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Started By
Message
re: Trump Signals that Dreamers can stay, will work something out for some illegals
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:19 am to flyAU
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:19 am to flyAU
quote:
But he is Hitler. Liberals have said it over and over. Are you implying that majority of liberals and those that are far right aren't able to have critical thinking and realize how to understand what he says? I have known this for a long time.
I have no idea. I'm neither a Liberal nor Far Right. But, yes, I think that everyone latched onto what he was saying. He was manipulating the crowds for his benefit.
I opposed him because I think that his a fundamentally dishonest thing to do. And, I opposed him because I didn't know if he would be bound to what he said and use it to do other things. Basically, I do not trust him.
But, this is a good move. I'm for it. If he does good things, he'll have my support. I'm not "anti-Trump" just for the sake of it.
3
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:19 am to AlaTiger
quote:
Glad to see Trump coming around to a common sense, humane position
If you were listening he's been saying this all along.
Again for the millionth (okay maybe the 30th) time on this board since Trump announced, Trump will proposes some sort of "touchback immigration" plan for "good" illegals already here.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:21 am to AlaTiger
quote:
Which is what I was advocating for the other day and you were disagreeing with me over and over again.
I forgot which thread we disagreed about in. Do you have a link? I'd like to see how inconsistent I am.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:21 am to AlaTiger
quote:
I'm neither a Liberal nor Far Right.
Sure
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:23 am to AlaTiger
quote:
Of course he lied. He was lying the whole time. I didn't know for sure he was lying because, well, why should I not take him at his word? I disagreed with him very much on this and other issues.
It's sort of like gay advocates knew that Obama was lying about opposing gay marriage.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:23 am to GumboPot
quote:
If you were listening he's been saying this all along.
Again for the millionth (okay maybe the 30th) time on this board since Trump announced, Trump will proposes some sort of "touchback immigration" plan for "good" illegals already here.
I was listening. He said, "they all have to go."
Over and over and over again.
Then, he would say something different. He'd say different things to different groups. But, he'd go back to "they all have to go."
I heard him.
But, deporting them all was impossible. I knew that. I said that. I got down voted into oblivion here. So many here believe he would deport them all. I even wrote that he would have them go to their home embassy/consulate, register, and then get in line while staying here. That is the only "touchback" amnesty you're going to get. And, I'm fine with it.
But, there was no way of knowing that during the election. If he had been clear, he would have gotten my vote and the vote of many others. But, he would have lost the vote of the Far Right, which he deemed more important. It was a gamble. He won. I'm willing to play along.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:24 am to AlaTiger
I am foreseeing him reaching out a hand while cracking down on the border. This could be the worst news for the liberals. Latino's are hard workers and will gladly back a party that not only set's a legal path for them but also provides a vigorous business environment for them to thrive in. That is the opposite of the Dem party which looks to do by providing for people. If the Republicans can walk this tightrope, they will win election after election because of Latino's going republican.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:26 am to Old Sarge
quote:
Sure
Well, I'm not. I've never voted for a Democrat and have no plan to unless they radically change on just about all of their policy positions.
I've been a Conservative my whole life. Just because I don't support Trump on immigration and some economic issues doesn't make me a Liberal. You're spectrum is way too narrow.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:27 am to flyAU
quote:
I am foreseeing him reaching out a hand while cracking down on the border. This could be the worst news for the liberals. Latino's are hard workers and will gladly back a party that not only set's a legal path for them but also provides a vigorous business environment for them to thrive in. That is the opposite of the Dem party which looks to do by providing for people. If the Republicans can walk this tightrope, they will win election after election because of Latino's going republican.
This is what I've been calling for for years and is a CONSERVATIVE position. It is what is good for America and it would be very good for the GOP. I'm all for it.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:27 am to AlaTiger
When Trump speaks, LISTEN. 
This is what he said:
Here it comes...wait for it...
That is a form of "touchback immigraton".
LINK
FWIW he was saying this well before November 17, 2015 when this article was published.
This is what he said:
quote:
Trump’s supporters loved his promise last week to create a “deportation force” to remove all 11 million illegal immigrants living in America, and his repeated declaration that everyone here illegally will “have to go.”
Here it comes...wait for it...
quote:
But his supporters tend to overlook his other promise—repeated in the Fox Business debate in Milwaukee on November 10—that under his immigration plan “they will come back.”
That is a form of "touchback immigraton".
LINK
FWIW he was saying this well before November 17, 2015 when this article was published.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:28 am to roadGator
quote:
I forgot which thread we disagreed about in. Do you have a link? I'd like to see how inconsistent I am.
It was the DACA thread where we went round and round on whether or not we should deport ALL illegals. I made a case for the children brought here at a young age without their consent.
I don't feel like searching. It's all good.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:30 am to AlaTiger
No worries. I remember now.
I think we ended up agreeing anyway.
I think we ended up agreeing anyway.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:30 am to AlaTiger
I wrote this back in February:
LINK
quote:
In the 2006 congress a bill called Touch Back immigration that almost passed the senate with 56 votes. 56 is not enough to meet the cloture threshold of 60 so the bill died on the senate floor. I think the bill died because the Democrats did not want the Republicans to get the credit in the Latino community for solving this problem.
So what is touchback immigration?
Touchback immigration is a process where illegal immigrants go to their consulates and receive visas and make themselves legal.
Now ask yourself what illegal immigrants would voluntarily do this? The answer is, the good ones. The people we want.
So it's a natural good from bad culling process. As ICE checks stautus they will deport the illegal immigrants that have not voluntarily and overtly acquired legal status and the "good" illegal immigrants that get deported will be able to acquire legal status if they desire. However the "bad" illegal immigrants will be barred from the US.
It is estimated 80-90% of the illegal immigrants will self deport and acquire legal status voluntarily and border control can focus their efforts on the "bad" illegal immigrants.
See how that works?
This is a good and fair plan, IMO.
Now if you listen closely and through innuendo this is Trump's plan (plus the border wall). It's political season and Trump would lose a good number of voters if he explained his plan as I just did. He has to sound tough because he understands that winning the presidency in the TV age is more about optics than anything else.
LINK
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:32 am to GumboPot
quote:
But his supporters tend to overlook his other promise—repeated in the Fox Business debate in Milwaukee on November 10—that under his immigration plan “they will come back.”
He said they will have to go and "get to the back of the line" and then come back the legal way. I heard him.
The problem is that unless there are allowances made, "coming back" takes 15-20 years because in many countries there is no line. There is no legal way to come here that is remotely possible. Getting to the back of the line essentially means you will not be able to get back in.
People heard him, understand our immigration situation, and knew that meant deportation and basically no return.
Now, if he let's them stay and "touchback" at an embassy or something, that is different. But, taking a kid brought here at 3 years old and sending them back and making them get to the back of the line is deportation and no one will see them for 15-20 years again. That is what people opposed and that is what it would have meant if you take into account the actual immigration system we have.
What he said today is totally different from that reality.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:36 am to GumboPot
quote:
Now if you listen closely and through innuendo this is Trump's plan (plus the border wall). It's political season and Trump would lose a good number of voters if he explained his plan as I just did. He has to sound tough because he understands that winning the presidency in the TV age is more about optics than anything else.
Yeah. I know. But, he didn't articulate how it would work. You did. I agreed with you - not sure if it was in that post, but I remember saying the same. But, that is not what he ran on, although anyone with half a brain would know that that was the only possible solution.
I'm not disagreeing with you that this is probably what he was going to do. But, with him pandering to the Far Right the whole time, all any of us had was speculation. I don't vote for that. So, he didn't earn my vote. Of course, Hillary didn't either.
But, I'm happy to support him now if this is what he does. Good for him.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:37 am to roadGator
quote:
Why can't you just enforce the law as written as the ability presents itself?
Cheap labor pool
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:39 am to flyAU
quote:
I am foreseeing him reaching out a hand while cracking down on the border. This could be the worst news for the liberals. Latino's are hard workers and will gladly back a party that not only set's a legal path for them but also provides a vigorous business environment for them to thrive in. That is the opposite of the Dem party which looks to do by providing for people. If the Republicans can walk this tightrope, they will win election after election because of Latino's going republican.
I agree with this. Latinos (and Asians) will also naturally assimilate with "white culture" if the SJWs keep up their BLM bull shite. The only way Democrats can keep Latino's voting Democrat is keeping the rate of illegal immigration constant or increasing. If Trump puts a dent in illegal immigration the Republicans can win over Latinos. It's a natural fit.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:40 am to Lakeboy7
quote:
Why can't you just enforce the law as written as the ability presents itself? Cheap labor pool
Right. But as that person is caught doing something illegal the law should be applied to him or her. Right? That's essentially looking the other way and not hunting them down in droves with a massive deportation force.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:41 am to AlaTiger
All you are doing is further proving the point made about Trump.
Yea, I'm sure there are some whackos who supported Trump and took him literally in regards to deportation. But here is the big SHOCKER, not all of us actually thought that was going to happen. Instead what we expected he meant was securing the border so that the criminal illegals who we have been deporting, can't walk back into the country the next day as easily as buying a bus ticket.
quote:
The press took Republican Donald Trump “literally, but not seriously,” she wrote, whereas Trump’s supporters took him “seriously, but not literally.”
Yea, I'm sure there are some whackos who supported Trump and took him literally in regards to deportation. But here is the big SHOCKER, not all of us actually thought that was going to happen. Instead what we expected he meant was securing the border so that the criminal illegals who we have been deporting, can't walk back into the country the next day as easily as buying a bus ticket.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 10:45 am to roadGator
quote:
But as that person is caught doing something illegal the law should be applied to him or her. Right?
I still have firends in the criminal courts and from what they tell me its a funding issue. Nobody wants to house them locally, the feds may or may not come get them and if its something minor like a traffic violation they cite them and cut them loose. The municipality has no jail cost and the Mexican is more than happy to pay the fine and cost.
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