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3
Posted on 1/10/25 at 8:09 am to Revelator
quote:
Lots of reasons.
Salt is very corrosive to equipment, it’s is more conductive of electricity, which presents a safety hazard, and the salt residue left over seeps into the ground and can ruin soil and vegetation
It's not corrosive to equipment that is made for that purpose. Also, do you think the soil and vegetation are ruined right now?
How good for the soil are melted cars and houses and chemicals, etc.?
There is absolutely no reason to desalinate water before it is used in firefighting ON THE frickING COAST.
It's not like we are bring it into Kansas.
These coastal communities should have dedicated pumps and firefighting equipment that is made to use ocean water. But I guess that is too logical.
This post was edited on 1/10/25 at 8:10 am
Posted on 1/10/25 at 8:11 am to KiwiHead
quote:
So you end up creating more of a tinderbox later because the salt will dry out the vegetation that much more...and faster? So you set the conditions for the next wildfire?
As opposed to how dry it is now, burned to a crisp?
There is no logical reason not to use seawater, and there is no reason to desalinate it in advance.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 8:17 am to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
There is absolutely no reason to desalinate water before it is used in firefighting
I just stated some.
If you don’t think salt is corrosive, you must have never visited places that salt roads in winter and observed what happens to cars there
This post was edited on 1/10/25 at 8:22 am
Posted on 1/10/25 at 8:29 am to dovehunter
quote:
If LA can build levees why can't CA build fire control systems to mitigate the inevitable?
The cataclysmic fires in Los Angeles also ignited another water-supply issue. Newsom and other Democratic officials in Sacramento now face renewed criticism over failing to build a single reservoir since 1979, despite a 2014 voter-passed $7.5 billion water bond ballot initiative that authorized the creation of new reservoirs and several other water infrastructure projects. As of 2022, no new storage projects were under construction, but proponents said there were as many as seven still in the planning and feasibility study phases.
It’s unclear what additional red tape the planned reservoirs still face. In 2022, the Los Angeles Times acknowledged that California’s government bureaucracies move at a “glacial pace,” and in the fall of 2021, Newsom created “strike teams” to help speed up the projects.
Under the proposition, $2.7 billion is slated for water storage, but the state funds can be used for “public benefits” as well, including salmon protection, recreation, and flood control.
A March report issued by the Pacific Institute, a conservative California-based water-focused think-tank, found that California is letting billions of gallons of stormwater wash out to sea each year.
Of the 10 states with the most “untapped potential,” California ranks ninth with approximately 2.27 million acre-feet of urban area runoff each year. (An acre-foot is about 326,000 gallons – enough water to supply up to three homes for a year).
The report also found that Los Angeles represents the urban area with the greatest stormwater runoff potential in the West, ranking 19th in the country. That urban area includes L.A., Long Beach, and Anaheim, and experiences approximately 490,000 acre-feet of runoff each year, or roughly 437 million gallons per day. LINK
Posted on 1/10/25 at 8:45 am to Revelator
quote:
I just stated some.
If you don’t think salt is corrosive, you must have never visited places that salt roads in winter and observed what happens to cars there
I never said that. Of course salt is corrosive. Fire is also corrosive. Melted houses and cars and factories are also corrosive.
The idea that we are discussing not using ocean water because of the salt is the height of stupidity, which led to this situation.
You just pointed out that salt (pure salt, not salt water) is used all over the country and put directly on roads. This is done daily in some parts of the country and has been done for years.
Yet, we are not using salt water for firefighting, not even in rare, emergency situations.
Madness!
Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:01 am to TrueTiger
Ships don't have to worry about what the salt does to soil.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:07 am to loogaroo
quote:
Just use the salt water as a last resort. Better than nothing.
Soil salinity please take a minute to look it up.
The environmentalist groups would sue the hell out of them.
So would all those wealthy fricks on the coast, when the yards on those million dollar homes never grow back.
This post was edited on 1/10/25 at 9:08 am
Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:09 am to Wolfwireless
quote:
Ships don't have to worry about what the salt does to soil.
You have to weigh the cost of salt damage vs. $billions in damages to your city burning down.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:14 am to dovehunter
Pump that water out of the ocean.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:26 am to loogaroo
quote:The thing is... they need periodic fires. If they had small fires to take out the ground fuel more often, they wouldn't have these big massive destructive fires.
Just use the salt water as a last resort. Better than nothing.
The idiot leftists see smoke and think it's "pollution!" and must be stopped. So they put out all the small fires. And that leads to what they are dealing with today. It's bzarre that they are against manipulating nature. Execpt when they aren't.
This post was edited on 1/10/25 at 9:27 am
Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:39 am to TrueTiger
quote:
You have to weigh the cost of salt damage vs. $billions in damages to your city burning down.
TrueTiger. The biggest reason why they can't do it, is because of the danger of Hydrogen Chloride Gas.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:47 am to MRTigerFan
quote:
Why would anyone think they need to desalinate water before using it to fight a fire?
Please go ask your local firefighters what can happen if you use large quantities of salt water at the high degrees of temperature involved with these fires.
There's a chemical reaction that occurs. Which produces potentially deadly gas.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:48 am to MRTigerFan
quote:
Why would anyone think they need to desalinate water before using it to fight a fire?
Gotta go build a desaliation plant, BRB. Posted on 1/10/25 at 9:54 am to KiwiHead
quote:
So you end up creating more of a tinderbox later because the salt will dry out the vegetation that much more...and faster? So you set the conditions for the next wildfire?
You know some tanker aircraft were watering up in the Pacific?
Posted on 1/10/25 at 10:03 am to Wolfwireless
quote:
Soil salinity please take a minute to look it up.
The environmentalist groups would sue the hell out of them.
So would all those wealthy fricks on the coast, when the yards on those million dollar homes never grow back.
Salting of roads in winter is still common practice. And this is with pure salt, not ocean water, which is about 3.5 percent saline.
And these are ocean-side communities. We aren't talking about Kansas farmland.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 10:11 am to Bjorn Cyborg
Don't know why everyone is roasting/downvoting this guy.
No, saltwater isn't great for soil, but neither is a metric shitton of ash, which raises the alkalinity of said soil. This is to say nothing of the toxins from cars/buildings and whatever is in that fire-retardant foam they're dropping from planes.
My folks live on the coast in GA, and every so often a king tide will push saltwater into their yard (house is raised for this reason). It recovers just fine, as eventually the salt is flushed back into the marsh. And when I say
"recovers," I mean Southern Living worthy because mom is a retired landscaper.
Coastal areas experience a lot of saltwater corrosion just from dew/fog/mist/general salt air, etc., and everyone *should* take this into consideration when choosing everything from landscaping to deck screws. If it's my house in Cali? Drench it in whatever water you have. I'll take the chance that my pool furniture *might* corrode a little faster as a result.
But the larger issue is that California's gonna California. I don't know what they're teaching in the forestry/ag schools out there, but it damned sure isn't sustainable resource management on any level. That's why they've created a literal tinderbox with no means to extinguish it. Forests are gonna burn, and a good land manager realizes that it's always better to do it on your terms.
ETA: yes, the danger of Hydrogen Chloride gas exists, which is why saltwater is only used to fight fires as a last resort. Does this not qualify? Do firefighters not have respirators already?
See: any fire suppression system on a ocean-going vessel.
No, saltwater isn't great for soil, but neither is a metric shitton of ash, which raises the alkalinity of said soil. This is to say nothing of the toxins from cars/buildings and whatever is in that fire-retardant foam they're dropping from planes.
My folks live on the coast in GA, and every so often a king tide will push saltwater into their yard (house is raised for this reason). It recovers just fine, as eventually the salt is flushed back into the marsh. And when I say
"recovers," I mean Southern Living worthy because mom is a retired landscaper.
Coastal areas experience a lot of saltwater corrosion just from dew/fog/mist/general salt air, etc., and everyone *should* take this into consideration when choosing everything from landscaping to deck screws. If it's my house in Cali? Drench it in whatever water you have. I'll take the chance that my pool furniture *might* corrode a little faster as a result.
But the larger issue is that California's gonna California. I don't know what they're teaching in the forestry/ag schools out there, but it damned sure isn't sustainable resource management on any level. That's why they've created a literal tinderbox with no means to extinguish it. Forests are gonna burn, and a good land manager realizes that it's always better to do it on your terms.
ETA: yes, the danger of Hydrogen Chloride gas exists, which is why saltwater is only used to fight fires as a last resort. Does this not qualify? Do firefighters not have respirators already?
See: any fire suppression system on a ocean-going vessel.
This post was edited on 1/10/25 at 10:28 am
Posted on 1/10/25 at 10:12 am to Wolfwireless
quote:
The biggest reason why they can't do it, is because of the danger of Hydrogen Chloride Gas.
OK then, that is the risk to compare.
Do that calculus and see what the answer is. I don't know.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 10:12 am to Bjorn Cyborg
Apologies, I was being facetious in that post.
Thought it would stand out when I mentioned the rich people's yards. But ok.
I posted back a few posts, about the real reasons why they can't do it. It's because of the chemical reactions that occur when salt water is gassified under extreme heat.
Thought it would stand out when I mentioned the rich people's yards. But ok.
I posted back a few posts, about the real reasons why they can't do it. It's because of the chemical reactions that occur when salt water is gassified under extreme heat.
Posted on 1/10/25 at 10:14 am to KiwiHead
quote:
So you end up creating more of a tinderbox later
I'm pretty sure theyre more concerned about the fire burning right now.
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