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Message
re: What a Government Shutdown Means
Posted on 12/12/18 at 3:32 pm to UAinSOUTHAL
Posted on 12/12/18 at 3:32 pm to UAinSOUTHAL
quote:
Seems cut an dried then that the Democrats should just give Donnie 9" his 5 billion for the wall.
He's a billionaire. If he wants it so much, why doesn't he just pay for it? He could do a GoFundMe, and then you could help, too.
1
Posted on 12/12/18 at 3:38 pm to tokenBoiler
quote:
If he wants it so much, why doesn't he just pay for it?
If you like criminal alien invaders so much, why don't you just pay for them? You could at least house and feed a few, right?
Posted on 12/12/18 at 3:59 pm to Dale51
quote:
Hey Poindexter...you asked the question. How much do you think they contribute?
The burden of proof is on the ones proposing to build the wall.
You think the wall is going to save us money? prove it with a true cost benefit analysis. To do that, you not only need to take into account the cost of building and maintaining the wall and the cost of the immigrants, but you have to look at the economic contribution from the immigrants that would be lost with a wall.
When the Mexicans worked on my house, I realized more of an increase in the value on the home than the cost of the work and materials. That added value is a part of our economy.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 4:07 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
The burden of proof is on the ones proposing to build the wall.
Why are you changing the subject you brought up, i'e. how much the illegal criminal aliens contribute?
That being said, proof of what concerning the wall? That walls work? You actually doubt that walls work?
*quick!..change the subject again to cost..or airplanes, or visas*
Posted on 12/12/18 at 4:12 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
When the Mexicans worked on my house, I realized more of an increase in the value on the home than the cost of the work and materials.
So you're saying it was illegal criminal aliens that you hired to do your work?
Posted on 12/12/18 at 4:26 pm to Dale51
quote:
Why are you changing the subject you brought up, i'e. how much the illegal criminal aliens contribute?
I'm not. Since you people propose building a wall at great expense, I want to know what the NET savings will be. If this is too complicate for you to understand, just step aside and let one of the more economically astute answer the question.
quote:
You actually doubt that walls work?
I don't believe that walls work for solving economic problems. No true Conservative does.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 4:31 pm to boomer16
So there is an ROI to funding the wall vs shutting down the government. LOVE IT.
2. The only reason a shutdown 'costs' is because they pay these people back-wages... only damn 'business' in the world that pays people for work they didn't do.
3. All forloughed people are surplus labor... we can't reduce that workforce by 5%?! Especially with the private sector growing and increasing wages?!
GOVERNMENT PORK-BELLIED POLITICS. BURN IT ALL DOWN!!
2. The only reason a shutdown 'costs' is because they pay these people back-wages... only damn 'business' in the world that pays people for work they didn't do.
3. All forloughed people are surplus labor... we can't reduce that workforce by 5%?! Especially with the private sector growing and increasing wages?!
GOVERNMENT PORK-BELLIED POLITICS. BURN IT ALL DOWN!!
This post was edited on 12/12/18 at 4:33 pm
Posted on 12/12/18 at 4:42 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
I'm not. Since you people propose building a wall at great expense, I want to know what the NET savings will be.
Then you're simply confused again.
YOU asked the question "How much do these criminal aliens contribute to offset their 70k yearly sucking away of citizen taxpayer dollars"
I asked what you thought the value of their contributions were, then YOU bring up the cost of the wall.
Separate topics.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 4:46 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
I don't believe that walls work for solving economic problems. No true Conservative does.
Thats nice.
How about for stopping illegal criminal aliens from having easy access into the country? Would a wall make it easier or more difficult to cross the border?
* Nice touch adding the "No True Scotsman" Fallacy*
Posted on 12/12/18 at 5:00 pm to Dale51
quote:
Then you're simply confused again.
That's why I asked you to step aside and let more knowledgeable people respond. You have no idea what you're talking about.
quote:
YOU asked the question "How much do these criminal aliens contribute..."
Yes, I asked that question, what value do they contribute to the economy? In years of asking, I have yet to get a coherent response.
The REASON I ask this question, is that in order to determine the efficacy of building a wall, you have to know what the effects on the economy might be. When trying to determine those effects, you can't simply examine only one side of the ledger.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 5:01 pm to TBPland
quote:
It's funny accounting. I'll call BS
yep, every time dimms shut down the gubment all we hear is it is just a minor issue and it saves tax payers money, yet when republicans shut it down, its the end of the world and it wastes shite tons of money
its just like their polls, you can cherry pick data points to make any argument fit your narrative
Posted on 12/12/18 at 5:07 pm to AustinTigr
quote:
only damn 'business' in the world that pays people for work they didn't do.
It's also the only 'business' in the world run by people that can't agree on things, allowing that 'business' to be shutdown over childish bickering. Why should employees be screwed out of a paycheck because a bunch of guys with their heads in the sand can't compromise?
quote:
All forloughed people are surplus labor
First of all, lmao at a dumbass who can't spell "furlough" bitching about government employees. Second, you people that bitch about things like "why do we have NONessential gov employees" need to realize that just because something is nonessential doesn't mean it's not providing a valuable service. The USDA has departments that work with state and local units of government, providing "free" services that those units might otherwise not be able to afford.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 5:07 pm to Dale51
quote:
How about for stopping illegal criminal aliens from having easy access into the country?
What percentage of them, all of them, half of them, somewhere in between? The more efficient you make the barrier, the more it will cost. You have to balance that out with what the savings to the economy would be. To determine that, you need to calculate the cost these immigrants put on the economy - as well as the value the contribute to the economy. That would be their NET cost.
quote:
Would a wall make it easier or more difficult to cross the border?
Ask these Chinese:
They were found entering the country illegally by having themselves transported in a shipping container.
The solution to this economic problem is an economic solution. Why do these people want to leave their homes? We should strive to make it so that they don't want to leave where they are. That would not only help them, but it would help us, and it would be a more efficient solution than a wall.
And the "conservative" comment wasn't a fallacy, it was just a statement of fact. Take it however you will.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 5:09 pm to boomer16
I was on a call today and apparently, the rumor on the hill is that all swearing in proceedings for federally elected official will be canceled. Not sure what this would mean for a new Congress and their start date.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 5:11 pm to boomer16
What if none of the “productivity” of some or all of those furloughed employees is missed by anybody, anywhere, for any reason?
Could that possibly provide a bat signal to reduce the size of the beauracracy?
Could that possibly provide a bat signal to reduce the size of the beauracracy?
Posted on 12/12/18 at 6:00 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
The solution to this economic problem is an economic solution.
we need to export capitalism around the world!
Posted on 12/12/18 at 6:06 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
That's why I asked you to step aside and let more knowledgeable people respond. You have no idea what you're talking about.
Bless your heart.
quote:
Yes, I asked that question, what value do they contribute to the economy? In years of asking, I have yet to get a coherent response.
It's an idiotic question imo. There are no numbers available to address that. There ARE numbers available as to what they cost.
Your "question" is similar to this question.
How much does the average person contribute to the economy? If you can't give an accurate number then you have no standing to refuse what I say is so.
quote:
The REASON I ask this question, is that in order to determine the efficacy of building a wall, you have to know what the effects on the economy might be.
That makes little sense.
Your asking for a metric on the efficacy of a physical barrier?? They are quite effective, simply based on the nature of physical barriers.
You should know that asking irrational questions comparing two separate issues ruled by two separate metrics of evaluation can only be guessed at. Millions upon millions of potential costs on one side of the ledger and on the other side you have a fixed and effective structure in the wall.
How can you not "get" that?
Posted on 12/12/18 at 6:13 pm to boomer16
government shutdown means NON ESSENTIAL employees are furloughed for no longer than a week up to 6 weeks.. they get a paycheck its just delayed.. so gtfo with this "Gov't shutdown is sooo bad" bs.. hundreds of billions of dollars are spent on illegals every year from our tax dollars. Shut down the Gov't and fund the wall.. period.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 6:14 pm to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
What percentage of them, all of them, half of them, somewhere in between?
The highest number possible, and that number will increase with hands on experience.
Don't you agree??
quote:
They were found entering the country illegally by having themselves transported in a shipping container.
So what? Looks like about 20. Hundreds are caught every day on the southern border.
*but again...you change the subject*
quote:
The solution to this economic problem is an economic solution.
??You mean their economic problems?? Why would their economic problems be ours to solve??
quote:
And the "conservative" comment wasn't a fallacy, it was just a statement of fact. Take it however you will.
Yes it was. It's the well known "No True Scotsman" fallacy.
Posted on 12/12/18 at 6:18 pm to Canada_Baw
quote:
What if none of the “productivity” of some or all of those furloughed employees is missed by anybody, anywhere, for any reason? Could that possibly provide a bat signal to reduce the size of the beauracracy?
That^ +
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