 2007. Their house payment was $48 a month and they had around a 3% interest rate.
Of course my dad only earned $1.60/hour as a draftsman when he married my mom
My wife and I had a 6.5% interest rate on our first house.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 11:19 am to TigerintheNO
I don't begrudge young people noticing their current challenges. I just kinda chuckle at them when they talk like they've run into something heretofore unheard of as like a get out of responsibility free card.
It shows a spectacular lack of historical knowledge and reference.
For example. Imagine you were 18 years old in 1928.
1. Shortly after you were born, the world devolved into World War.
2. Sure, you then were raised during a bit of an economic boom but literally 2 years after you graduated HS, blammo, Great Depression complete with 25% unemployment rates
3. When we finally start coming out of that shite, what happens? ANOTHER fricking World War starts when you're frickin 29 years old! Hell, on top of the fact that your early work years were shot to shite, you were now eligible to be drafted!
4. FINALLY, assuming you managed to not die, the war is over and you can take advantage of a decent economy. Oh, yeah. Now you're 35 frickin years old!
Look. I know that generation made some dumb political decisions but get back to me when ANYONE today has that shite
It shows a spectacular lack of historical knowledge and reference.
For example. Imagine you were 18 years old in 1928.
1. Shortly after you were born, the world devolved into World War.
2. Sure, you then were raised during a bit of an economic boom but literally 2 years after you graduated HS, blammo, Great Depression complete with 25% unemployment rates
3. When we finally start coming out of that shite, what happens? ANOTHER fricking World War starts when you're frickin 29 years old! Hell, on top of the fact that your early work years were shot to shite, you were now eligible to be drafted!
4. FINALLY, assuming you managed to not die, the war is over and you can take advantage of a decent economy. Oh, yeah. Now you're 35 frickin years old!
Look. I know that generation made some dumb political decisions but get back to me when ANYONE today has that shite
Posted on 6/5/19 at 11:26 am to BulldogXero
quote:
I don't know that much about the 1970s. Job prospects may have been worse, but was the cost of living really as high?
mortgage rates were over 10% in the late 70s
Posted on 6/5/19 at 11:28 am to trinidadtiger
I wish it would hit Bossier...
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