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re: .
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:23 pm to tigergirl10
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:23 pm to tigergirl10
quote:
You should spend more being grateful that you’re healthy, have a nice, safe place to live, have food, access to decent medical care, can buy whatever you need, and a ton of money in your bank account. There are A LOT of good, hard working, tax paying people of all incomes who aren’t so lucky.
I am grateful to the Lord for all he provides. He is truly the giver of all good things.
I am not grateful to you people who do nothing but complain and put targets on the backs of people who do better than some mean value.
0
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:23 pm to BarnHater
quote:
Maybe they should work harder and apply themselves so they can get better paying jobs.
The ol "just pull yourself up by your bootstraps and work harder you stupid poor" argument.
You guys are so predictable.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:25 pm to jclem11
quote:
The ol "just pull yourself up by your bootstraps and work harder you stupid poor" argument.
List the ways I’m smarter than you or was given more opportunity. Seriously. Build a list and we can run through them. It’s hogwash crap. In America, you choose your limits.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:25 pm to DiamondDog
quote:
It’s not easy carrying America on our backs
Carry on my wayward son
For there'll be peace when you are done
Lay your weary head to rest
Don't you cry no more
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:31 pm to DiamondDog
quote:
It’s hogwash crap. In America, you choose your limits.
That's not completely true but you have made up your mind and won't accept any evidence provided.
Do you own research hero.
quote:
u or was given more opportunity.
You likely were given some advantages or had some luck along the way but you just do not acknowledge them.
It feels better to think it was all muh hard work and not some things you didn't chose that contributed to your material success.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:32 pm to jclem11
quote:
had some luck along the way
So just making up BS now. Okay. Great. This thread can die now. We’ve reached its conclusion.
“People who do better than me are lucky and deserve to pay more in taxes because they are lucky.”
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:35 pm to Taxing Authority
(no message)
This post was edited on 2/22/24 at 12:05 pm
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:36 pm to DiamondDog
I think multiple things can be true:
1) High wage earners are the most screwed tax tier in this country. They get high taxes, few breaks and they typically don't have the generational wealth or tax avoidance options of those above them.
2) The country shut down certain industries and specifically screwed specific types of workers by no real fault of their own, and if that's the route we're going, we all bear some of that burden.
I don't, however, just support giving COVID benefits based on income level alone.
1) High wage earners are the most screwed tax tier in this country. They get high taxes, few breaks and they typically don't have the generational wealth or tax avoidance options of those above them.
2) The country shut down certain industries and specifically screwed specific types of workers by no real fault of their own, and if that's the route we're going, we all bear some of that burden.
I don't, however, just support giving COVID benefits based on income level alone.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:38 pm to DiamondDog
quote:
So just making up BS now. Okay. Great. This thread can die now. We’ve reached its conclusion.
“People who do better than me are lucky and deserve to pay more in taxes because they are lucky.”
Holy frick you are defensive. Why is it so hard to admit luck plays a part in success?
quote:
Consider some recent findings:
About half of the differences in income across people worldwide is explained by their country of residence and by the income distribution within that country,
Scientific impact is randomly distributed, with high productivity alone having a limited effect on the likelihood of high-impact work in a scientific career,
The chance of becoming a CEO is influenced by your name or month of birth,
The number of CEOs born in June and July is much smaller than the number of CEOs born in other months,
Those with last names earlier in the alphabet are more likely to receive tenure at top departments,
The display of middle initials increases positive evaluations of people's intellectual capacities and achievements,
People with easy to pronounce names are judged more positively than those with difficult-to-pronounce names,
Females with masculine sounding names are more successful in legal careers.
Please tell me how the above show choices made by individuals. These are all random things that individuals do not choose such as birth month or name and it has effects on their level of success in society.
Scientific American
Conclusion of the above article
quote:
However, talent was definitely not sufficient because the most talented individuals were rarely the most successful. In general, mediocre-but-lucky people were much more successful than more-talented-but-unlucky individuals. The most successful agents tended to be those who were only slightly above average in talent but with a lot of luck in their lives.
I eagerly await your response.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:40 pm to DiamondDog
OP, if you trade your brokerage account properly, you are turning earned income into capital gains via this strategy.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:43 pm to Fletch1985
quote:
Here you are wrong. OP said he has $2,500 in a brokerage account, $55,000 in a 401k, and $205,000 in student loans. No mortgage and I’ll assume he has $10,000 in a checking account. OP does not have enough capital to last a year with his net worth (no offense OP).
OP takes no offense because OP is not rich and has not made this level of money sustainably for any significant length of time. The entire point of this thread.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:51 pm to bod312
quote:
The middle pays more in overall taxes because of more people not because they pay a higher % of their income.
O.k., I may have whiffed on that chart, but it's still true that middle class people pay a higher % of their income. Like I said before, when you are taxed at the rates for regular income your rates are going to be the highest possible. The truly rich don't get the majority of their money from regular income. They get it from investments.
This is why the famous statement that Warren Buffet's tax rate is lower than his secretary's. Not because the tax code isn't progressive enough. Because his investment portfolio is a whole lot bigger than hers.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 1:59 pm to jclem11
quote:
Please tell me how the above show choices made by individuals.
I'll tell you. In order:
1. Outside the US is a different story. So far as I know, this discussion has been qualified to apply to the US several times now.
2. There are plenty of careers outside of science, such as the two I listed earlier. Choosing a career in science is a choice.
3. There are hundreds of ways to make that much money without being a CEO. Limiting yourself to that one career goal is a choice.
4. All one needs to do to change one's name is fill out a form. Choice.
5. Same.
6. Same.
7. Same.
That was easy. Any more questions?
Posted on 7/28/20 at 2:04 pm to wackatimesthree
quote:
I'll tell you. In order:
1. Outside the US is a different story. So far as I know, this discussion has been qualified to apply to the US several times now.
2. There are plenty of careers outside of science, such as the two I listed earlier. Choosing a career in science is a choice.
3. There are hundreds of ways to make that much money without being a CEO. Limiting yourself to that one career goal is a choice.
4. All one needs to do to change one's name is fill out a form. Choice.
5. Same.
6. Same.
7. Same.
That was easy. Any more questions?
You think this is a gotcha?
You are not really engaging with the article. You are falling back on choices but the article is specifically pointing out the effect things one does not choose such as name or birth month have on outcomes.
Reread the article again and it might sink in. There are so many smooth brains on this board it is frustrating.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 2:23 pm to wackatimesthree
quote:If you're referring to the chart I posted... that's income not taxes paid. What it's telling you is "the rich" (Jeff Bezos and the other famous anomolies) do NOT make most of the income. Most of the income in this country is made at much lower levels.
1. I don't know if you missed the IRS chart from before, but the middle class pays the most taxes.
What that chart is telling you is... "the rich" can't fund our government on their own. Take every $ over $1,000,000/yr and you can't even balance the budget.
Most of the taxes come from $75-500k/yr earners because... that's where the money is.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 2:26 pm to bod312
quote:The math that says if you're in the top 4% of all income earners you are, in fact, rich, even if Jeff Bezos has a billion dollars.
What math?
Posted on 7/28/20 at 2:32 pm to Steadmans Cheddar
quote:
Not jealous, just admitting that there are wide variances in perception of "upper class."
Thanks for proving my point. quote:That's kinda the point. Which illustrates why using the "income inequality" between Bill Gates and anyone is such a stupid comparison. That's already been noted in this thread. Thanks for playing.
That would mean that Bill Gates and someone making $75K per year are both "upper class."
Top 4% is still rich.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 2:35 pm to Fletch1985
quote:Not for the choice he has made. But that's his choices. Plenty of millionaires have the same cash flow issues. It doesn't mean they couldn't be more financially independent.
Here you are wrong. OP said he has $2,500 in a brokerage account, $55,000 in a 401k, and $205,000 in student loans. No mortgage and I’ll assume he has $10,000 in a checking account. OP does not have enough capital to last a year with his net worth (no offense OP).
What's funny is the OP feels "poor" because he has $205k in loans. Did he feel "rich" when he took the money?
This post was edited on 7/28/20 at 2:42 pm
Posted on 7/28/20 at 2:36 pm to jclem11
quote:
You think this is a gotcha?
I think you asked a question and I answered it accurately.
And I think it wasn't what you expected because like the vast, vast majority of people who haven't done this for yourself, you are very myopic and it doesn't even occur to you to do something like change your name to become more successful. Instead your conclusion is, "Damn, my name is hard to pronounce, I guess I'm a victim."
You didn't ask anyone to read the article, you listed bullet points and asked for responses to those. I did that.
There's a dullard around here alright, but it's not me.
Posted on 7/28/20 at 2:40 pm to wackatimesthree
quote:
but it's still true that middle class people pay a higher % of their income
Please provide evidence because I have not seen this to be true. It is a great talking point from certain people but in general the higher your overall income the higher % you pay in taxes. That does not mean there are not exceptions but they are exceptions and not the rule. I did provide some charts showing that the higher income earners pay more in taxes on a % basis.
quote:
This is why the famous statement that Warren Buffet's tax rate is lower than his secretary's. Not because the tax code isn't progressive enough. Because his investment portfolio is a whole lot bigger than hers.
We have all heard this quote as well but have not seen any official documentation to support. It could be accurate and this could be the exception or it could be hyperbole. It is also important to separate wealth from income. I suspect WB won't pay much in taxes for 2020 with all of the losses he is taking currently. In a normal year, WB would be in the 20% capital gains tax bracket. If his secretary has an effective tax rate of 20% or greater, he/she is very highly paid. It takes about $220K for a head of household only taking the standard deduction to have an effective federal tax rate of 20% (even higher total income if married).
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