re: Pope, we must avoid rigid ideologies

quote:

---

Of course Catholic believe God is the ultimate authority. Please resist the urge to exaggerate as people like Revelator will be easily deceived. The news of the day (many Bishops around the world have told Francis they will not implement his directive)
Attest to this fact.

---

I'd like to believe you but Rome teaches differently by its actions as well as its teachings, and I've explained how this is the case before. If Rome is the only authority that can identify Scripture and sacred tradition, and Rome is the only authority that can interpret Scripture and sacred tradition, then Rome makes itself out to be the ultimate authority, because you cannot disagree with her, even if it is by appealing to Scripture. I can argue with you until I'm blue in the face about the meanings of verses but at the end of the day, your appeal will always be "because the church has said". Whether that is the Pope or the Cardinals or the Councils or the Magisterium, the response is always the same: it's the authority of the Church that is ultimate in a very real and practical sense.

quote:

---

Humility, prayer, love. I hope to meet you on the other side. God bless you for your witness to Christ.

---

I hope that, too.

quote:

---

If Rome is the only authority that can identify Scripture and sacred tradition, and Rome is the only authority that can interpret Scripture and sacred tradition, then Rome makes itself out to be the ultimate authority, because you cannot disagree with her, even if it is by appealing to Scripture. I can argue with you until I'm blue in the face about the meanings of verses but at the end of the day, your appeal will always be "because the church has said". Whether that is the Pope or the Cardinals or the Councils or the Magisterium, the response is always the same: it's the authority of the Church that is ultimate in a very real and practical sense.

---

This.
And this is why you can’t debate with Catholics. Because the only answers they can ever provide don’t come from personal study, but from the official RCC position.

quote:

---

Foo, do you live locally?
I’m not part of the Reformed faith, but I have two friends who are both preachers in Reformed churches. Two great Godly men.

---

I moved away from Georgia some time ago now but head back from time to time to visit family. Glad to hear about your friends serving the Lord in that way. While I'm obviously preferential to the Reformed faith (I wouldn't adhere to it otherwise!), I'm glad that I have so many non-Reformed brothers and sisters in Christ willing to fight the good fight for the truth of the gospel. Thank you for your contributions on this forum, in particular

quote:

---

Fact! Mary is the Mother of God since she gave birth to the Second Person of The Blessed Trinity. Mary is referred to as the "New Eve" since she undid the damage done by Eve - namely disobeying God. Did you know that scientist have discovered that every single human being possesses a single common gene - thus pointing to common parentage? So my friend, you can pound your head in frustration at us Catholics for loving Our Blessed Mother, but in truth, she's your mother too. I leave you with the salutation the Angel Gabriel made upon announcing Mary was chosen to be the Mother of God......

---

To me, this Maryology that permeates the Catholic Church is one of its most egregious sins.
They take one or two verses in the Bible and construct an entire backstory of why Mary needs to be venerated. They go so far as saying Mary was sinless, Mary ascended into heaven, Mary never had sexual relations, Mary is a co-medatrix, etc.
All of this when the Bible does everything possible to make sure Mary’s status isn’t elevated beyond its proper place.
But instead, the RCC puts her in a place of adoration where she is given the praise and worship only due God though Jesus Christ.

quote:

---

Are you arguing the case that having several different interpretations of any particular Bible passage is a good thing?

---

I’m arguing that no one denomination has a stranglehold on all truth

quote:

---

False. Rome declared that a heresy in the 6th century.

---

Semi-pelagianism is another term for a synergistic view of justification.

Pelagianism teaches that man's will was not affected by the fall and that mankind can achieve perfection through is own perfect obedience. Clearly that is false and was declared as such.

Calvinism (the Bible, really) teaches that the fall of man impacted all of man's being, including and especially his will, so that he cannot please God through good works to attain justification in God's sight by his own merits.

Semi-pelagianism is a term used in the last few hundred yeas that refers to that middle ground of the will of man, where man's will is certainly affected by the fall but is given grace by God to be able to use his free will to obey God by coming to faith. Prevenient grace is the method God uses to effect that ability.

The reason why it's often times called semi-pelagianism is because the practical teaching is that man has the ability in himself to trust in Christ according to his own free will. It's the freedom of the will that is emphasized here.

quote:

---

*Calvinists

---

Calvinists were the original Protestants (or at least those holding to the doctrines of grace which are symbolized by Calivinism in our day), but yes, it is primarily Calvinists that are still in this camp. There are a lot of inconsistent Arminians in this camp, too, though. They are also Protestants. They'll never say that we are saved by grace and works because they don't hold to the Catholic view of justification.

quote:

---

Catholicism rightly defines justification as a process, just as it was attributed as a process in reference to Abraham, who was justified several times in scripture, not just once.

---

Justification in soteriology is a legal declaration of being "right" or "just" before God. Abraham's justification was a one-time event that was effective when he first believed God's promise to him of a nation and lineage. The justification James speaks of, for instance, is Abraham's proving of his faith by works of obedience. The context of James is proving a saving faith with good works (not adding good works as its own meritorious act of justification before God).

Abraham was justified and declared righteous (with Christ's righteousness applied to his account) one time.

quote:

---

Rome teaches that God and His Grace does all the saving, but we must freely respond to that Grace.

Calvinism first begins with the assumption that monergism is correct, and then eisegetically reads the scriptures through that lens.

Free-will/synergism is a fact derived from the Scriptures.

---

Total depravity is the starting point in TULIP for a reason. If we are dead in our sins (Eph. 2:1) and dead men cannot do anything but rot and stink, then we don't have the free will to respond to the gospel. So Calvinism is monergistic because total depravity is taught in the Scriptures, so the rest of TULIP logically follows from there.

Rome teaches that cooperation through obedience is how we contribute to our own salvation. That's synergistic and denies our ability to do anything apart from the work of God in us.

quote:

---

So righteousness is a legal fiction in Calvinism.

---

A legal reality, yes. Christ had to bear our sins on the cross, did He not? How could He do that if He was perfectly sinless? Through imputation of guilt. He took our guilt on Himself and in return, He credits us with His righteousness. We are legally declared righteous just as He was legally declared a sinner for our sake, though He wasn't actually a sinner. We aren't actually righteous in our flesh at this time because we are sinners and still commit actual sins. When we die, we will be glorified and be incapable of sinning any longer. At that time we will be actually righteous, not just declared righteous.

quote:

---

There is no such thing as saving faith without works. The Bible explicitly says so. Works and faith (and baptism) are different parts of the same flower, and that flower is Grace

---

Grace is not a synonym for justification. Like I said, both justification and sanctification are acts of God's grace, but justification and sanctification are not the same thing. Rome essentially makes them the same thing.

Good works do not justify us. They prove our justification. That's a critically important distinction. If I take a shower and use fragrant soap and shampoo, then I will smell like that fragrance after I am clean. The fragrance is an evidence that I've showered and am clean, but the fragrance isn't the reason why I'm clean (the soap and water were). Works are the fragrance that proves that we've been washed by the blood of Christ; they aren't the cause of our washing.

quote:

---

*All Christians except for Calvinists and some baptists/Evangelicals

---

Again, not necessarily. I've known a lot of inconsistent Arminians that still say "once saved, always saved".

quote:

---

They go so far as saying Mary was sinless,

---

Immaculate Conception, baw. She was sinless at the moment of conception. (How can this be, since I know not a man? - Luke 1:34) I can provide all kinds of evidence to support this fundamental Truth, but you will not accept it. So I'll just say - worship Baby Jesus this Christmas and pray (instead of cursing) Catholics and I'll do the same for you.

Fair enough?

quote:

---

Immaculate Conception, baw. She was sinless at the moment of conception. (How can this be, since I know not a man? -

---

How do you get sinless from her being a virgin? Plus Catholics don’t just believe Mary was sinless at conception, but sinless her entire life.

quote:

---

instead of cursing) Catholics

---

Haven’t cursed one

quote:

---

Because Almighty God bestowed that Honor upon her.

---

I was asking him why he equated being a virgin with being sinless?
One can be a virgin and still a sinner.

quote:

---

I was asking him why he equated being a virgin with being sinless?
One can be a virgin and still a sinner.

---

The Catholics around here have linked you to many very good explanations of the Catholic Doctrine of Immaculate Conception of Mary. We KNOW that you disagree with it. WHY do you again and again voice your disagreement on this particular issue? Move on from it. Otherwise it just seems like you are on the attack.