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re: Not a word about Custer
Posted on 6/25/17 at 9:47 pm to WhiskeyPapa
Posted on 6/25/17 at 9:47 pm to WhiskeyPapa
Had Custer followed orders the massacre never happens. Gen. Terry told him to wait and link with his force but he rode to glory.
Had he not split the force he had they very well could have held out. Not to mention had he brought the Gatlings. There would have been a massacre just the same, but the Indians would have been cut to pieces.
Had he not split the force he had they very well could have held out. Not to mention had he brought the Gatlings. There would have been a massacre just the same, but the Indians would have been cut to pieces.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 9:52 pm to WhiskeyPapa
I understand a few people might not have heard of Custer...
mostly a few millennials - who were given an education based on feels.
So Custer was probably cut out of the curriculum.
You should sue your schools...they didn't give you an education; they gave you an indoctrination.
I mean honestly; if you don't know Custer's Last Stand...you are totally out of touch with not even American history but American pop culture history. That's like not knowing what the hell this is all about:
mostly a few millennials - who were given an education based on feels.
So Custer was probably cut out of the curriculum.
You should sue your schools...they didn't give you an education; they gave you an indoctrination.
I mean honestly; if you don't know Custer's Last Stand...you are totally out of touch with not even American history but American pop culture history. That's like not knowing what the hell this is all about:
Posted on 6/25/17 at 9:54 pm to antibarner
quote:
Had he not split the force he had they very well could have held out.
There's a book out there that said that was the smart thing to do at the time...forget the title.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 9:56 pm to WhiskeyPapa
He got what was coming to him.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 10:01 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
quote:
Had he not split the force he had they very well could have held out. There's a book out there that said that was the smart thing to do at the time...forget the title.
According to The Last Stand by Philbrick (and maybe others) Custer's plan was to get a force into the village. The size didn't matter. Based on his experience on the Washita in 1868, the warriors would leave him alone if he had hostages.
-That- makes his actions make sense.
He was on the cusp of making that happen, when he was shot outside the village and his force driven off.
The Indians quickly massed on his force and wiped it out.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 10:17 pm to TupeloTiger
There was no reasonable position by the time he was overwhelmed. He was against a vastly underestimated force of Sioux. They thought that they were going against the 800 or so Sioux who had not come into the reservation that year. The "resistors." What they did not know is that Sitting Bull had mustered all of the reservation Sioux who had been allowed to leave the reservation for the annual buffalo hunt. Just weeks prior to the battle, Sitting Bull was able to muster over 1800 additional Reservation Sioux to fight. Custer did not know he would be engaged in battle with them. His fatal error was a lack of good intelligence on the situation. When he split his regiment into three columns with him leading one and Benteen and Reno leading the others, he had doomed them before it even started. The Lakota Sioux and their Cheyenne allies were waiting for the attack on the heels of the smaller skirmishes that had taken place in the preceding weeks. Reno's command was blind to what they were approaching as there were hills that separated their (what was supposed to be a don't allow any escape) route from the main enormous Sioux camp. By the time they emerged from the back of the hill into view of the camp, the Sioix were there in force waiting for them. They were attacked by an overwhelming force and tried to retreat back across the field and the creek to higher ground but only a small number made it to temporary safety. Many were killed in close quarter combat in the creek and on the opposite bank. Those that did get across were lucky to merge with Benteens command just as they were coming up from the Southern cut off route. Benteen had heard the battle and had moved to join Reno's. At this point, they circled the wagons atop the bluff and held off the Sioux attack. Most of the Sioux attacking Benteen and Reno at first left to join Crazy Horse and his hundreds who were engaged with Custer to the North. Custer was in the worst position imaginable. Isolated with no support and under attack by at least 1000 Sioux and no real avenue for escape. Benteen and Reno continued their defense against but a remnant of the overall Sioux/Cheyenne force even after hearing the battle that was being waged across the hills from their bluff. In fact, they didn't even know that Custers entire command had been slaughtered until days later.
The fact is a gross miscalculation of the enemies strength doomed the regiment from the start.
The fact is a gross miscalculation of the enemies strength doomed the regiment from the start.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 10:49 pm to Dick Leverage
I also read a really long book on the subject.
It said the Indians really didn't like the black guys attached to the Army, was a black guy that drove a supply wagon with Benteen or the other guy, they cut his penis off and left it in his mouth (post death mutilation).
and I never heard of counting coup before I read the book either, said same black guy begged them not to count coup on him. It wasn't torture or anything, they's just ride up and touch their opponent, which was pretty ballsy.
It was a very thorough book, wish I could remmeber the name.
It said the Indians really didn't like the black guys attached to the Army, was a black guy that drove a supply wagon with Benteen or the other guy, they cut his penis off and left it in his mouth (post death mutilation).
and I never heard of counting coup before I read the book either, said same black guy begged them not to count coup on him. It wasn't torture or anything, they's just ride up and touch their opponent, which was pretty ballsy.
It was a very thorough book, wish I could remmeber the name.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 11:00 pm to WhiskeyPapa
I would have more respect for him is he'd lead a bayonet charge into the face of the enemy.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 11:15 pm to WhiskeyPapa
Obviously the plan did not work. Had he been with Benteen and Reno they probably fight the Sioux off IMO.
Had they all been with Terry they crush the Sioux.
Had they all been with Terry they crush the Sioux.
This post was edited on 6/25/17 at 11:23 pm
Posted on 6/25/17 at 11:23 pm to WhiskeyPapa
Custer was an absolute idiot.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 11:48 pm to cajunbama
quote:
Custer was an absolute idiot.
How would you know?
Granted he was bottom of his class at West Point.
But bottom of your class at West Point and everybody else in 1860 is night and day.
But to entertain your point, at least provide facts:
In his four years at West Point, Custer amassed a record-total of 726 demerits, one of the worst conduct records in the history of the academy.
A fellow cadet recalled Custer as declaring there were only two places in a class, the head and the foot, and since he had no desire to be the head, he aspired to be the foot.
Posted on 6/25/17 at 11:54 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
Being a good engineer didn't make you a good and competent officer.
Posted on 6/26/17 at 12:55 am to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
History books. And he got his men and himself slaughtered.
Posted on 6/26/17 at 1:38 am to WhiskeyPapa
Custer's arrogance was only matched by his inability to think strategically. Like the other people in this thread, Custer would not even make my top 10 list.
If you want the most famous soldier (not a general), then Sgt. York, Audie Murphy, & Pappy Boyington all come to mind.
If you want the most famous soldier (not a general), then Sgt. York, Audie Murphy, & Pappy Boyington all come to mind.
Posted on 6/26/17 at 1:44 am to chickenpotpie
quote:
If you want the most famous soldier (not a general), then Sgt. York, Audie Murphy, & Pappy Boyington all come to mind.
The man on the street is not going to know them better than Custer. And Boyington wasn't a soldier. But he did have a TV show.
Posted on 6/26/17 at 2:01 am to WhiskeyPapa
Go back to bed Walt. Its way past your bedtime.
Posted on 6/26/17 at 5:29 am to beerJeep
Custer and his brother (Tom) both "Let us say, not a type person one should not look up too".
Tom was known for his mistreat of prisoners and one Indian (Rain-in-the-Face) he went to far with was very likely the one that killed him at the Little Big Horn.
I have over 30 books on the battle and will say:
Myles Keogh is the only body not mutilated.
C company Lt. Harry Harrington is the person that almost got away.
Mitch Bouyer is the person that the Indians talked about the most, being one of the last persons killed in the charge to the river off the hill towards the Deep Ravine at the end of the battle.
The last soldier killed near the Deep Ravine is a Sgt, I can look up his name.
You still have 2 side of the fight, Benteen defenders and the Custer defenders.
Blaming Reno and Benteen by the Custer faction goes out of the way to come up with theories that do not fit the facts, Custer spilt his command into 4 columns in the face of over welling numbers of Indians and none of the smaller 3 combat commands had the power to fight the number of Indians there that day.
Tom was known for his mistreat of prisoners and one Indian (Rain-in-the-Face) he went to far with was very likely the one that killed him at the Little Big Horn.
I have over 30 books on the battle and will say:
Myles Keogh is the only body not mutilated.
C company Lt. Harry Harrington is the person that almost got away.
Mitch Bouyer is the person that the Indians talked about the most, being one of the last persons killed in the charge to the river off the hill towards the Deep Ravine at the end of the battle.
The last soldier killed near the Deep Ravine is a Sgt, I can look up his name.
You still have 2 side of the fight, Benteen defenders and the Custer defenders.
Blaming Reno and Benteen by the Custer faction goes out of the way to come up with theories that do not fit the facts, Custer spilt his command into 4 columns in the face of over welling numbers of Indians and none of the smaller 3 combat commands had the power to fight the number of Indians there that day.
Posted on 6/26/17 at 6:02 am to WhiskeyPapa
quote:
How could another June 25 pass without remembering America's most famous serial killers?
Fify
Posted on 6/26/17 at 6:12 am to Snipe
When most think of Indians, they think of Sioux. Yet that tribe moved west from Minnesota, taking hunting territory from other tribes. And they wouldn't have been who they were without horses brought to America by Spainiards. Badass bunch, though. Sitting Bull was much more interesting than Custer.
Posted on 6/26/17 at 6:40 am to EKG
quote:
I'd go with Washington, Lee, Grant, Eisenhower, and/or Patton
Douglas MacArthur is going to come back to life and kick your arse, baw.
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