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Started By
Message
re: “The Civil War settled it. Secession is unconstitutional.”
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:22 pm to baybeefeetz
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:22 pm to baybeefeetz
quote:
respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples
That is from the U.N. charter.
Obviously the notion that secession is illegal runs counter to the right of self-determination.
1
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:22 pm to baybeefeetz
quote:
Maybe banning guns would help the economy.
Care to elaborate?
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:22 pm to RollTide1987
Does anyone here actually believe that if, at the time the Constitution was to be ratified, the states were told they were entering into an irrevocable union, said document would have actually been ratified?
Debates like this show the base and rank hypocrisy of our political class. We have the nerve to preach to other countries for suppressing popular uprisings in their own country and attempt to lecture the world about freedom, yet if a state attempted to exercise popular sovereignty within its boundaries and leave the Union, our government would invade and likely drop a bomb on said state's most populous city.
Debates like this show the base and rank hypocrisy of our political class. We have the nerve to preach to other countries for suppressing popular uprisings in their own country and attempt to lecture the world about freedom, yet if a state attempted to exercise popular sovereignty within its boundaries and leave the Union, our government would invade and likely drop a bomb on said state's most populous city.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:25 pm to SCLibertarian
quote:
Does anyone here actually believe that if, at the time the Constitution was to be ratified, the states were told they were entering into an irrevocable union, said document would have actually been ratified?
Exactly. And I don’t give a shite about Texas v White. That was a bullshite decision.
What in the constitution makes it unlawful for a state to back out? I’ve read it. The answer is nothing.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:27 pm to TbirdSpur2010
quote:
You wanna rebel, you'd best not take an L.
If you strike a blow at the King, you had better kill him.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:27 pm to baybeefeetz
Funny thing though -- what is Unconstitutional today may not be so tomorrow. And, so what if something is technically legal or illegal? Is there some controlling case law that we can look to? If not, then, one guy's opinion WRT what's Constitutional is just one guy's opinion.
And who follows the law now, anyways? Hillary Clinton? No. The flood of illegal leaks from inside the White House? Nope. They aren't following the law. How about those illegal aliens who come here? They are being encouraged with Sanctuary Cities.
Let's just think of a group of Seceded States as "Sanctuary Country", free of the oppressive US Federal Government. That way the nascent nation-state can be left alone.
And who follows the law now, anyways? Hillary Clinton? No. The flood of illegal leaks from inside the White House? Nope. They aren't following the law. How about those illegal aliens who come here? They are being encouraged with Sanctuary Cities.
Let's just think of a group of Seceded States as "Sanctuary Country", free of the oppressive US Federal Government. That way the nascent nation-state can be left alone.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:28 pm to baybeefeetz
quote:
Exactly. And I don’t give a shite about Texas v White. That was a bullshite decision.
Oh, well in that case never mind
Some of you argue like my 4 year old
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:29 pm to TrueTiger
quote:
That is from the U.N. charter. Obviously the notion that secession is illegal runs counter to the right of self-determination.
Good point. The UN Charter itself seems to support the notion that secession is legal under International Law.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:29 pm to SCLibertarian
quote:
Does anyone here actually believe that if, at the time the Constitution was to be ratified, the states were told they were entering into an irrevocable union, said document would have actually been ratified?
Debates like this show the base and rank hypocrisy of our political class. We have the nerve to preach to other countries for suppressing popular uprisings in their own country and attempt to lecture the world about freedom, yet if a state attempted to exercise popular sovereignty within its boundaries and leave the Union, our government would invade and likely drop a bomb on said state's most populous city.
Spot on.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:30 pm to Roger Klarvin
I made an argument, dude. The argument, which you pretended not to see, was that non-secedability was not drafted into the constitution.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:32 pm to baybeefeetz
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Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:33 pm to udtiger
Well I certainly understand much better now.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:34 pm to baybeefeetz
quote:
And I don’t give a shite about Texas v White.
Well allllllllllllllllllrighty, then
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:35 pm to baybeefeetz
Secession is not prohibited by the Constitution.
Therefore, it is legal under the 9th and 10th amendment.
A war does not amend the document.
Therefore, it is legal under the 9th and 10th amendment.
A war does not amend the document.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:36 pm to baybeefeetz
I tend to agree that states had (and probably still do have) the constitutional right to secede. But good luck with that. I also feel that the other non-seceding states have a constitutional right to protect their own Union interests by attempting to punish any state who tries it.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:42 pm to baybeefeetz
I think this needs to be addressed by a constitutional convention. The will be a time when the new radical leftists will have full control of government. Some states are not gonna want to be part of the looming insanity.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:43 pm to Rex
quote:
non-seceding states have a constitutional right to protect their own Union interests by attempting to punish any state who tries it.
Kind of like a husband can beat his wife for acting up, right?
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:47 pm to baybeefeetz
If you recite the pledge of allegiance, do the words, "one nation (under God) indivisible", mean anything to you?
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:48 pm to RollTide1987
quote:
federalism triumphed in the Civil War. That's why.
Posted on 11/20/18 at 8:50 pm to baybeefeetz
The USA is like a gang: once you in you can’t leave
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