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Started By
Message
Nature: Cochrane Collaboration (evidence-based) rife with "top-down authoritarian culture"
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:35 am
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:35 am
For those who think "science" is infallible...
The search for truth can be corrupted by some ($$$ and ideology)
Zoom out and understand that many layers of deception are falling by the wayside...
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-06727-0
The search for truth can be corrupted by some ($$$ and ideology)
Zoom out and understand that many layers of deception are falling by the wayside...
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-06727-0
quote:
NEWS 17 SEPTEMBER 2018
UPDATE 17 SEPTEMBER 2018 CORRECTION 19 SEPTEMBER 2018
Mass resignation guts board of prestigious Cochrane Collaboration
Governing board of the evidence-based medicine group may now be dissolved entirely.
quote:
The board of the Cochrane Collaboration, a prestigious group that reviews health evidence, has been reduced from 13 to 6 members, following a controversial vote to expel a member for the first time in its 25-year existence.
On 14 September, Peter Gøtzsche, director of the Cochrane’s Nordic centre and a member of its governing board, posted a statement on the centre’s website announcing that he had been expelled as a member of the Cochrane Collaboration, after a vote by 6 of 13 of the board’s members.
quote:
Gøtzsche says that no justification was given for the expulsion but that he was accused by the board of bringing the organization into “disrepute”. The organization — which carries out systematic reviews of health-care interventions — told Nature it had received “numerous complaints” about Gøtzsche after the publication earlier this year of a critique he co-authored, entitled ‘The Cochrane HPV vaccine review was incomplete and ignored important evidence of bias’ and published in the BMJ Evidence-Based Medicine.
quote:
Gøtzsche’s statement says that there is a “growing top-down authoritarian culture and an increasingly commercial business model” taking root at Cochrane that “threaten the scientific, moral and social objectives of the organization”?. He has also been an outspoken critic of Cochrane’s relationship with the pharmaceutical industry. (Cochrane’s policies state that its reviews cannot be “funded or conducted by commercial sponsors or commercial sources with a real or potential vested interest in the findings of a specific review”.)
David Hammerstein Mintz, a board member who stepped down in protest, said some members thought that Gøtzsche’s critical views of Cochrane were “disloyal”. (Nature has approached the collaboration for comment on these points and is awaiting its response.) “It might have been a headache, but the harm done by expelling Peter is much greater than any inconvenience caused by scientific debate,” he says.
This post was edited on 9/25/18 at 8:43 am
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:37 am to ThinePreparedAni
Recently some major established labs have been going back through medical and social science seminal papers to try and reproduce the results.
Less than 15% reproducible.
Just wait till we get to the natural sciences.
Less than 15% reproducible.
Just wait till we get to the natural sciences.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:38 am to CptBengal
quote:
Just wait till we get to the natural sciences.
TRUTH incoming
What a great time to be alive...
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:40 am to ThinePreparedAni
I'm actually shifting a part of my lab and research budget into testing papers that are highly cited in my field. First 2 are already dead wrong. Major errors in each. Worst showed a systemic error which UNDERaccounted a variable by 124.6 percent
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:42 am to ThinePreparedAni
This is disheartening. As I was responsible for Pharmacy and Therapeutics meetings at 2 hospitals, I have depended on Cochrane reviews. It helped drive decisions on formulary additions that affected thousands of patients.
More sad news. More frightening news. Where are we going as a nation and a world?
More sad news. More frightening news. Where are we going as a nation and a world?
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:44 am to IslandBuckeye
quote:
More sad news. More frightening news. Where are we going as a nation and a world?
For years you had a lot of people decide that a paper that showed a strong p value was worth fudging data...because they would get a fellowship, tenure, promotion, bonus, etc.
These weren't scientists. They are filth
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:46 am to IslandBuckeye
quote:
I have depended on Cochrane reviews. It helped drive decisions on formulary additions that affected thousands of patients.
bullshite in, bullshite out
In spirit, it is a great tool
In reality, if you have overwhelming corporate sponsored papers inflating the database pool (while "negative" studies are withheld/not published) you get a skew in the data. It is easier to create an outcome that may be favorable to an "agenda"
Again, it boils down to searching for the truth
Posted on 9/25/18 at 8:55 am to ThinePreparedAni
Yep. Health studies are particularly susceptible to nonscience and antiscience (aka "bad" science, which is categorically no science at all) and corruption. Confirmation bias, ideological contamination, and $$$$$ don't mix well with an already fundamentally difficult field.
Epidemiology and observational studies are by their nature rife with dumb correlations and bad data from partipant questionnaires.
Also, rodents', and other mammals', even primates', physiologies differ from humans significantly. And double-blind, properly controlled, well-designed human trials have significant ethical, legal and practical limitations.
That's why we end up with numerous sets of competing health dogma, which ultimately fail.
People need (edit: want, rather) certainty or to just say frick it.
Epidemiology and observational studies are by their nature rife with dumb correlations and bad data from partipant questionnaires.
Also, rodents', and other mammals', even primates', physiologies differ from humans significantly. And double-blind, properly controlled, well-designed human trials have significant ethical, legal and practical limitations.
That's why we end up with numerous sets of competing health dogma, which ultimately fail.
People need (edit: want, rather) certainty or to just say frick it.
This post was edited on 9/25/18 at 8:57 am
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:12 am to CptBengal
CptBengal - what is your field of research? just curious, a lot of my work is in basic sciences.
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:16 am to CptBengal
so... statistics? bioinformatics?
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:18 am to IslandBuckeye
Doesn’t surprise me at all.
Science is what you want it to be
And this makes evidence based medicine a very shaky thing.
Science is what you want it to be
And this makes evidence based medicine a very shaky thing.
This post was edited on 9/25/18 at 9:20 am
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:20 am to ThinePreparedAni
Can someone ELI5. Did Cochrane expel the "Real" scientists in pursuit of more ideological pursuits? Or are they clearing the ideological scientists from the board?
Posted on 9/25/18 at 9:39 am to Lima Whiskey
quote:
And this makes evidence based medicine a very shaky thing.
yep. the funny thing is, people poo-poo n=1 data but then are totally fine with questionnaire-based observational studies.
The cool thing about n=1 data, is that today's information technology, availability of cheap lab tests (I'm always touting walkinlab.com for e.g.) and social networks make it easy to compile and analyze MANY n=1s, in a way that is at LEAST as reliable as most questionnaire-based analysis.
Posted on 10/20/18 at 11:15 am to ThinePreparedAni
Posting here to show the influence of championing an idea (and the long term, downstream implications)
For your scrutiny
Stay healthy PT
Question “dogma” and “settled science”. See sig quote...
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/18/science/cancer-genetic-mutations.html
We are not slaves to our genetics
The way you “play your sheet of music” matters immensely:
The fricking hubris
“He” / geneticists have a pronoun problem, don’t believe me:
LINK
They discovered the concept of DNA while in an altered state on LSD (look it up...)
Don’t be domain dependent folks...
Question everything...
quote:
Bernard avait raison. Le germe n'est rien, c'est le terrain qui est tout.'
('Bernard was right. The microbe is nothing, the soil is everything.')
Louis Pasteur to Claude Bernard...
For your scrutiny
Stay healthy PT
Question “dogma” and “settled science”. See sig quote...
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/18/science/cancer-genetic-mutations.html
quote:
Researchers Explore a Cancer Paradox Healthy cells carry a surprising number of cancer-linked mutations, but they don’t turn into tumors. What’s holding them back?
By Carl Zimmer
Oct. 18, 2018
Cancer
quote:
The study also raised questions about efforts to detect cancer at its earliest stages, when cancer cells are still rare, Dr. Kennedy said: “Just because someone has mutations associated with cancer doesn’t mean actually they have a malignancy.”
We are not slaves to our genetics
The way you “play your sheet of music” matters immensely:
quote:
Cancer is a disease of mutations. Tumor cells are riddled with genetic mutations not found in healthy cells. Scientists estimate that it takes five to 10 key mutations for a healthy cell to become cancerous.
Some of these mutations can be caused by assaults from the environment, such as ultraviolet rays and cigarette smoke. Others arise from harmful molecules produced by the cells themselves. In recent years, researchers have begun taking a closer look at these mutations, to try to understand how they arise in healthy cells, and what causes these cells to later erupt into full-blown cancer. The research has produced some major surprises. For instance, it turns out that a large portion of the cells in healthy people carry far more mutations than expected, including some mutations thought to be the prime drivers of cancer. These mutations make a cell grow faster than others, raising the question of why full-blown cancer isn’t far more common.
“This is quite a fundamental piece of biology that we were unaware of,” said Inigo Martincorena, a geneticist at the Wellcome Sanger Institute in Cambridge, England.
The fricking hubris
“He” / geneticists have a pronoun problem, don’t believe me:
LINK
quote:
An Old Idea, Revived:
Starve Cancer to Death
In the early 20th century, the German biochemist Otto Warburg
believed that tumors could be treated by disrupting their source
of energy. His idea was dismissed for decades — until now.
BY SAM APPLEMAY 12, 2016
quote:
The story of modern cancer research begins, somewhat improbably, with the sea urchin. In the first decade of the 20th century, the German biologist Theodor Boveri discovered that if he fertilized sea-urchin eggs with two sperm rather than one, some of the cells would end up with the wrong number of chromosomes and fail to develop properly. It was the era before modern genetics, but Boveri was aware that cancer cells, like the deformed sea urchin cells, had abnormal chromosomes; whatever caused cancer, he surmised, had something to do with chromosomes.
Today Boveri is celebrated for discovering the origins of cancer, but another German scientist, Otto Warburg, was studying sea-urchin eggs around the same time as Boveri. His research, too, was hailed as a major breakthrough in our understanding of cancer. But in the following decades, Warburg’s discovery would largely disappear from the cancer narrative, his contributions considered so negligible that they were left out of textbooks altogether.
quote:
In the years following his breakthrough, Warburg became convinced that the Warburg effect occurs because cells are unable to use oxygen properly and that this damaged respiration is, in effect, the starting point of cancer. Well into the 1950s, this theory — which Warburg believed in until his death in 1970 but never proved — remained an important subject of debate within the field. And then, more quickly than anyone could have anticipated, the debate ended. In 1953, James Watson and Francis Crick pieced together the structure of the DNA molecule and set the stage for the triumph of molecular biology’s gene-centered approach to cancer. In the following decades, scientists came to regard cancer as a disease governed by mutated genes, which drive cells into a state of relentless division and proliferation. The metabolic catalysts that Warburg spent his career analyzing began to be referred to as “housekeeping enzymes” — necessary to keep a cell going but largely irrelevant to the deeper story of cancer.
They discovered the concept of DNA while in an altered state on LSD (look it up...)
quote:
But over the past decade, and the past five years in particular, something unexpected happened: Those housekeeping enzymes have again become one of the most promising areas of cancer research. Scientists now wonder if metabolism could prove to be the long-sought “Achilles’ heel” of cancer, a common weak point in a disease that manifests itself in so many different forms. There are typically many mutations in a single cancer. But there are a limited number of ways that the body can produce energy and support rapid growth. Cancer cells rely on these fuels in a way that healthy cells don’t. The hope of scientists at the forefront of the Warburg revival is that they will be able to slow — or even stop — tumors by disrupting one or more of the many chemical reactions a cell uses to proliferate, and, in the process, starve cancer cells of the nutrients they desperately need to grow.
quote:
Even James Watson, one of the fathers of molecular biology, is convinced that targeting metabolism is a more promising avenue in current cancer research than gene-centered approaches. At his office at the Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory in Long Island, Watson, 88, sat beneath one of the original sketches of the DNA molecule and told me that locating the genes that cause cancer has been “remarkably unhelpful” — the belief that sequencing your DNA is going to extend your life “a cruel illusion.” If he were going into cancer research today, Watson said, he would study biochemistry rather than molecular biology. “I never thought, until about two months ago, I’d ever have to learn the Krebs cycle,” he said, referring to the reactions, familiar to most high-school biology students, by which a cell powers itself. “Now I realize I have to.”
Don’t be domain dependent folks...
Question everything...
Posted on 10/20/18 at 11:16 am to ThinePreparedAni
Continued:
Profoundly important article for those who understand the implications:
Save yourself
Those who should “know better” have too much pride to course correct...
quote:
Craig Thompson, the president and chief executive of the Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center, has been among the most outspoken proponents of this renewed focus on metabolism. In Thompson’s analogy, the Warburg effect can be thought of as a social failure: a breakdown of the nutrient-sharing agreement that single-celled organisms signed when they joined forces to become multicellular organisms. His research showed that cells need to receive instructions from other cells to eat, just as they require instructions from other cells to divide.
Thompson hypothesized that if he could identify the mutations that lead a cell to eat more glucose than it should, it would go a long way toward explaining how the Warburg effect and cancer begin. But Thompson’s search for those mutations didn’t lead to an entirely new discovery. Instead, it led him to AKT, a gene already well known to molecular biologists for its role in promoting cell division. Thompson now believes AKT plays an even more fundamental role in metabolism. The protein created by AKT is part of a chain of signaling proteins that is mutated in up to 80 percent of all cancers. Thompson says that once these proteins go into overdrive, a cell no longer worries about signals from other cells to eat; it instead stuffs itself with glucose. Thompson discovered he could induce the “full Warburg effect” simply by placing an activated AKT protein into a normal cell. When that happens, Thompson says, the cells begin to do what every single-celled organism will do in the presence of food: eat as much as it can and make as many copies of itself as possible. When Thompson presents his research to high-school students, he shows them a slide of mold spreading across a piece of bread. The slide’s heading — “Everyone’s first cancer experiment” — recalls Warburg’s observation that cancer cells will carry out fermentation at almost the same rate of wildly growing yeasts.
quote:
Given Warburg’s own story of historical neglect, it’s fitting that what may turn out to be one of the most promising cancer metabolism drugs has been sitting in plain sight for decades. That drug, metformin, is already widely prescribed to decrease the glucose in the blood of diabetics (76.9 million metformin prescriptions were filled in the United States in 2014). In the years ahead, it’s likely to be used to treat — or at least to prevent — some cancers. Because metformin can influence a number of metabolic pathways, the precise mechanism by which it achieves its anticancer effects remains a source of debate. But the results of numerous epidemiological studies have been striking. Diabetics taking metformin seem to be significantly less likely to develop cancer than diabetics who don’t — and significantly less likely to die from the disease when they do. Near the end of his life, Warburg grew obsessed with his diet. He believed that most cancer was preventable and thought that chemicals added to food and used in agriculture could cause tumors by interfering with respiration. He stopped eating bread unless it was baked in his own home. He would drink milk only if it came from a special herd of cows, and used a centrifuge at his lab to make his cream and butter. Warburg’s personal diet is unlikely to become a path to prevention. But the Warburg revival has allowed researchers to develop a hypothesis for how the diets that are linked to our obesity and diabetes epidemics — specifically, sugar-heavy diets that can result in permanently elevated levels of the hormone insulin — may also be driving cells to the Warburg effect and cancer.
quote:
During Warburg’s lifetime, insulin’s effects on metabolic pathways were even less well understood. But given his ego, it’s highly unlikely that he would have considered the possibility that anything other than damaged respiration could cause cancer. He died sure that he was right about the disease. Warburg framed a quote from Max Planck and hung it above his desk: “A new scientific truth does not triumph by convincing its opponents and making them see the light, but rather because its opponents eventually die.”
Profoundly important article for those who understand the implications:
Save yourself
Those who should “know better” have too much pride to course correct...
Posted on 10/20/18 at 11:42 am to CptBengal
quote:
Recently some major established labs have been going back through medical and social science seminal papers to try and reproduce the results.
Less than 15% reproducible.
Just wait till we get to the natural sciences.
This was the 1st thing that I thought of when I saw the OP. It is now clear that much of what we thought was settled science was actually based on incomplete, improperly applied, or just straight up wrong research.
Posted on 10/20/18 at 11:48 am to ThinePreparedAni
Junk research is published because somebody is paying for it and somebody needs a salary. There are countless Ph.D. researchers pumping out junk because there is grant money (and their salary) attached to it. Too many people with Ph.D's that shouldn't have them too but academia is addicted to cheap labor.
Posted on 10/20/18 at 12:04 pm to CptBengal
quote:
I'm actually shifting a part of my lab and research budget into testing papers that are highly cited in my field. First 2 are already dead wrong. Major errors in each. Worst showed a systemic error which UNDERaccounted a variable by 124.6 percent
Would you say the largest flaw or I should say the largest area to go wrong in research science is the process of data acquisition, measurement reliability and data interpretation?
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