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Started By
Message
re: TRUMP's wall and migration of animal species.
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:28 pm to bmy
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:28 pm to bmy
quote:
Well, technically, it's not evolution. It would be humans selecting species for extinction. That's okay if there are some valuable benefits that are worth the cost. Just not sure it is.
Yeah...no. We (humans) are part of nature. If others species cannot compete, they're reached the end of their evolutionary potential. That said, there is no evidence that a barrier would lead to the extinction of any species. It's an Appeal to Emotions fallacy.
2
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:28 pm to HuRRiCaNe MiLeS
They will just have to migrate higher. Simple, really.
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:29 pm to HuRRiCaNe MiLeS
They don't mind when their wind farms and solar mirror farms kill thousands of birds.
Plus, they love abortions.
Plus, they love abortions.
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:29 pm to bmy
quote:wait. . .what?
Well, technically, it's not evolution.
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:30 pm to Zach
quote:
3. There is no research that says the Great Wall of China destroyed any migratory species. And that was a MUCH bigger wall than Trump's.
And the Great Wall of China works. They have almost no Mexicans.
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:30 pm to HuRRiCaNe MiLeS
quote:
Walls will disrupt the migration of animal species
Mainly Human Species
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:31 pm to FreedomBarefoot
They also have signs all thru the forests that show the way to the crossings too!
Posted on 1/26/17 at 2:34 pm to Dale51
quote:
. That said, there is no evidence that a barrier would lead to the extinction of any species.
Yea I'm pretty sure that there is no way it will cause the extinction of any species. At most it might sped up the extirpation of a couple of mammals from the US. Not really that big of a deal.
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:02 pm to nes2010
quote:
Find me one biologist who says they aren't native. They radiated to North America millions of years ago and are now native species. That's the way the science defines it. You can't just change what words mean like a leftist.
You keep asking me to do your work for you; maybe your the lefty in the thread.
OK
Armadillo Invasion: Warm-Weather Critters Expanding East
Fast-breeding mammal may move into D.C., New Jersey, experts predict.
By Brian Handwerk, for National Geographic News
PUBLISHED OCTOBER 8, 2011
"There are 20 known species of armadillo, but only one—the nine-banded armadillo—has ventured out of Latin America. The species arrived in Texas during the 1880s and has been spreading into new habitats ever since." (Note 1880s is NOT millions of years ago. What is your "scientific" statue of limitations for invasive species?)
"Like most invaders, armadillos are likely to have some impacts on their new habitats—and those effects are not always easy to foresee. The mammals are known to dig up insect larvae for food, and it's possible they will compete for such meals with resident animals such as skunks. Armadillos have also been known to raid the nests of various species and so could harm populations of ground-nesting birds such as quail. Anyone hoping to keep armadillo numbers down won't find it an easy task—the animals are difficult to trap, and natural predators are rare in the armadillo's new range, McDonough added." (Notice the words invaders and impacts on their new habitats!)
I would like you to explain how and/or when a new species in a habitat transition into a native species. And, is the difference between an introduced species being "native" a function of how it is introduced? Example: by swimming across the Mississippi River or crossing a bridge in the back of a pickup. If you swim you naturally radiated and are now a native species, but man introduces you and you are an invasive species?
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:05 pm to Dale51
quote:
Yeah...no. We (humans) are part of nature. If others species cannot compete, they're reached the end of their evolutionary potential. That said, there is no evidence that a barrier would lead to the extinction of any species. It's an Appeal to Emotions fallacy.
Again -- that isn't evolution. A sudden change in an ecosystem (volcanic eruption, barrier creation, etc) can be a stressor and the driver of evolution. When stressors reduce a species fitness to the point that reproduction stops then extinction occurs.
It would be accurate to call it selection.. but if a gamma-ray burst wiped all life from Earth it certainly wouldn't be considered evolution. This is no different. Evolution is a slow process and extinction can be absurdly fast.
Besides all of that.. I see no reason it couldnt be managed well enough and the wall could be opened seasonally and those openings staffed by border patrol agents, scientists studying, etc.
This post was edited on 1/26/17 at 3:07 pm
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:16 pm to Gaspergou202
quote:
f you swim you naturally radiated and are now a native species, but man introduces you and you are an invasive species?
What about this doesn't make sense?
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:26 pm to bmy
quote:
What about this doesn't make sense?
Nothing, as long as one realizes that these are arbitrary definitions created by a few to influence the many.
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:32 pm to bmy
quote:
to the point that reproduction stops then extinction occurs.
We aren't going to round up the males and females and segregate them to one side of the damn wall by gender. The animals will be fine. They are not migratory animals that have to move to survive. It's not like they have food on one side and not the other or water on one side and not the other. This is nothing but an over-reaction.
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:34 pm to Gaspergou202
quote:
Nothing, as long as one realizes that these are arbitrary definitions created by a few to influence the many
Aren't all regulations and laws like this?
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:35 pm to Puck82
quote:
We aren't going to round up the males and females and segregate them to one side of the damn wall by gender. The animals will be fine. They are not migratory animals that have to move to survive. It's not like they have food on one side and not the other or water on one side and not the other. This is nothing but an over-reaction
Why do you think animals migrate?
This post was edited on 1/26/17 at 3:36 pm
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:40 pm to bmy
quote:
They are not migratory animals
White tail, the cats listed, etc.. none are migratory animals.
Please list the migratory animals that will be impacted.
This post was edited on 1/26/17 at 3:42 pm
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:50 pm to Puck82
quote:
White tail, the cats listed, etc.. none are migratory animals.
Please list the migratory animals that will be impacted
How about we talk about the species that regularly cross the border first.
Black bears and Mexican bears interbreed. Jaguars are toast if they can't breed on both sides of that wall.
Take a look at the Australian dingo fence from the 50s.. great example of unintended consequences
This post was edited on 1/26/17 at 3:52 pm
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:52 pm to Puck82
quote:
Please list the migratory animals that will be impacted.
migration doesn't have to be seasonally
it is as simple as moving from here to there
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:54 pm to td01241
Exactly what great migration takes place with which species of animal each year am I missing between Mexico and the U.S.?
Posted on 1/26/17 at 3:57 pm to Salmon
quote:
migration doesn't have to be seasonally it is as simple as moving from here to there
Actually, when referring to animals, migration is the mass movement of a species to another area. Not the wonderings of a few individuals.
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