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Message
1
Posted on 5/25/20 at 12:40 pm to TigerBandTuba
quote:
quote:
Isn't this story taught in like primary school, then again in middle school then again in high school?
Not anymore.
He's white and a man.
The flag represents a racist nation.
^^^^that's what they are taught
Posted on 5/25/20 at 12:43 pm to trinidadtiger
quote:
In defense of the OP, maybe he is not an old fart like some of us that actually said the pledge each morning before school started and listened to the national anthem.
We all know the song. Few of us knew the backstory in any detail (including most of the posters who now claim they knew it all along)
Posted on 5/25/20 at 12:49 pm to Buckeye Jeaux
quote:
We were taught a vague and lifeless 3-minute history lesson. No details of 30 British warships bombarding Ft McHenry for 25 straight hours. Or that Key was a prisoner on the deck of a British warship... watching to see if his nation suffered a catastrophic defeat.
You knew all this? I doubt it.
We literally covered this exact story in detail in public school history multiple times, yes. I didn't know this was Hidden American Lore.
This post was edited on 5/25/20 at 3:07 pm
Posted on 5/25/20 at 12:52 pm to trinidadtiger
quote:
maybe he is not an old fart like some of us that actually said the pledge each morning before school started and listened to the national anthem.
I'm still perplexed at what world y'all think that the pledge is not still said every morning. I'm a "millennial" and we said the pledge every morning, hand on heart, during the morning address. I have younger step-sisters in public school right now and they still do it, too.
I swear y'all get riled up at the most made up things. I'm assuming maybe a school or two stopped doing the pledge somewhere in the country and you immediately assumed that every school is doing this and it's the downfall of society.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 12:53 pm to Buckeye Jeaux
quote:
We were taught a vague and lifeless 3-minute history lesson. No details of 30 British warships bombarding Ft McHenry for 25 straight hours. Or that Key was a prisoner on the deck of a British warship... watching to see if his nation suffered a catastrophic defeat.
You knew all this? I doubt it.
That's sad that our history is so poorly taught. Key was not a prisoner in the normal sense of the word. He had gone to the British to negotiate the swap of prisoners and dined with Admiral Cochrane as a guest. Having seen the strength of the British forces, Cochrane detained him until their assault on Baltimore was over.
The song talks about the bombardment, but there was also a land attack on Baltimore. The Americans eventually retreated from their original position, but they had inflicted so many casualties that the British withdrew and the two pronged attack on Baltimore failed.
In a war in which American victories were few, the defense of Baltimore was a victory, as were the campaigns in the south, in Alabama and New Orleans.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 1:22 pm to SpotCheckBilly
quote:
Cochrane detained him until their assault on Baltimore was over.
Call him a 'detainee' if you like. He wasn't getting off that ship if the British won the Battle of Baltimore.
He was an enemy leader. He was toast if the British won.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 1:25 pm to Microtiger
quote:
Isn't this story taught in like primary school, then again in middle school, then again in high school? What was your context for the song before this/what did you think it meant?
It's being taught as a symbol of racism and oppression.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 1:33 pm to trinidadtiger
quote:
I once listened to a fella tell me about a program he had heard on NPR and asked me if I knew Jews were tortured during WW2 at concentration camps.
He was a product of the public school system of New Orleans.
I’m guessing he wasn’t the leader of the country. I expect my president to have a little more knowledge of history than the average guy in line at the DMV.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 2:24 pm to HailHailtoMichigan!
quote:
musical critics both in and outside the US
Translated: people who have music degrees but even Starbucks wouldn't hire them.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 2:56 pm to Quidam65
Show me a professional "music critic" and I'll show you a failed musician.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 2:59 pm to Buckeye Jeaux
quote:
Or that Key was a prisoner on the deck of a British warship... watching to see if his nation suffered a catastrophic defeat.
I’ll listen to this tribute if someone tells me that the President said he preferred that the songwriter not have been a prisoner of war ....
Posted on 5/25/20 at 3:06 pm to LSUTIGER in TEXAS
quote:
Even as trump shares a story about this great country’s history, ORANGE MAN BAD!
Even as I was asking the OP how he possibly wasn't aware of the story behind the great Star Spangled Banner, a snowflake got offended and thought I was criticizing Trump. Yikes
Posted on 5/25/20 at 3:11 pm to Buckeye Jeaux
quote:
Thank you for posting that. Well worth watching.
The Admiral came and said, "Your people are insane. What's the matter with them?" He said, "Don't they understand this is an impossible situation?"
France Scott Key said he remembered what George Washington had said, "The thing that separates the American Christian apart from all other people in the world is he will die on his feet before he will live on his knees."
Posted on 5/25/20 at 3:18 pm to viceman
quote:
The thing that separates the American Christian apart from all other people in the world is he will die on his feet before he will live on his knees."
And yet there have been thousands of American Christian POWs. I love America and feel truly blessed to live here, but this kind of stuff is, and has always been nonsense. In the most rudimentary telling of this story, Key himself was a prisoner when he wrote the poem.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 3:27 pm to Steadmans Cheddar
quote:
Key himself was a prisoner when he wrote the poem.
Key was a Baltimore lawyer, sent there to negotiate a prisoner exchange by the US government. Of which he did agree with Cochrane a prisoner for prisoner release. Key was not in chains like the other prisoners. He was the one the guys below the decks who kept asking if the flag is still there because he could see from up top. And the flag was held up by American patriots who literally just died holding the flag up.And as more bombs hit, and more Americans died, more would come in to hold the flag up. They all knew all they had to do was remove the flag and the bombardment would stop, but they chose death. And you are questioning the validity of Washington's statement.
This post was edited on 5/25/20 at 3:32 pm
Posted on 5/25/20 at 3:29 pm to Buckeye Jeaux
quote:
Call him a 'detainee' if you like. He wasn't getting off that ship if the British won the Battle of Baltimore. He was an enemy leader. He was toast if the British won.
Pretty common to do prison exchanges in that time period and he was not a military leader. He was always going to be let go once Cochrane was satisfied that he could no longer be of benefit to Baltimore's defenses.
Key led a pretty interesting life and was involved in many other noteworthy events, like the Burr trial, the Petticoat affair, and prosecuting the first attempted presidential assassination.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 3:32 pm to Buckeye Jeaux
quote:
The Star Spangled Banner was written by Francis Scott Key in remembrance of the hell of war he witnessed while he was a prisoner on the deck of a British ship in Baltimore harbor. He watched 30 British warships make a merciless bomb, cannon and rocket attack on Fort McHenry - for 25 straight hours. When the smoke and fog cleared at dawn, he could make out the stars and stripes, battered, but still flying over Fort McHenry.
I'll never hear that anthem in the same way again.
Apologies for you not making it out of elementary school.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 4:42 pm to viceman
quote:
Key was not in chains like the other prisoners.
If there were prisoners other than Key, what are you calling Key?
You’re leaving out the part where I referred to the very rudimentary story, but it doesn’t negate my larger point. A significant number of Americans have, and always will surrender when faced with imminent death. In recent history, Japan would probably have the better claim to fighting till death in the face of abject defeat.
These kinds of claims that ascribe heroism only to those who don’t surrender is disrespectful to the thousands of American POWs.
Posted on 5/25/20 at 4:56 pm to viceman
quote:Did the British Admiral know that the British fleet was in the Chesapeake? Soon to obliterate Ft McHenry? Of course he did.
Key was a Baltimore lawyer, sent there to negotiate a prisoner exchange by the US government. Of which he did agree with Cochrane a prisoner for prisoner release.
Once the battle of Baltimore was won (which that Admiral believed to be a certainty, the British would dictate the terms of prisoner releases. Key was at the very least, a detainee on that ship. He was not free to leave.
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