re: Swamp Rat to testify "he didn't think Trump call was proper"

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Assume Trump's intent is to take out a political opponent and also assume that Biden used the influence of his office to end an investigation of his son.

Does the propriety of the investigation turn on Trump's subjective intent or Joe's actions?

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I assume both of those things are true, as I’ve said many times.

I believe 100% that Biden was not investigated at the time simply because Democrats were the Majority party at the time. By extension, I believe this investigation is 100% politically motivated.

My position was and is that these two instances are so incredibly similar that it borders on the ironic.

One way to go with it is to say “Biden (and a tremendous number of others), did it, but now you want to investigate and impeach Trump for doing the same thing?!”

I lean the other way and say “This was wrong in both cases, and both are worthy of a deeper look. If you want to hold the moral high ground, you have to hold yourself accountable.”

I’m not saying that he should be removed from office, I agree 100%!that would be circumventing the right of the people to choose their President. I’m just saying that there is nothing wrong with holding our elected officials (all of them), to an acceptable standard.

Let me ask you, seriously, super hypothetically, if it came out that Trump did in fact say something to the effect of “this guy is running for the President of the United States, and he’s a super corrupt guy and I need your help proving it”, would that be enough for you to say “whoa, ok, yeah, can’t do that.” Not saying you would want him out of office, just that you would want him censured in some way.

If all you are going to do is tell me to frick off, and not give a thoughtful response to that question, just go ahead and downvote next, I’ll know what you meant, and the thread won’t get cluttered.

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Let me ask you, seriously, super hypothetically, if it came out that Trump did in fact say something to the effect of “this guy is running for the President of the United States, and he’s a super corrupt guy and I need your help proving it”, would that be enough for you to say “whoa, ok, yeah, can’t do that.”

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We shouldn't want super corrupt guys running for president. They should be outed by whatever means necessary.

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demand

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Really? Did they read the same transcript that was FULLY published. There was a suggestion - Never a demand! Lying sack of shits.

Ukrainians officials have said over and over that it was not demanded.

Is this what this has devolved into? Impeachment testimony of peoples’ opinions on how the president is doing his job?

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Only a sith deals in absolutes

Private Message: Just to be clear are you still playing the part of a moderate who hates both parties?...Click here to remove this message.

You could just interact with me in a thread instead of banning me again because you think i'm a hypocrite

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So...no response.

And if you think I am an admin, that's proof of your stupidity.

Thank you for your thoughtful responses so far.

I don’t agree with the “any means necessary” position, but I certainly can appreciate how someone would feel that way.

Where was I in 2016? Voting for Trump. I know a lot of you are under the impression I’m a leftist Democrat, I assure you I am not. I’m a Republican that cannot get past Trump’s character flaws and behavior. I have never cast a vote for a Democratic politician, and don’t see any I would vote for now.

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Is this what this has devolved into? Impeachment testimony of peoples’ opinions on how the president is doing his job?

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Literally yes. The Talking Head Impeachment Inquiry supported by lay and/or potentially "expert" opinions of bureaucrats offering their opinions as to their disagreement with a President's foreign policies.

That’s bait dawg.

I could post my opinion of his behavior, and then I’ll get attacked because people don’t like my opinion, and we will just be in the same place as before. My opinion is not going to change anyone’s mind here, nor should it.

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I’m a Republican that cannot get past Trump’s character flaws and behavior. I have never cast a vote for a Democratic politician, and don’t see any I would vote for now.

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Get over it and appreciate that socialists have been slowed down and the Supreme court has been saved.

If dems win they will expand the court.

Think about the future. This is temporary pain.

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Just so long as you get past your objections long enough to vote for him in 2020.

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Ah, there is the rub. I have been, and will continue to struggle with that up to the election. I will not be casting a vote for a Democrat, but I don’t know if I can cast a vote for Trump. I want a Republican, but I don’t know if I can cast a vote again to say “this is the person I think should be the leader of the free world.”

I understand that is a cop (sp?) out, and that’s why I am struggling with it.

Regarding the sentiment of “get over it because look at the good he has done”, I can see the wisdom in that, but I would counter that any Republican would have put similar people of the bench and would be anti-socialism. I respect your opinion though if you feel anyone else might have been less effective.