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Started By
Message
re: US Senate defeats bill banning late-term abortion
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:08 pm to roadGator
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:08 pm to roadGator
quote:
The passage you referenced isn't even about abortion. It's about accidental damage to a mother with child and that child.
It's about causing a miscarriage, but then not treating that as murder.
quote:
What do you think Jesus thinks about abortion then? Why didn't he mention it specifically? He didn't mention lots of things that are wrong specifically.
Personally, I think if he had been asked, Jesus would likely have equated abortion as wrong. If I am being honest though, I would imagine that he would have not equated being raped as a reason to marry a person. That's why he stated that the Old Testament was to be replaced with the new Covenant; the only things he stated that were important to carry over were the 10 Commandments. We no longer live under the Mosaic Covenant, so what applies is what Jesus touches upon.
My point is that people want to use the whole Bible to equate these actions, but the Bible only ever mentions the fate of an unborn child in this manner once. The Bible isn't what you should read into, but what Jesus stated.
Jesus love thy Neighbor as you would love thyself. That is the prime requisite for all of the actions you are to take as a Christian. Everything else, anything else not said by Christ is secondary. This is my problem with modern interpretations - the implication that letters written by Paul to some churches carry the same weight as the literal Word of God. Because the early church decided they were more deserving to be in the Bible than other letters.
Paul teaches some good things, but his letters form a greater basis of political Christianity than Jesus' do.
I'm not an atheist. I've studied the Bible a good bit over my years as a Christian, and always wondered why politicians like to talk about the things that Paul said were more important, but I digress.
I think Jesus wouldn't tell a person "you're evil for thinking this". I think Jesus would look at the person asking for the abortion and ask, "Why do you wish to do this?"
My mother worked as a rape counselor. She saw first hand what being forced to deliver the child of a rapist can do. She met 14 year old girls forced to carry to term the child of their uncles who forced themselves upon them. That's why she was pro-choice - not because she felt the child's life was "worthless", but because she saw the horrific things that such an act can do to a person. To strip away even the choice from the woman was to condemn them. Perhaps in the future we shall find a way for the woman to not have to carry the child of a rapist, but until that time...
The main issue most people have with me is that I don't see the world in black and white.
2
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:09 pm to skrayper
I believe Jesus would consider abortion a sin but still love the sinner and forgive that sinner if she repented.
That's pretty black and white, no?
Right. Because it wouldn't be considered murder. The mother wasn't the target it was an accident due to a physical dispute. Man-slaughter if you will but I hate to use modern legal terms in this context.
The translation includes punishment. So if there is punishment then there is a wrong.
That's pretty black and white, no?
quote:
It's about causing a miscarriage, but then not treating that as murder.
Right. Because it wouldn't be considered murder. The mother wasn't the target it was an accident due to a physical dispute. Man-slaughter if you will but I hate to use modern legal terms in this context.
The translation includes punishment. So if there is punishment then there is a wrong.
This post was edited on 1/30/18 at 12:13 pm
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:12 pm to VOR
quote:
VOR
Go frick yourself
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:13 pm to djmicrobe
quote:
US Senate defeats bill banning late-term abortion
Good. Leave it the frick alone.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:16 pm to djmicrobe
So in the bill was exceptions for health of the mother, incest, and rape.
Was there any language about fetal abnormalities? That is a key question.
If so...then dems are blocking simply to avoid the inevitable comparisons of 20 weeks to 10 weeks. They don't want to give an inch on this issue sadly. Numbers wise convienience abortions at this stage probably are very few relative to others but the impact of how this looks for abortion activists is what they are concerned about. From where I sit saving a few lives is worth it no matter how few.
However if there was nothing in the bill about abnormalities then I think the vote is going to always be split like it was.
Yes I agree a life is a life even with abnormalities at 20 weeks and those things change...but some will find the law without that exception as impractical. Moral or not.
7 countries that allow this on the planet and within some of those countries there are jurisdictions that don't allow it. Also some countries of these 7 allow it but cut it off at 24 weeks. Wow. Super rare policy.
I would hope that at some point we at least ban elective convieniece (no health issues mom or baby) abortions after 20 weeks nationally. This may be a small number but it would certainly be the right thing to do.
Was there any language about fetal abnormalities? That is a key question.
If so...then dems are blocking simply to avoid the inevitable comparisons of 20 weeks to 10 weeks. They don't want to give an inch on this issue sadly. Numbers wise convienience abortions at this stage probably are very few relative to others but the impact of how this looks for abortion activists is what they are concerned about. From where I sit saving a few lives is worth it no matter how few.
However if there was nothing in the bill about abnormalities then I think the vote is going to always be split like it was.
Yes I agree a life is a life even with abnormalities at 20 weeks and those things change...but some will find the law without that exception as impractical. Moral or not.
7 countries that allow this on the planet and within some of those countries there are jurisdictions that don't allow it. Also some countries of these 7 allow it but cut it off at 24 weeks. Wow. Super rare policy.
I would hope that at some point we at least ban elective convieniece (no health issues mom or baby) abortions after 20 weeks nationally. This may be a small number but it would certainly be the right thing to do.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:18 pm to djmicrobe
I'm on board with a lot of the conservative agenda, but abortion just isn't one of them. I personally thing abortion is a good thing in nearly every case. The few cases such as rape are obvious why. Most cases is just results in one less person that we the taxpayers have to take care of. As long as it complies with current SCOTUS precedent (pre-viability for elective abortions), I have no problem with it.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:22 pm to skrayper
quote:
why he stated that the Old Testament was to be replaced with the new Covenant;
He never said it was to be replaced. He said in Him it was fulfilled. I wish some of you would learn more about before discussing it like you know it.
quote:
Everything else, anything else not said by Christ is secondary.
And once again, In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Jesus spoke it from the beginning of Genesis to the very last word in Revelation.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:29 pm to crazyatthecamp
quote:
Was there any language about fetal abnormalities? That is a key question.
This board thinks fetal abnormalities are a gift from god and that mothers should be thankful to carry to term and deliver a dead on arrival baby because it is a blessing after all. Then they should have a proper funeral for that blessing. God works in mysterious ways and such. The doctors are probably wrong anyways plus chances are by the power of prayer you can pray away the deformity
This post was edited on 1/30/18 at 12:34 pm
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:36 pm to gamatt53
NO this board does not think this and stop being an arse hat.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:38 pm to gamatt53
quote:
God works in mysterious ways and such. The doctors are probably wrong and aferall...you can just pray diformity away.
Juvenile statements are juvenile. Why don't you grow a pair and be a man? Or are you trans? By the way you whine I would expect you may have a feminine side trying to come out.
Anyway, my pastor and his wife take care of their grand daughter (which was deformed from birth and in a wheelchair). The doctors didn't expect her to live past 9 yrs old and she turned 17 this past weekend. Watching them take care of her truly shows what the Love of God actually looks like.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:43 pm to Lg
I've always found it fascinating that scientists could find evidence of single celled organizations on other planets and people everywhere could rejoice, yelling "we found life!", yet kill off a human being in the womb and say it wasn't alive.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:46 pm to Jake88
Very Disappointing, just you think you may be gaining ground, reality sets in
Posted on 1/30/18 at 12:47 pm to Lg
quote:
Anyway, my pastor and his wife take care of their grand daughter (which was deformed from birth and in a wheelchair). The doctors didn't expect her to live past 9 yrs old and she turned 17 this past weekend. Watching them take care of her truly shows what the Love of God actually looks like
Sounds like they made a choice that worked for them. Many others would choose to listen to the advice of their doctors.
quote:
Juvenile statements are juvenile
How the frick are you going to unironically follow that up with
quote:
Why don't you grow a pair and be a man? Or are you trans?
Idiot
This post was edited on 1/30/18 at 12:50 pm
Posted on 1/30/18 at 1:29 pm to Foch
quote:
Ahhhh, the slippery slope of “abortion is terrible, but being born in X condition (downs/crippled/poverty/lowIQ) is horrible”.
I don't think you have any sense of the abnormalities I'm referencing if you think "downs/crippled/poverty" is what I'm talking about. Those would be awesome outcomes, relatively speaking.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 1:30 pm to Mulat
quote:
Very Disappointing, just you think you may be gaining ground, reality sets in
We live in an evil world.
Posted on 1/30/18 at 1:30 pm to gamatt53
quote:
This board thinks fetal abnormalities are a gift from god
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